jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

As title, wife is 18 weeks pregnant, she had some routine tests done at 17 weeks (spina bifida and Downs syndrome risk) and the results came back yesterday. Baby doesnt have spina bifida, however her HGC levels are that high that she has a 1 in 50 chance of it being downs syndrome. (this is a very high risk apparently, midwife says if it was a 1 in 250 then its low risk) We are going for another scan on monday to see if they can see from that (thickness of the skin around the neck I think is what they check)

If needs be she may have a procedure where they take amniotic fluid which will confirm it one way or the other.

Wife has just turned 30, in general good health, hasnt drank whilst pregnant, doesnt smoke etc

On the first scan they could only see one baby, and the visit to the midwife last week she checked the heart and it was going really fast. I have read from some pregnancy forums that people have had twins and the fast heart beat was because the babies were so close together that both beats were being picked up at the same time. So I suppose a multiple birth is a possibility.

Would there be any other reasons why the hcg levels could be very high, apart from downs and multiple births?

Cheers

The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

My daughter was put in a tail spin before Xmas with the same results.

YHPM

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

no pm received

mightyyid

Fella

Did she have the full test (name escapes me) where they do a blood test at the same time. We had to pay for one this time (first two kids were born in Surrey when we lived there) but here in Warwickshire you have to pay for it. That gives you the best chance of providing a good percentage, without going the whole route of having fluid taken from the baby which can bring on a miscarriage in a few instances.

Mrs is 38 now, (we're at 21 weeks) and thus we knew it was the last one, we wanted to be sure. Stats said something like 1 in 200 would be on age alone but after all the tests, it changed to 1 in over 5,000, so we felt more comfortable despite having to pay £140 for the test.

Cannot answer your question due to lack of knowledge, but I'd be interested in the level of tests that they did...

And good luck...

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

Cheers mightyvid, it was the blood tests that gave this result of the 1 in 50. We are covered under gtr manchester and this test was on the nhs and is offered as routine. It checks for the spina bifida and gives the risk of downs as well as other possible abnormalities.

With my wifes age etc, the risk itself before the tests was deemed as quite low risk based on the calculations they have based on age and lifestyle etc. We decided to have the blood test mainly for the spina bifida and luckily that has come back clear, however due to the HCG levels present the risk now of downs is 1 in 50 so basically a 2% chance (I know this is still a low % but it is a high % in the risk side of things)

The scan on monday is being done by a proper scanner type person (forget what they are called but the normal ultrasound people arent as qualified to diagnose certain things), and then if nothing is really clear on the ultrasound we have the option to have the amnio test done there and then. This does carry a very small risk of miscarriage of <1%
We originaly said we wouldnt have these tests, but we had a last min change of mind so that we could be better prepared if the worst came to the worst and the child was handicapped in some way. The only thing is if the tests come back as positive then it has opened a new can of worms as we said originally that if the child was handicapped we would love it anyway no matter what, but now although we would obviously still love it, if we knew it was going to be handicapped we are now thinking what standard of life will it have, is it fair etc all of the moral dilemas.

My wifes family does have a history of twins on both sides of her parents family so I am hoping the high levels could possibly mean twins but first scan shown only 1

mightyyid

Good luck - I know what you mean. I have only one brother who is mentally handicapped and it changes your perception on things, to the extent that I could never work with handicapped kids and I fear I will always treat them as I treated him - and while I was never not nice, it's just different. But I am closer to him than perhaps if we did not have a handicap, and I love him all the more for his ability to overcome adversity better than most.

Kids are kids - you love 'em whatever. But knowing and being prepared for a handicapped child will make things easier, so I fully support your rationale. It is easy to hide away and think it will never happen. You are being wise...

Andy

Brendan Hughes

My wife is older so we had the amnio. Came back clear. **** off great needle though. I think she had her eyes closed or looked elsewhere while I watched - it scared the crap out of me! She said she didn't feel a thing.

Having the info and being able to act on it is so much better than spending months worrying about a possible worst case scenario which may never happen. Facts are more reliable than fears, and are usually a lot easier to deal with.

Good luck.

SJ_Skyline

Jay,

Best of luck - we're expecting twins (32 weeks in). You've just had a Nuchal scan and been offered Amniocentesis. We decided against the Amniocentesis, not that we were burying our heads in the sand but we sat down and thought about it carefully together and decided that even in the worst case we wouldn't want to go through a selective abortion. Apart from anything else, the risk to the other twin would be too high in our view.

Fingers crossed for the both of you

SirFozzalot

Fingers crossed everything works out for you.

I'm getting married this year with the intention of us trying for kids very soon after, all these tests and scans and possible results all sound a bit worrying to be honest.

SJ_Skyline

Quick google brought up this on hCG - http://www.conceivingconcepts.com/le...icles/hcg.html

Hope it's helpful

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

cheers guys,

Brendan, my mrs is dreading the needle if it comes to it, the midwife told us the size of it originally before this dilema came to light and my mrs hates needles at the best of times, so I am going to be wearing lots of padding on my hands on monday!!! With the amnio apparently it either hurts or like your wife, you hardly/dont feel a thing, the luck me and my wife have though I know which one its going to be......

David Lock

Likewise but they stuck the needle into my boy's leg 20 years later he has quite an indentation in his upper leg from that stabbing!!

Jay - all the best. You are right to be checking but I'm sure things will be fine.

r32

Wife has been a midwife for close on 40 years, so if you need any more info let me know and I'll talk to her when I get home.....
STEVE........

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

dont let it put you off, even though we are at high risk, it still works out at a very low % (2%). The worry etc is because that risk is there. The midwifes have to tell you the worst case scenarios etc and to be honest I am glad they have done so as it allow sus to prepare and think about different possibilities etc.

Besides, tryin for kids is the fun part!!

Brendan Hughes

Simple. When the doc says "You'll just feel a little *****", you simply add "You know, like four months ago".

We have a few friends who've had it. Reaction is unanimously terror beforehand and "what was all the fuss about?" after.

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

thanks for the words

J4CKO

iTrader: (1)

Thats the trouble with matters medical, they say something off the cuff and then you brood on it for ages, the chances are everything will be fine so save yourself as much stress as possible by trying not to think about it, difficult I know but worry about things like that until it happens.

I think sometimes a lot of medical stuff can be a self fullfiling profecy due to the stress and worry induced by an off the cuff comment that you worry about, stress increases your strain on your system, blood pressure, heart rate and impacts your immune system.

mart360

Neuchal scan is very good we had one done for our second one (age reasons)

they scan was far better than your standard ultrasound, they also do lots of measurements etc, which coupled with other bits and bobs give you a risk factor.

The level we got was about 1 in a 1000, so we carried on.


he,s 5 now and drives us up the wall



mart

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

little update

Went hospital today and didnt have the amnio. The scan didnt show any markers and the dr said it looks like a normal baby.

We decided against the amnio as we wouldnt have a termination anyway so decided it isnt worth the 1% risk of miscarriage by having it done. It is our first child and we have deicided if anything is wrong then its just the cards we have been dealt, we have support from family and friends as well so should be able to cope should the worse case be realised

Brendan Hughes

Best of luck (for everything, not just that risk)

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

Cheers Brendan

Lee247

I am fairly sure all will be well, going off the latest comments

I'm glad you decided against the amnio, not a nice test and the risk is not worth it.

You are both young, One of my friends had her first at 42 and her second at 46, Both kids were perfect.

Good Luck to you and stop worrying, just look forward to the event

Scoobychick

iTrader: (1)

My sister was in a similar position as you, she's 40 and pregnant with her first child, the first lot of tests showed that she was at a higher than normal risk. However after much debating she decided not to have the amnio due to the risk of miscarriage.

They'd been trying for a baby for seven years and had had three lots of IVF fail before she fell pregnant naturally six months ago so between them they decided that the risk factor was just too great.

scoob_babe

Jay - did they find a second in there? It would have been very obvious on an ultrasound if there were twins. Baby heartbeats are considerably higher than ours (130-160 bpm) and it is quite hard to keep track of twins on a doppler / monitor thing that most midwives use - mine were wriggling all over the place and impossible to track!

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

Hi scoob_babe, no second just 1. I thought there was a chance of multiple even though the first scan only shown one as my wifes family has a history of twins on both sides, however only 1 is showing. The scan yesterday was quite an indepth one that found no defects with heart and all the organs were there etc and all limbs, and the baby is growing at a normal rate (currently approx 23 cms crown to heel), head circumference is on the smaller size for the duration that she is at however this is still within range (mrs was pleased and hopes the head remains on the smaller size ) The other thing they measure was okay as well (forgot what that was though!)


Some person where she works told her that there is another test that wasnt invasive that can tell for definite whether it will have downs so she got her hopes up even though we discussed it yesterday and said it doesnt matter now either way as long as it is healthy (or as healthy as can be) so I have had to let her know that the other test maybe slightly more accurate but will not say for sure as invasive procedures are the only way.

The 4d scans you can get though look good so may invest in one of those as they put it on dvd for you

scoob_babe

Good to hear its as healthy as far as they can see! We only had the std anomaly scan as has already been posted since we didn't want to consider selective termination. Both of ours are quite big - I'm with your wife on the small heads front!

There is no sure fire way of knowing whether they have Downs or not until they are born. It's something we will just have to wait and find out although I am not in the traditional 'at risk' age group however we do have very frequent growth scans (a bonus with multiples!!) and since everything is within normal limits and making good progress, we're assuming nothing wrong at present. We'll get back to you on that in a few weeks time

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

good luck on yours scoob_babe, keep us posted.

We have the next scan next tuesday which is another anomaly scan (this was scheduled anyway and the dr yesterday said to just keep this), hopefully will find out if its a boy (I reckon) or a girl, they couldnt tell yesterday as it moved to face towards the spine and wouldnt turn back round again (gets its stubborness from its mum )

jaytc2003

iTrader: (1)

another update, its a boy

Cinomotographer said he doesnt think it is affected by downs as the skull was of normal thickness, neck was a normal thickness, no cystic fibrosis, and no cleft pallet, everything is functioning normally and the baby is growing nicely. Head circumference has inceased which hasnt please the wife

SJ_Skyline

Good news Jay

Flaps

iTrader: (1)

Great news.

We are trying for our first at the moment (not as I type this mind, just having a break ). This kind of stuff scares the hell out of me.

Keep us updated mate.