kingofturds

iTrader: (1)

wondering if anyone on here has any idea of whether you are entitled by law to see a copy of this certificate.was (allegedly) caught on a mobile speed camera van 3 weeks ago.I have written away requesting photographic evidince which they have sent (although it is pretty inconclusive as it doesnt show who is driving ) however they are refusing to send a copy of the callibration certificate.

Trucker Ted

They dont need to show you yet as you havent been charged with anything yet.You will only have received a Notice of Intended Prosecution,which is looking for you to state the driver of the vehicle!If the photo is poor then you have a good chance of swerving some points

However,dont do anything until you have thoroughly checked this excellent site which will tell you exactly how to hopefully get off with it

www.pepipoo.com

hedgehog

Pepipoo doesn't tell you how to "get off" with anything. It details the law and motorists assist each other by establishing ways in which the law has been broken in an attempt to obtain their conviction, or indeed establish that they didn't break the law at all in the first place. There is no element of "getting off with it" as the users present a legal defence in court and are declared not guilty of the offence.

Getting off with it occurs where the police in North Yorkshire admit to the Magistrates Association that they know their policy of siezing and crushing vehicles is illegal but that they are not going to stop it until someone challenges it in court. Oh where the NIP sent to motorists is illegal under European law but they are not going to stop sending them out until Idris, and others, win their case in the ECHR early next year. That is "getting off with it."

However, as pointed out there is no need for them to provide you with such evidence until 14 days before the court case. There has been at least one case recently where the motorist has requested such paperwork under the freedom of information act and i have a feeling that the charges were withdrawn but i don't have the full details and so don't know the precise circumstances. As suggested get over to pepipoo and evaluate the possible defence options however bear in mind that you will not be getting off with it, you will be establishing that either you didn't break the law or that they broke the law in attempting to get a successful prosecution. When you see how many people are successful in mounting a defence you would have to wonder if any camera convictions are safe.

Elmer Fudpucker

I was issued with a NIP a couple of years back for doing 70 in a 30(alledgedly)

now no one in their right mind does that kind of speed!!...and me,never

but on recieving said NIP,you just accept it at face value and think Oh Shee-it,what 'ave I done?

So I duly asked for the photo,calibration certs of the equipment used and the accusing Officers certificate of training.

The letter back from the Police stated that these would only be supplied 'if'...('IF' for GAWDS SAKE)....the case went to court.

Needless to say I didn't hear anything more about it

Ironically,the only time that I have been 'done' for speeding was 27 years ogo,on a moped

and at that time my old man was a Chief Inspector and even he couldn't get me off it

Good luck,Jon

kingofturds

iTrader: (1)

cheers good people the photo they sent is pretty lame tbh all you can see is a hand on then steering wheel ,and on the closest photo the driver is obscured by a motorbike. i was done for 41 in a 30 so am i right in thinking the worst they can do in court is give me the original fine ?

shaunywrx

I think you'll find that if you go to court you will get a far higher fine and point's, than if you just plead guilty and pay the fixed penalty, the way they see it is you're guilty anyway because they've got the photo evidence, and all you're doing is just trying to get out of it.

So much for innoccent until proven guilty.

hedgehog

If you go to court, and assuming you don't say something nasty about the magistrate or ask what he gets up to with the goat and the CC down the lodge meetings, then the chances are that the fine will be in the region of the £60, though it might go as high as £100 and it will never be less than £60, and the costs will be in the region of £35. This assumes that you plead not guilty and fight your case. If you are going to plead guilty then there is little point going to court to be honest as it will cost you your time etc. and the magistrate might think you are on a wind up.

Again you can ask these questions on pepipoo and get replies from people with recent and direct experience, there may even be someone on there with experience of the court you would be attending.

kingofturds

iTrader: (1)

cheers hedgehog ill write back to the saftey camera unit ant tell them i unable to ascertain the identidy of the driver from the grainy images they have provided and see where it goes from there

hedgehog

Being unable to identify the driver is known as the paragraph 4 defence and I would strongly advise that you do not take that route unless you absolutely don't know who the driver was. If you don't know who the driver was then by all means use this defence but the court will ask for you to show due dilligance in attempting to establish who the driver was: for example where were you when the photo was taken? Have you a witness? Are other people insured to drive your car? Etc. etc.

It is certainly a defence that works, I know one person who has successfully assisted about 6 or 8 people to use it, but do not risk perverting the course of justice or perjury if you do actually know who the driver was. Also be very careful what you post to the internet, as you may have seen on a recent thread the partnerships and police have admitted to reading internet motoring forums to try and catch people out and they have recently got several convictions of motorists based upon discussions on internet forums. Do not lie to them, motorists are winning on a regular basis by showing that the police and the partnerships are acting outside the law but we don't want to have to lower ourselves to using their tactics.