Moses
 

http://www.eurolegal.org/images/blbegm.jpg

:thumb:

Audi, dont upset him during 'The comeback tour', otherwise he wont do his finale, a rendition of 'Dont let the Sun go down on me' with UncleBuck as surprise guest !

:lol: :lol: :lol:

PMSL

That I'd like to see

Not sure why it should be me....

But, I'm there.... count me in...... ;)

Dont upset our resident radical.:nono:

UB, mildly flumoxed I suspect, I chose you as you are the least likely being as you get on so well with Moses.

He is not a radical- he simply has a different opinion to most of member sof scoobynet.

Intellect of a turd fresh from a Muslim followed by being blown to smithereens by a grenade more like! i.e. totally fooked up!

No way he is radical, he has proved that before. He is absolutely honest though.

Les

Les, it's not like you to be sarky so I assume you are sincere when you say "No way is he [Moses] radical."

Yet over the last few weeks he has often wished death and destruction on Israel. Openly, repeatedly, and as you say, honestly. He wants all Zionists wiped out, and that includes me, simply because I believe Israel has a right to exist.

That is RADICAL Muslim extremism.

Richard.

PS For anybody confused by references to 'Moses' he is an outspoken Muslim contributor to ScoobyNet. He does not feature in the Bible ;)

You have consistently twisted and misconstrued his words in order to try and change what he says into somthing that fits your agenda though. Why should he not wish destruction on Israel. They have been murdering People in Palestine for 50 years and it should never have been created in the first place. Almost 1 million people are still waiting to go back to their homes in Israel. Why should he not be upset about a huge injustice ?

Oh FFS. He's a nasty agressive, illiterage, terrorist-supporting potential suicide bomber. Why do you feel the need to support such a scumbag? :mad:

And btw he shouldn't wish destruction and death on anyone because its against his religion, surely. Don't tell me the religion of peace approves of death and destruction? Surely not! :o

Suresh once again you prefer to play the labelling game....blimey you've excelled yourself in labels here!!

It seems to me from your post that far from being the 'free thinking reasonable man' you think you are, you are simply a small minded little man who saps up every last bit of crap he reads in the media....

BTW just my tuppence worth, Im sure you'll no doubt have a barrage of abuse lined up...!

and you would never label anyone of course! :lol1:

LPB, when have I "twisted and misconstrued his [moses] words"? Please don't make accusations without backing them up (for the second time of asking).

And in the context of Israel/Palestine, there is absolutely no way on earth I could twist either moses' or indeed your own words to suit my so-called agenda. Your views are absolutely crystal clear.

And BTW, what is my 'agenda' according to you? According to me, I am a British atheist who believes Israel has a right to exist, at least partly because Britain helped create it. I have great sympathy for the Lebanese position and do not condone all Israeli actions beyond the reasonable right to defend themselves. I think this pretty much coincides with the UN view and therefore international law.

However, I am also beginning to wonder why Iran is pulling all the strings and appears to be manipulating Lebanon and indeed Hezbollah. Your view?

To end on a lighter note, I seem to detect more British Muslims, including Clerics, condemning extreme terrorist violence from within their/our community. I am hopeful.

Richard.

:lol:

For one example. When moses compared the attacks on military targets to killing innocent civilians as one being right one being wrong. On another thread you then accused moses of supporting the killing of innocent civilians and quoted his post, the one comparing the difference between civilian and military targets in order to make it appear as though Moses actually supported attacking non military targets. I pointed out how wrong you were then and I am doing it again becuase you talk ****e and have no idea what you are talking about.

LPB, I don't know what/where you mean exactly, but how have I twisted moses' words?

Moses claims to be against the attacking of civilian targets, yet he supports Hezbollah, a terrorist organisation which always does DELIBERATELY target civilians, either with suidcide bombers or rockets and missiles. It's integral to their terror strategy (and very effective it is, too). That is not twisting words - simply pointing out a blindingly obvious contradiction.

Please forgive my talking "****e" as you so nicely put it and tell me what Iran is up to behind the scenes? Obviously, we could all benefit from your wisdom :rolleyes: Sarcasm aside, I guess you have a view on this.

Richard.

Anyway, make the most of him, soon he will be gone having turned up to right some wrongs, discuss some ****, maybe today, maybe tommorow he'll want to settle down, until tommorow he'll just keep moving on.......

Apart from when its fighting an Israeli invasion force. Which presumably is when Moses supports them.

That is not a direct quote from me. It has been edited. Please give me a link to it.

When speaking about suicide bombers and Hezbollah rockets targeting civilians, this was BEFORE any Israeli counter attack. Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation (and a very clever one, too, and that's not sarcasm) and if you support them then you must also condone the killing of innocent civilians.

That's fact, not "****e". You can't pick and choose according to the occasion.

Richard.

Innocent civilians who are invaders in a stolen land that isn't theirs. The state of Israel has no right to exist and I am no Muslim extremist (I can't even stand moderate Islam)

Also I'm one of the worst people to argue with Moses but apart from his outbursts and false beliefs in Islam he comes across as a decent human being that is dedicated to his family and leading a decent life, which is more than can be said of a lot of people these days.

Kiwi I am in utter disbelief here, I try to refrain from posting on these type of threads, but the fact that you and Moses seem to have found some common ground compels me to do so. Whilst I am certainly not your greatest fan I think we have a mutual respect for one another and I admire your stance of utter conviction regarding your beliefs. However I will say Islam is not violent or destructive but the misconstruing of it to suit personal agendas does not help. I am not qualified to comment in all honesty on anything religious but I can comment on being a good human. What can we expect next Kiwi and Moses having a discussion around a table?:D :thumb:


Maz

Who says so? The Jews go back a long way - some 3,000 years. Throughout that time, Jews have been continuously resident in what we now call Israel. Depending on which piece of history you want to believe, they have as much right to be there as anybody.

We, Britain, created the Israeli state and apart from the fact that you can't turn the clock back, Israel is not going away. And the entire territory is only the size of Wales FFS :rolleyes:

If Muslims cannot learn to live side by side with Israel, then further conflict is inevitable, and I don't believe the majority of Muslims want this, certainly not in Lebanon. Iran has a lot to answer for. It is becoming clear that the Lebanese people and Hezbollah and just pawns in Iran's perverted game.

Given this backdrop, it is impossible to ignore the possibility of massive escalation in hostilities and you can be certain that, if push comes to shove, then Beirut, Damascus and Tehran will all disappear under a large mushroom cloud before it's over.

The Arab world needs to get a grip on reality. Peace is the only way forward for everybody. And that includes everybody on this Godforsaken planet :(

Richard.

Agreed :) He seems like a thoroughly decent guy, British born and living with his wife and family in Scotland. He condemns all terrorists, but when anyone mentions Israel he goes berserk and his peaceful stance gets turned upside-down.

I just don't understand where all this bloodthirsty, blind hatred comes from. And I don't think most other Brits can either, Muslim or not.

Richard.

That is simply not true. After the death of christ the jews settled in Babylon which was 2000 years ago. They then Left babylon and spread across the world. The idea that they have any claim to that land is a joke.

1 million Palestinians evicted from their land, thousands murderd in different massacres, torture campaigns in Lebanon Jordan and Palestine by mossad, British diplomats murdered. Further invasion and expansion into the Golan heights Lebanon and the west bank. Tell me what you would do if you were evicted from you home where generations of your family had lived and sent to live in a giant concentration camp ? Israel has commited horrific acts against these people for 100 years continuosly. Are you surprised that people are a bit bitter and upset. The Jews moved into palestine in 1895 bybuying up pieces of land. 50 years later they began to murder the Palestinians and forcibly remove them from that land those are the facts. How on earth can you not understand people being upset. How long would the British take to get used to having England invaded by the worlds Muslims being tortured murderd and then being forced to live in wales while the USA and the worlds superpowers helped the muslims carry on. How long until the English resigned themselves to living in concentration camps surrounded by walls, gates fences etc and seeing your family's killed by invaders.

Hello LPG. Thanks for your reply. If those are the facts as you see them, that's fine by me. You are entitled to your opinion and we can agree to differ.

What I still don't understand is why British Muslims are so bitter about the whole thing. What direct harm has Israel done to British Muslims? Is it just a Muslim 'brotherhood' thing (which I don't agree with but can empathise). This would at least explain why there is nothing like the same level of outrage as perhaps there should be over the horrific situation in Africa which seems to be on-going slaughter that nobody cares much about. But then there's no oil around and it's not going to turn into WW3.

But looking forward, what is the objective behind the attacks on Israel? And why is Iran funding it? I can only see more grief on both sides. What do you see as a realistic end game?

Thanks,

Richard.

PS Edited to add, you have not provided a link to that quote above that you claim is directly from me.

Well said KiwiGTI,

Les

On what basis has the state of Israel got no right to exist?

It was created for Jewish people to settle in after the atrocities of the WWII and recognised by the Governments of the US, Soviet Union, United Kingdom, etc.
The Land of Israel dates back over 3000 years, under various foreign rulers, the Jewish population fled to other countries to avoid persecution.They started their return in significant numbers in the late 1800's and it took around 60 years before they were granted independence and their own state.
The land isn't "stolen", it was theirs to begin with and a lot of it was bought by Jewish organisations, so the Arabs hardly lost out!

Which bit?

The part about Israelis being "invaders in a stolen land" and "the state of Israel has no right to exist"?

Or the part about moses' "outbursts and false beliefs in Islam"?

Or that "he [moses] comes across as a decent human being"?

Your position is confusing; surely you can't agree with all three :confused:

Richard.