One for Cherie Booth then
18 March 2005, 06:39 PM
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One for Cherie Booth then
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/4361791.stm
Not that the Begram ruling was a can of worms of course........
Not that the Begram ruling was a can of worms of course........
18 March 2005, 06:45 PM
#2
The usual crap, then:
1. WTF does it matter WHAT a kid looks like if they work OK and don't stop others doing so. Uniforms are for weak parents and **** retentives
2. HOW can it be OK for black/mixed race kids to wear one style, but not for white kids?
Alcazar
1. WTF does it matter WHAT a kid looks like if they work OK and don't stop others doing so. Uniforms are for weak parents and **** retentives
2. HOW can it be OK for black/mixed race kids to wear one style, but not for white kids?
Alcazar
18 March 2005, 06:46 PM
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OK she looks stupid, but I defend her right to look stupid if it's not specified in the rules of the school to have such hairstyles. If it is, then EVERY pupil at the school should comply with the rules. It's that SIMPLE. Not sure what else is to be said. Open/Shut if you ask me. Either ALL pupils are allowed such hairstyles or ALL pupils aren't.
18 March 2005, 06:53 PM
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Uniforms are for weak parents and **** retentives
Uniforms (in theory) help to eliminate any divisions between pupils as all are dressed the same. Rich kids wear the same as poor ones thus no distinction between the two. School is about academia, not a place to show how rich or 'fashion' concious you are. Uniforms are pretty much cheap (well they were when I was at school). Poor kids don't get picked on for not wearing the 'right' clothes which their parents can't afford. It also helps distinguish which schools kids are from if they are caught out of school at lunchtimes so can help against truancy.
OK, it's far from ideal but it's better than the alternative. Well, at least it was in my 'day' which wasn't that long ago.
18 March 2005, 06:55 PM
#6
A voice of reason.
Originally Posted by Dracoro
OK she looks stupid, but I defend her right to look stupid if it's not specified in the rules of the school to have such hairstyles. If it is, then EVERY pupil at the school should comply with the rules. It's that SIMPLE. Not sure what else is to be said. Open/Shut if you ask me. Either ALL pupils are allowed such hairstyles or ALL pupils aren't.
18 March 2005, 07:01 PM
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Well I dont.
The uniform issue is yet another red herring. Rich kids will always find a way to belittle those kids who are less fortunate, i.e. better shoes, better blazer, better mobile, bag, trainers, sports kit, yaddayadda.
Poor kids might mean poor quality kit, and rich kids might mean whatever mumsie wumsie and daddy waddy will waste on them. The uniform issue is a big zero.
The uniform issue is yet another red herring. Rich kids will always find a way to belittle those kids who are less fortunate, i.e. better shoes, better blazer, better mobile, bag, trainers, sports kit, yaddayadda.
Poor kids might mean poor quality kit, and rich kids might mean whatever mumsie wumsie and daddy waddy will waste on them. The uniform issue is a big zero.
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18 March 2005, 07:15 PM
#8
I've never been a supporter of uniforms at school for the simple reason that they ALWAYS seemed an excuse fior weak parenting. Let me try and explain.
The parents arrive at the school on open day, before child is enroled, and choose whichever school they want. Quite a few are vociferous in their support of "homework" and "uniform", because they are what make a "good school"
.
After a time, sometimes quite a short time, the kid kicks off about having to do homework, or having to wear the uniform.
The self-same parents who were so supportive at the start, suddenly realise that THEY have to enforce this
They then realise that it's MUCH easier to take on the school, while telling the kid, " it's not ME forcing you to stay in and/or wear the uniform, it's that NASTY school, blame them". Weak parenting. They use the school to try and get their kid inline, but won't back the school up. Indeed, I've seen letters written to form-teachers which contained vile abuse, among reasons for why THEIR kid won't wear the uniform.
IMHO, uniform is outdated. Countries with FAR better results than ours, don't have it, nor do they have the problems with outlandish dress, or kids trying to go one better.
This country seems to LOVE uniforms, for some reason. Wherever you go, banks, building societies, shops, car dealers, they ALL seem to wear uniform to work. WHY? In France I get the same, or better service from folk in jeans and a T-shirt! Work-wear for dirty jobs? Yes. Uniform? NO!
Alcazar
The parents arrive at the school on open day, before child is enroled, and choose whichever school they want. Quite a few are vociferous in their support of "homework" and "uniform", because they are what make a "good school"
.After a time, sometimes quite a short time, the kid kicks off about having to do homework, or having to wear the uniform.
The self-same parents who were so supportive at the start, suddenly realise that THEY have to enforce this
They then realise that it's MUCH easier to take on the school, while telling the kid, " it's not ME forcing you to stay in and/or wear the uniform, it's that NASTY school, blame them". Weak parenting. They use the school to try and get their kid inline, but won't back the school up. Indeed, I've seen letters written to form-teachers which contained vile abuse, among reasons for why THEIR kid won't wear the uniform.
IMHO, uniform is outdated. Countries with FAR better results than ours, don't have it, nor do they have the problems with outlandish dress, or kids trying to go one better.
This country seems to LOVE uniforms, for some reason. Wherever you go, banks, building societies, shops, car dealers, they ALL seem to wear uniform to work. WHY? In France I get the same, or better service from folk in jeans and a T-shirt! Work-wear for dirty jobs? Yes. Uniform? NO!
Alcazar
18 March 2005, 07:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Jye
Well I dont.
The uniform issue is yet another red herring. Rich kids will always find a way to belittle those kids who are less fortunate, i.e. better shoes, better blazer, better mobile, bag, trainers, sports kit, yaddayadda.
Poor kids might mean poor quality kit, and rich kids might mean whatever mumsie wumsie and daddy waddy will waste on them. The uniform issue is a big zero.
The uniform issue is yet another red herring. Rich kids will always find a way to belittle those kids who are less fortunate, i.e. better shoes, better blazer, better mobile, bag, trainers, sports kit, yaddayadda.
Poor kids might mean poor quality kit, and rich kids might mean whatever mumsie wumsie and daddy waddy will waste on them. The uniform issue is a big zero.
i collect my son from school every friday, and i pass numerous other schools on the way.
from the other schools the kids come out looking smart in there UNIFORMS, shirts, ties & blazers.. there are variations on a theme, as with any groups, but they all look smart.
What did my sons school do, ?? they opted for a relaxed school uniform, and out of the gates pour a mixed bag of poloshirts sweatshirts, shirts, (no ties)
and no blazers, admittedly they are in school colours, but it dosent present the same image!!
i wore a school uniform as a child, and i was extremley proud of it, its only the silly limited mentality that introduces the them and us scenario.
Mart
18 March 2005, 07:27 PM
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The school probably did not reprimand the black and mixed race kids as the the race card would be played. But if a white girl decides to have bradied hair, she's fair game, as you can't play the race card because you're white.
I can't see why her hairstyle would disrupt the learning process at all, so why the exclusion? Obviously there is some stickler for the rules in charge, no doubt they were fat and bullied at school so are now in a position of power and wish to weild that power however they feel.
Interested about the 'shaved head' rule as well, wonder what they consider 'shaved' grade 3? grade 2? grade 1? If it's a grade 2 then I'd be in trouble as that's how my hair currently is, and has been for a while, and I've never had any complaints from my clients about my hairstyle, probably because my skills are what they care about and not my looks.
PC mad? Oh I think so.
As for school uniforms, I can see both sides of the story, but I am a believer that if there is a school uniform policy then it should apply to everyone with no exceptions. I don't care what race you are, or what your religious beliefs are, you play by the rules, or you are excluded, end of story.
I can't see why her hairstyle would disrupt the learning process at all, so why the exclusion? Obviously there is some stickler for the rules in charge, no doubt they were fat and bullied at school so are now in a position of power and wish to weild that power however they feel.
Interested about the 'shaved head' rule as well, wonder what they consider 'shaved' grade 3? grade 2? grade 1? If it's a grade 2 then I'd be in trouble as that's how my hair currently is, and has been for a while, and I've never had any complaints from my clients about my hairstyle, probably because my skills are what they care about and not my looks.
PC mad? Oh I think so.
As for school uniforms, I can see both sides of the story, but I am a believer that if there is a school uniform policy then it should apply to everyone with no exceptions. I don't care what race you are, or what your religious beliefs are, you play by the rules, or you are excluded, end of story.
18 March 2005, 07:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Markus
The school probably did not reprimand the black and mixed race kids as the the race card would be played. But if a white girl decides to have bradied hair, she's fair game, as you can't play the race card because you're white.
I can't see why her hairstyle would disrupt the learning process at all, so why the exclusion? Obviously there is some stickler for the rules in charge, no doubt they were fat and bullied at school so are now in a position of power and wish to weild that power however they feel.
Interested about the 'shaved head' rule as well, wonder what they consider 'shaved' grade 3? grade 2? grade 1? If it's a grade 2 then I'd be in trouble as that's how my hair currently is, and has been for a while, and I've never had any complaints from my clients about my hairstyle, probably because my skills are what they care about and not my looks.
PC mad? Oh I think so.
As for school uniforms, I can see both sides of the story, but I am a believer that if there is a school uniform policy then it should apply to everyone with no exceptions. I don't care what race you are, or what your religious beliefs are, you play by the rules, or you are excluded, end of story.
I can't see why her hairstyle would disrupt the learning process at all, so why the exclusion? Obviously there is some stickler for the rules in charge, no doubt they were fat and bullied at school so are now in a position of power and wish to weild that power however they feel.
Interested about the 'shaved head' rule as well, wonder what they consider 'shaved' grade 3? grade 2? grade 1? If it's a grade 2 then I'd be in trouble as that's how my hair currently is, and has been for a while, and I've never had any complaints from my clients about my hairstyle, probably because my skills are what they care about and not my looks.
PC mad? Oh I think so.
As for school uniforms, I can see both sides of the story, but I am a believer that if there is a school uniform policy then it should apply to everyone with no exceptions. I don't care what race you are, or what your religious beliefs are, you play by the rules, or you are excluded, end of story.
were in the **** now... white man is fast becoming an minority... we now have ethnic majoritys!!!!
PC wil be the sociial injustice that brings this country down.
Mart
18 March 2005, 07:51 PM
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We have to bow down to anything that differs from the accepted norm, and if you disagree with that, you're branded a racist/homophobe/anti-whatever ist.
I've semi-jokingly been called a "closet ****" because of my personal views on certain topics. If that is how you wish to brand me, then so be it.
It seems if you're not white then you can get away with a lot by playing the race card, as for the most part, people are too scared to stand up and say "wait a second! that's not right" because they too will be branded.
Alas there isn't much we can do to reverse this trend.
I've semi-jokingly been called a "closet ****" because of my personal views on certain topics. If that is how you wish to brand me, then so be it.
It seems if you're not white then you can get away with a lot by playing the race card, as for the most part, people are too scared to stand up and say "wait a second! that's not right" because they too will be branded.
Alas there isn't much we can do to reverse this trend.
18 March 2005, 09:37 PM
#16
from the other schools the kids come out looking smart in there UNIFORMS, shirts, ties & blazers.. there are variations on a theme, as with any groups, but they all look smart.
What did my sons school do, ?? they opted for a relaxed school uniform, and out of the gates pour a mixed bag of poloshirts sweatshirts, shirts, (no ties)
and no blazers, admittedly they are in school colours, but it dosent present the same image!!
What did my sons school do, ?? they opted for a relaxed school uniform, and out of the gates pour a mixed bag of poloshirts sweatshirts, shirts, (no ties)
and no blazers, admittedly they are in school colours, but it dosent present the same image!!
Personally, I always thought that uniform was just something else to destroy the relationship that ought to exist between form teacher and student.
Alcazar
18 March 2005, 10:19 PM
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Alcazar... way wide of the mark... it wasnt the point.
all these kids detest school uniform and wont wear it ..
but slavishly change into jeans, trainers, burberry caps nike shoes etc..
they all look like little clones!!
when i was at school we took pride in the fact that we went to our school.
and were proud of the uniform we wore.
if uniform is just a them and us thing look at your local school league tables and see what are the best performers and the worst. then see what there dress code is..
M
i thinks some what we have drifted way of the main iss
all these kids detest school uniform and wont wear it ..
but slavishly change into jeans, trainers, burberry caps nike shoes etc..
they all look like little clones!!
when i was at school we took pride in the fact that we went to our school.
and were proud of the uniform we wore.
if uniform is just a them and us thing look at your local school league tables and see what are the best performers and the worst. then see what there dress code is..
M
i thinks some what we have drifted way of the main iss
18 March 2005, 10:41 PM
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I love how people here are describing the school uniform as smart.
At the school near to where I used to live (which is a 'posh' grammar school no less) it seems to be a competition to make the uniform look as scruffy as possible, so the tie is worn with the thin end longer than the thick end and the thick end tucked into the shirt, collar button undone etc. etc. it's quite funny really
The sixth formers are made to wear suits, no requirements for school colours, so the rich/poor thing comes in again, not that they allow many poor people into that school.
Oh well
At the school near to where I used to live (which is a 'posh' grammar school no less) it seems to be a competition to make the uniform look as scruffy as possible, so the tie is worn with the thin end longer than the thick end and the thick end tucked into the shirt, collar button undone etc. etc. it's quite funny really
The sixth formers are made to wear suits, no requirements for school colours, so the rich/poor thing comes in again, not that they allow many poor people into that school.
Oh well
18 March 2005, 10:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Lum
I love how people here are describing the school uniform as smart.
At the school near to where I used to live (which is a 'posh' grammar school no less) it seems to be a competition to make the uniform look as scruffy as possible, so the tie is worn with the thin end longer than the thick end and the thick end tucked into the shirt, collar button undone etc. etc. it's quite funny really
The sixth formers are made to wear suits, no requirements for school colours, so the rich/poor thing comes in again, not that they allow many poor people into that school.
Oh well
At the school near to where I used to live (which is a 'posh' grammar school no less) it seems to be a competition to make the uniform look as scruffy as possible, so the tie is worn with the thin end longer than the thick end and the thick end tucked into the shirt, collar button undone etc. etc. it's quite funny really
The sixth formers are made to wear suits, no requirements for school colours, so the rich/poor thing comes in again, not that they allow many poor people into that school.
Oh well
19 March 2005, 11:25 AM
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Well I thought this thread was about the girl's hairstyle. If she wants to braid her hair why not? Main thing is does it look neat and tidy. If so I can see no justification for stopping her.
Les
Les
19 March 2005, 01:30 PM
#23
[QUOTE=Markus]We have to bow down to anything that differs from the accepted norm, and if you disagree with that, you're branded a racist/homophobe/anti-whatever ist.
[QUOTE]
You forgot 'Little Englander'. Whihc is anyone who resistes change because they want their kids to have the same values as them. Ie, You dont steal, cheat, rob or force people to be here.
I think it is sooo funny that finally someone is showingh how ludicrous the whole racism thing is.
If I called my mate a 'stupid lanky git' when he does something stupid, its 100% descriptive as his most striking feature that makes him different from someone else, is that he is tall and lanky.
However I call him it, because he did something stupid, not cos he is tall.
BUT!!! if his most descriptive feature was dark skin, then it would be racism unless I chose to call him a 'Banker'.
Its stupid and just shows how common sense is highjacked for personal and political gain of a small minority.
If someone set up a fund to sue every single one of these small minded people for 'misrepresentation' of the people , I would deffo pay in.
[QUOTE]
You forgot 'Little Englander'. Whihc is anyone who resistes change because they want their kids to have the same values as them. Ie, You dont steal, cheat, rob or force people to be here.
I think it is sooo funny that finally someone is showingh how ludicrous the whole racism thing is.
If I called my mate a 'stupid lanky git' when he does something stupid, its 100% descriptive as his most striking feature that makes him different from someone else, is that he is tall and lanky.
However I call him it, because he did something stupid, not cos he is tall.
BUT!!! if his most descriptive feature was dark skin, then it would be racism unless I chose to call him a 'Banker'.
Its stupid and just shows how common sense is highjacked for personal and political gain of a small minority.
If someone set up a fund to sue every single one of these small minded people for 'misrepresentation' of the people , I would deffo pay in.
19 March 2005, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Hol
I think it is sooo funny that finally someone is showingh how ludicrous the whole racism thing is.
If I called my mate a 'stupid lanky git' when he does something stupid, its 100% descriptive as his most striking feature that makes him different from someone else, is that he is tall and lanky.
However I call him it, because he did something stupid, not cos he is tall.
BUT!!! if his most descriptive feature was dark skin, then it would be racism unless I chose to call him a 'Banker'.
If I called my mate a 'stupid lanky git' when he does something stupid, its 100% descriptive as his most striking feature that makes him different from someone else, is that he is tall and lanky.
However I call him it, because he did something stupid, not cos he is tall.
BUT!!! if his most descriptive feature was dark skin, then it would be racism unless I chose to call him a 'Banker'.
On subject: they should use common sense when interpreting the skool rools - it aint axactly an anarchistic mohican she's got is it? They are showing here about as much discretion, insight and common sense as speed cams!
D
19 March 2005, 09:32 PM
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Unless race relations law has changed much in the last 20 years, this case shouldn't even get to court. Black girls are allowed to braid, white girls aren't. And if they have a school dress code which says this is acceptable, then the school dress code is illegal.
It really is that black and white. (I'll get my coat...)
It really is that black and white. (I'll get my coat...)
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