Moses
#2
Audi, dont upset him during 'The comeback tour', otherwise he wont do his finale, a rendition of 'Dont let the Sun go down on me' with UncleBuck as surprise guest !
#3
Pontificating
Originally Posted by J4CKO
Audi, dont upset him during 'The comeback tour', otherwise he wont do his finale, a rendition of 'Dont let the Sun go down on me' with UncleBuck as surprise guest !
PMSL
That I'd like to see
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#8
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Originally Posted by kammy
He is not a radical- he simply has a different opinion to most of member sof scoobynet.
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Les, it's not like you to be sarky so I assume you are sincere when you say "No way is he [Moses] radical."
Yet over the last few weeks he has often wished death and destruction on Israel. Openly, repeatedly, and as you say, honestly. He wants all Zionists wiped out, and that includes me, simply because I believe Israel has a right to exist.
That is RADICAL Muslim extremism.
Richard.
PS For anybody confused by references to 'Moses' he is an outspoken Muslim contributor to ScoobyNet. He does not feature in the Bible
Yet over the last few weeks he has often wished death and destruction on Israel. Openly, repeatedly, and as you say, honestly. He wants all Zionists wiped out, and that includes me, simply because I believe Israel has a right to exist.
That is RADICAL Muslim extremism.
Richard.
PS For anybody confused by references to 'Moses' he is an outspoken Muslim contributor to ScoobyNet. He does not feature in the Bible
#11
Originally Posted by Hoppy
Yet over the last few weeks he has often wished death and destruction on Israel. Openly, repeatedly, and as you say, honestly. He wants all Zionists wiped out, and that includes me, simply because I believe Israel has a right to exist.
That is RADICAL Muslim extremism.
Richard.
PS For anybody confused by references to 'Moses' he is an outspoken Muslim contributor to ScoobyNet. He does not feature in the Bible
That is RADICAL Muslim extremism.
Richard.
PS For anybody confused by references to 'Moses' he is an outspoken Muslim contributor to ScoobyNet. He does not feature in the Bible
#12
Originally Posted by Luan Pra bang
You have consistently twisted and misconstrued his words in order to try and change what he says into somthing that fits your agenda though. Why should he not wish destruction on Israel. They have been murdering People in Palestine for 50 years and it should never have been created in the first place. Almost 1 million people are still waiting to go back to their homes in Israel. Why should he not be upset about a huge injustice ?
And btw he shouldn't wish destruction and death on anyone because its against his religion, surely. Don't tell me the religion of peace approves of death and destruction? Surely not!
#13
Originally Posted by Suresh
Oh FFS. He's a nasty agressive, illiterage, terrorist-supporting potential suicide bomber. Why do you feel the need to support such a scumbag?
And btw he shouldn't wish destruction and death on anyone because its against his religion, surely. Don't tell me the religion of peace approves of death and destruction? Surely not!
And btw he shouldn't wish destruction and death on anyone because its against his religion, surely. Don't tell me the religion of peace approves of death and destruction? Surely not!
It seems to me from your post that far from being the 'free thinking reasonable man' you think you are, you are simply a small minded little man who saps up every last bit of crap he reads in the media....
BTW just my tuppence worth, Im sure you'll no doubt have a barrage of abuse lined up...!
#14
Originally Posted by turboman786
S you are simply a small minded little man who saps up every last bit of crap he reads in the media....
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Originally Posted by Luan Pra bang
You have consistently twisted and misconstrued his words in order to try and change what he says into somthing that fits your agenda though. Why should he not wish destruction on Israel. They have been murdering People in Palestine for 50 years and it should never have been created in the first place. Almost 1 million people are still waiting to go back to their homes in Israel. Why should he not be upset about a huge injustice ?
And in the context of Israel/Palestine, there is absolutely no way on earth I could twist either moses' or indeed your own words to suit my so-called agenda. Your views are absolutely crystal clear.
And BTW, what is my 'agenda' according to you? According to me, I am a British atheist who believes Israel has a right to exist, at least partly because Britain helped create it. I have great sympathy for the Lebanese position and do not condone all Israeli actions beyond the reasonable right to defend themselves. I think this pretty much coincides with the UN view and therefore international law.
However, I am also beginning to wonder why Iran is pulling all the strings and appears to be manipulating Lebanon and indeed Hezbollah. Your view?
To end on a lighter note, I seem to detect more British Muslims, including Clerics, condemning extreme terrorist violence from within their/our community. I am hopeful.
Richard.
#17
Originally Posted by Hoppy
LPB, when have I "twisted and misconstrued his [moses] words"? Please don't make accusations without backing them up (for the second time of asking).
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LPB, I don't know what/where you mean exactly, but how have I twisted moses' words?
Moses claims to be against the attacking of civilian targets, yet he supports Hezbollah, a terrorist organisation which always does DELIBERATELY target civilians, either with suidcide bombers or rockets and missiles. It's integral to their terror strategy (and very effective it is, too). That is not twisting words - simply pointing out a blindingly obvious contradiction.
Please forgive my talking "****e" as you so nicely put it and tell me what Iran is up to behind the scenes? Obviously, we could all benefit from your wisdom Sarcasm aside, I guess you have a view on this.
Richard.
Moses claims to be against the attacking of civilian targets, yet he supports Hezbollah, a terrorist organisation which always does DELIBERATELY target civilians, either with suidcide bombers or rockets and missiles. It's integral to their terror strategy (and very effective it is, too). That is not twisting words - simply pointing out a blindingly obvious contradiction.
Please forgive my talking "****e" as you so nicely put it and tell me what Iran is up to behind the scenes? Obviously, we could all benefit from your wisdom Sarcasm aside, I guess you have a view on this.
Richard.
#19
Anyway, make the most of him, soon he will be gone having turned up to right some wrongs, discuss some ****, maybe today, maybe tommorow he'll want to settle down, until tommorow he'll just keep moving on.......
#20
Originally Posted by Hoppy
Hezbollah, a FREEDOM organisation which always does DELIBERATELY target civilians
Richard.
Richard.
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That is not a direct quote from me. It has been edited. Please give me a link to it.
When speaking about suicide bombers and Hezbollah rockets targeting civilians, this was BEFORE any Israeli counter attack. Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation (and a very clever one, too, and that's not sarcasm) and if you support them then you must also condone the killing of innocent civilians.
That's fact, not "****e". You can't pick and choose according to the occasion.
Richard.
When speaking about suicide bombers and Hezbollah rockets targeting civilians, this was BEFORE any Israeli counter attack. Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation (and a very clever one, too, and that's not sarcasm) and if you support them then you must also condone the killing of innocent civilians.
That's fact, not "****e". You can't pick and choose according to the occasion.
Richard.
#22
Originally Posted by Hoppy
When speaking about suicide bombers and Hezbollah rockets targeting civilians, this was BEFORE any Israeli counter attack. Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation (and a very clever one, too, and that's not sarcasm) and if you support them then you must also condone the killing of innocent civilians.
Also I'm one of the worst people to argue with Moses but apart from his outbursts and false beliefs in Islam he comes across as a decent human being that is dedicated to his family and leading a decent life, which is more than can be said of a lot of people these days.
#23
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Originally Posted by KiwiGTI
Innocent civilians who are invaders in a stolen land that isn't theirs. The state of Israel has no right to exist and I am no Muslim extremist (I can't even stand moderate Islam)
Also I'm one of the worst people to argue with Moses but apart from his outbursts and false beliefs in Islam he comes across as a decent human being that is dedicated to his family and leading a decent life, which is more than can be said of a lot of people these days.
Also I'm one of the worst people to argue with Moses but apart from his outbursts and false beliefs in Islam he comes across as a decent human being that is dedicated to his family and leading a decent life, which is more than can be said of a lot of people these days.
Kiwi I am in utter disbelief here, I try to refrain from posting on these type of threads, but the fact that you and Moses seem to have found some common ground compels me to do so. Whilst I am certainly not your greatest fan I think we have a mutual respect for one another and I admire your stance of utter conviction regarding your beliefs. However I will say Islam is not violent or destructive but the misconstruing of it to suit personal agendas does not help. I am not qualified to comment in all honesty on anything religious but I can comment on being a good human. What can we expect next Kiwi and Moses having a discussion around a table?
Maz
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Originally Posted by KiwiGTI
Innocent civilians who are invaders in a stolen land that isn't theirs. The state of Israel has no right to exist
We, Britain, created the Israeli state and apart from the fact that you can't turn the clock back, Israel is not going away. And the entire territory is only the size of Wales FFS
If Muslims cannot learn to live side by side with Israel, then further conflict is inevitable, and I don't believe the majority of Muslims want this, certainly not in Lebanon. Iran has a lot to answer for. It is becoming clear that the Lebanese people and Hezbollah and just pawns in Iran's perverted game.
Given this backdrop, it is impossible to ignore the possibility of massive escalation in hostilities and you can be certain that, if push comes to shove, then Beirut, Damascus and Tehran will all disappear under a large mushroom cloud before it's over.
The Arab world needs to get a grip on reality. Peace is the only way forward for everybody. And that includes everybody on this Godforsaken planet
Richard.
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Originally Posted by KiwiGTI
I'm one of the worst people to argue with Moses but apart from his outbursts and false beliefs in Islam he comes across as a decent human being that is dedicated to his family and leading a decent life, which is more than can be said of a lot of people these days.
I just don't understand where all this bloodthirsty, blind hatred comes from. And I don't think most other Brits can either, Muslim or not.
Richard.
Last edited by Hoppy; 19 August 2006 at 09:43 PM.
#26
Originally Posted by Hoppy
Who says so? The Jews go back a long way - some 3,000 years. Throughout that time, Jews have been continuously resident in what we now call Israel.
Originally Posted by hoppy
We, Britain, created the Israeli state and apart from the fact that you can't turn the clock back, Israel is not going away. And the entire territory is only the size of Wales FFS
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Hello LPG. Thanks for your reply. If those are the facts as you see them, that's fine by me. You are entitled to your opinion and we can agree to differ.
What I still don't understand is why British Muslims are so bitter about the whole thing. What direct harm has Israel done to British Muslims? Is it just a Muslim 'brotherhood' thing (which I don't agree with but can empathise). This would at least explain why there is nothing like the same level of outrage as perhaps there should be over the horrific situation in Africa which seems to be on-going slaughter that nobody cares much about. But then there's no oil around and it's not going to turn into WW3.
But looking forward, what is the objective behind the attacks on Israel? And why is Iran funding it? I can only see more grief on both sides. What do you see as a realistic end game?
Thanks,
Richard.
PS Edited to add, you have not provided a link to that quote above that you claim is directly from me.
What I still don't understand is why British Muslims are so bitter about the whole thing. What direct harm has Israel done to British Muslims? Is it just a Muslim 'brotherhood' thing (which I don't agree with but can empathise). This would at least explain why there is nothing like the same level of outrage as perhaps there should be over the horrific situation in Africa which seems to be on-going slaughter that nobody cares much about. But then there's no oil around and it's not going to turn into WW3.
But looking forward, what is the objective behind the attacks on Israel? And why is Iran funding it? I can only see more grief on both sides. What do you see as a realistic end game?
Thanks,
Richard.
PS Edited to add, you have not provided a link to that quote above that you claim is directly from me.
Last edited by Hoppy; 20 August 2006 at 03:15 PM.
#29
Originally Posted by KiwiGTI
Innocent civilians who are invaders in a stolen land that isn't theirs. The state of Israel has no right to exist and I am no Muslim extremist (I can't even stand moderate Islam)
It was created for Jewish people to settle in after the atrocities of the WWII and recognised by the Governments of the US, Soviet Union, United Kingdom, etc.
The Land of Israel dates back over 3000 years, under various foreign rulers, the Jewish population fled to other countries to avoid persecution.They started their return in significant numbers in the late 1800's and it took around 60 years before they were granted independence and their own state.
The land isn't "stolen", it was theirs to begin with and a lot of it was bought by Jewish organisations, so the Arabs hardly lost out!
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Originally Posted by Leslie
Well said KiwiGTI,
Les
Les
The part about Israelis being "invaders in a stolen land" and "the state of Israel has no right to exist"?
Or the part about moses' "outbursts and false beliefs in Islam"?
Or that "he [moses] comes across as a decent human being"?
Your position is confusing; surely you can't agree with all three
Richard.
Last edited by Hoppy; 20 August 2006 at 03:12 PM.