Ved

Tried watching it and had to turn over after I saw the poor dog at the start convulsing. I hate this sort of stuff and would lose my rag with anyone doing this stuff on purpose. I'd never buy a dog from a breeder ever mainly down to them being in it for money which is just wrong. All our dogs have come from families having pups and we've had no problems at all - plus they've been cheap

dpb

And i tell you what people will still actuallly believe that putting their name down on a waiting list and paying a deposit kennel club certified whatever means theyre buying a dog which is going to last longer than your average mongrel out a dogs home


- Friend my mothers had a line of peckingese , the poor little sh*ts could hardly breath without sneezing

Lee247

I've been out tonight, but my kids watched this and said it was really upsetting.

Luckily for us, we got our GSD from a reputable breeder recommended by someone on here who I have complete trust in.

Saying that, she has shown no interest at all in the dog since we got him. The breeder of our cats is in contact at least once every 6 months just to see how they are doing.

Glad I was boozing rather than watching

Lee247

That was why I said I used a breeder recommended by someone on here, who I trust, Nat

little-ginge

I was horrifed by this programme and was actually in tears when they showed the boxer having epileptic fits

It is stunning that the Kennel club allows these things to continue. Inbreeding mother to father, brother to sister or grandfather to granddaughter, is horrific. I was glad the reporter asked the aquestion along the same lines I was thinking when I saw the show 'would you breed your daughter to your son..'
The guy replied that wasn't the issue.. er I think it is!! just because it isn't a human doesn't mean we can do what we like with it's breeding.It's illegal in humans and so it should be in everything else too

The breeders who put down dogs such as the ridgeback when they have no ridge, or as we learnt when we had our white boxer pup many years ago.. put down the white ones as they are not deemed 'breed standards'.. and the woman whos King Charles Spaniel had syringomyelia when the dogs skull is too small for the brain(thats what the spaniel shown convusling had) who refused to comment when question that her dog had been diagnosed with the condition.. but admitted that he had been breed a small number of times.. which was later revealed to be 34 times - 26 time since the diagnosis was made. she needs to be banned from owning animals

It's good that the KC have implemented things such as the accreditation scheme, but that is a small step in a huge journey they MUST make. Changing the so called breed standards would be a good place to start,

Lee247

I'll have a word with my Son, his mate has a King Charles and he is a beauty. I'll try to get the breeders name for you May come to nothing but worth a try.

little-ginge

The Kennel CLub seem to be of the stance that at least with the way things are at the moment, they can contact the breeders as they are registered with them. If they were to change things, the breeders would leave the kennel club, and breed without a governing body as such.

so bloody what? Let them leave, and let the people who breed ethically, morally and for the best of the breed lineage remain. People will still buy off them, yes - jesus, stupid naive people still buy from puppy farms , but the breeders would not be recognised as 'true breeders' and as such would not be supported.

Lee247

I reiterate, I am really pleased I was at the pub. Being as soft as muck, I would have been having nightmares tonight, by the sound of things

little-ginge

People like that should not be allowed to hold titles such as 'chairman of the breed' etc.. can they not see that in the long run they are damaging the breed, creating pain and suffering for the animals inbred into the breed, and yet still endangering the breed itself?

I cant remember which dog it was - was it the pug? who is more endangered than a Giant Panda???!!!

In a breed 'stock' of 10,000 only 50 remain true breed

mykp

A truly upsetting program if you a dog lover.

with regard to the breeders moving away from the KC then who would loose out the most if this happened? The KC as there would be no monies coming in from these breeders.

The practice of inbreeding is banned in some dog breed clubs already. The breed committee see that this is prevented.

I found some of the comments from some of the women disgusting, culling animals because they dont meet some written standard like they where rejects in a factory is barbaric.

A real eye opener.

Funkii Munkii

The KC tried defending themselves on 5Live later in the evening but they got nowhere fast, when suggested they could warn all breeders that inbreeding can cause these types of genetic problems (defects) and the practise should cease, they always shyed away saying there was no real evidence and how it went unreported in the documentary that they had given £10,000 toward research in the case of the King Charles Spaniels. He argued that the KC was concerned about the health of the animals and when in show they did check their health, but when pressed on the issue of checking their health it came down to the dogs "looking" healthy, FFS what are these people on ?

More horrible stories being related on 5Live as to the practises some of these breeders, it seems it all boils down to asthetics and greed.

David Lock

We've owned and adored Cavaliers for 25 years so you can imagine how upsetting it was to watch this programme. We have two now, 11 and 12, who are in good shape although one has a very slight heart murmur. We always knew about the heart thing with Cavaliers but this awful brain problem just didn't seem to exist a few years ago.

I thought the attitude of the KC and many breeders was simply appalling. I think the KC has an awful lot to answer for. Like the Ridgeback example quoted above; the ridge is actually due to a spinal deformity but is part of the breed standard. And there was a breed with a "spiral" tail - looked nice but only achieved because of spinal twisting.

But the programme left you wondering where to turn for help and advice. When/if we get another Cavalier where do we go? It's hard to trust a breeder any more and the KC have their collective head stuck up their ****. Maybe one of the campaigning groups provide advice?

And the incestuous breeding - unbelievable that this goes on quite legitimately.

Truly horrific. Well done Beeb for showing the facts.

david

OllyK

Not ALL pedigree breeders are like that though. When we bought our Rough Collie, we were given free choice from the litter and the pup was tested for hearing, vision and couple of other things that can affect collies by the breeder. She still keeps in regular contact with us to see how he's doing.

Also roughs have an issue if you breed 2 blue merles together, the offspring is usually blind and almost pure white, certainly nothing like the breed standard, but again, the breeder we bought our dog from had a couple that she cared for as she said she couldn't put an otherwise healthy dog down.

Yes the general public need to know about what goes on and they need to ask questions of the breeders. If they are not happy and vote with their feet then a major income source is lost for the breeder.

mrtheedge2u2

When we bought our Border Collie we got it from a local farmer to where we lived at the time (North Yorkshire)

She had a healthy and great life.

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

yes was the pug, out of approx 10,000 in the uk they reckon only 50 are pure and all the others are inbred.
The vet had a show winner on nr the beginning of the program and said it had x amount of severe problems

The bulldog was also a bit of an eye opener as well, I have a mate who has one (cost around about 2k from a top breeder) and when they showed the skulls how the top jaw had come in to how it should be I thought of this dog as my mates dog cannot bite you correctly due to the jaws

Also I think it was the bassets as well with the folds of skin and the stomachs dragging on the ground, that cannot be healthy, and when they compared the versions from around about 60 yrs prior some breeder said if he had one like that he would put it down The original version looked so much better

dpb

But surley the point is theres no difference between pure an inbreed

STi wanna Subaru

iTrader: (1)

I watched it and the attitude of the breeders was disgraceful. Quite simply they are people with a lot of time on their hands who enjoy the self congratulation back slapping that goes with this breeding. What they're doing is effectively killing off the breeds. The KC is an old school institution protected by the old boy network at the gov. It needs regulating and taking control of.

David Lock

They're not supposed to bite you.........





(but I know what you mean )

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

it was kerry katonas bulldog so you can forgive it for wanting to bite

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

You would think so but a lot of the breeders try to breed extra traits into the dogs to make them "more attractive" which means more money when selling them

STi wanna Subaru

iTrader: (1)

pure could mean two unrelated (well recently at least) dogs couldn't it? Where as inbreed to me means family breeding ie father and daughter.

The genetics behind it are pretty scary I imagine.

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

the pug is a good answer to this one

approx 10k in the uk, of which approx only 50 are pure

suppose its like that colony is it quakers? where they all interbreed and it ***** the genetics right up giving shorter life spans etc

Devildog

I think its important to differenetiate between the breeders (irrespective of whether they show or not) of pedigree dogs who breed to promote high quality dogs (health, temperament, etc) and those who breed purely for personal status and profit.

There is good and bad in every aspect of life.

Didn't see the programme last night (we get some crappy soap instead on a Tuesday) but I can imagine it was the BBC only showing the worst side of it.

Our bitch was Crufts quailified before we got her. The breeders (who are respected dog judges themselves in Scotland) are completely above board and always seek stud dogs from different bloodlines to ensure genetic diversity.

There are many, many like them, so to tarr all breeders with the same brush is to entirely miss the point, and exactly the kind of sensasionalsim I would have expected from the BBC.

For a start the programme should have been called something like "Pedigree dogs - breeding to extremes" rather than just "pedigree dogs".

As we have it - as evidenced by the opening post, people now think that all pedigree dog breeders are as bad as those horrendous cases depicted on the programme.

Yes, it happens and yes of course it must be addressed, and I would agree that the Kennel Club and changing breed standards are, and always have been, the problem.

But pulling the plug on Crufts isn't the answer. The answer is getting the RSPCA and SSPCA involved to prosecute those breeders who are needlessly causing suffering. And for the Kennel Club to refuse to register dogs who's genetics are just wrong - although on that front I would be extremely surprised if the KC would accept a dog who's sire and dam were so closely related anyway.

To get KC registered you need to provide a family history. If the breeders are lying, though, how are the KC supposed to check.

Funkii Munkii

One breeder said they would never breed Father and daughter but they were happy for Grandfather and grandaughter to breed