Bird Flu
Bird Flu
01 March 2005, 11:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Ray_li
wayhay going to Hong Kong Saturday to bring back toys for the scooby and bird flu
Ajax, Paul
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02 March 2005, 08:48 AM
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Much as I hate the current government, I'm not sure what you think they're doing wrong?
They've bought enough vaccines to treat a quarter of the population - if anything that's overkill and rather pointless (see below). People will moan if they don't do anything and whinge if they do when it comes to vaguely scary topics the general public doesn't understand.
Influenza virus is carried and transmitted by birds - hence 'bird flu'. Every major outbreak (except one) has begun in the Far East, usually centred in or near China. The virus jumps the species barrier on a regular basis - usually China as the locals drink water and keep pigs that they eat in the same water as where ducks swim - ducks only have one orifice through (cloaca) through which they **** and have sex, and can also drink water through it. The viral transmission only becomes an issue when the virus mutates into a freshly virulent strain - in reality a particularly new variant only appears every decade or so.
Vaccines are only partially effective as they are developed using a particular (and identified) viral strain. The vaccine will work well against the particualr strain but will gradually become less effective as that strain mutates and much less effective/ completely ineffective against a new strain.
As with many things, the media are guilty of spreading mis-informed fear - the latest viral outbreak has not yet been isolated and identified so it is too soon to suggest it is a new strain. A few deaths in China (with a population of 1bn and unbelievable secrecy about such things) does not mean it's anything to be scared of. This is a relatively regular event - I'm sure people will remember millions of chickens being killed in Hong Kong province not too many years ago to ward off a previous 'epidemic'.
In summary - don't worry about it - and let's keep criticising the government's woeful tax and spend record rather than worrying about a few preventative vaccines.
Gordo
They've bought enough vaccines to treat a quarter of the population - if anything that's overkill and rather pointless (see below). People will moan if they don't do anything and whinge if they do when it comes to vaguely scary topics the general public doesn't understand.
Influenza virus is carried and transmitted by birds - hence 'bird flu'. Every major outbreak (except one) has begun in the Far East, usually centred in or near China. The virus jumps the species barrier on a regular basis - usually China as the locals drink water and keep pigs that they eat in the same water as where ducks swim - ducks only have one orifice through (cloaca) through which they **** and have sex, and can also drink water through it. The viral transmission only becomes an issue when the virus mutates into a freshly virulent strain - in reality a particularly new variant only appears every decade or so.
Vaccines are only partially effective as they are developed using a particular (and identified) viral strain. The vaccine will work well against the particualr strain but will gradually become less effective as that strain mutates and much less effective/ completely ineffective against a new strain.
As with many things, the media are guilty of spreading mis-informed fear - the latest viral outbreak has not yet been isolated and identified so it is too soon to suggest it is a new strain. A few deaths in China (with a population of 1bn and unbelievable secrecy about such things) does not mean it's anything to be scared of. This is a relatively regular event - I'm sure people will remember millions of chickens being killed in Hong Kong province not too many years ago to ward off a previous 'epidemic'.
In summary - don't worry about it - and let's keep criticising the government's woeful tax and spend record rather than worrying about a few preventative vaccines.
Gordo
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02 March 2005, 09:47 AM
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02 March 2005, 09:56 AM
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The WHO is extremely concerned about the awful effects should this virus mutate and become transmissible from human to human. They should know after all.
Should this actually happen then the spread of the virus is likely to be so fast that the antibiotic available for 1/4 of the population will just not be enough. This is a seriously dangerous illness, not just likely ordinary old 'flu.
Your mention of "overkill" would act in the opposite way that you imagine!
The cost of the antibiotic for 1/4 of the population is £200 million, Not a lot compared with the cost to the country of a Pandemic.
Les
Should this actually happen then the spread of the virus is likely to be so fast that the antibiotic available for 1/4 of the population will just not be enough. This is a seriously dangerous illness, not just likely ordinary old 'flu.
Your mention of "overkill" would act in the opposite way that you imagine!
The cost of the antibiotic for 1/4 of the population is £200 million, Not a lot compared with the cost to the country of a Pandemic.
Les
02 March 2005, 10:01 AM
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hmm what the goverment is doing wrong.
How about buying millions of vaccines that will be worthless if a epidemic breaks out. The vaccines available now are for the strain passed from poultry to humans.
Not a great threat by any means, it is known that the virus could develop into a human to human strain,
problem is unless these vaccines are adaptable they are worthless. but no doubt there is a labour politician on the board of the supply company probabaly ordering a new bentley.
How about buying millions of vaccines that will be worthless if a epidemic breaks out. The vaccines available now are for the strain passed from poultry to humans.
Not a great threat by any means, it is known that the virus could develop into a human to human strain,
problem is unless these vaccines are adaptable they are worthless. but no doubt there is a labour politician on the board of the supply company probabaly ordering a new bentley.
02 March 2005, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Leslie
They are not buying vaccines but antibiotics to treat the illness after you have caught it.
Les
Les
These are not vaccines either, as vaccines can only be produced after the specific virus has been identified.
02 March 2005, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by alcazar
Decimation!
Without getting sentimental, as a species it is just what we need.
02 March 2005, 01:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Leslie
The cost of the antibiotic for 1/4 of the population is £200 million, Not a lot compared with the cost to the country of a Pandemic.
ooh thats about 1/4 of a war isnt it......nice
Hopefully it will be stuck to some of those cheap burberry knock offs coming from china, and take out a few million scum
02 March 2005, 06:55 PM
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ducks only have one orifice through (cloaca) through which they **** and have sex, and can also drink water through it.
SN discovery channel
03 March 2005, 09:32 AM
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Yawn, yawn. The influena virus mutates all the time. There have been something like 6 or 7 new virulent strains that crossed the species barrier (i.e. birds to humans) in the last 100 years.
There is no difference between the virus that crosses from birds to humans as from humans to humans. it's the same thing.
It is impossible to absoutely protect the whole population against it and there's no need to:
a) there is no evidence that a pandemic will occur - it never has on any of the previous 'outbreaks'. The human immune system adapts very efficiently
b) the virus hits different people in different ways. The young and the elderly are most at risk as their immune systems are not strong enough to cope as well as healthy adults. i.e. most people won't be affected by it beyond feeling a bit unwell for a day or so - big deal
c) the vaccines the government are buying are effective albeit they've bought too many IMO. They will not prevent infection or feeling sick, but will prepare the immune systems of recipients to partially cope - they've bought too many as there's no need for mass innoculation and most of the population won't be badly affected (see b above). Vaccines for older 'versions' of the virus ammeliorate the affect of newer strains - only part of the virus will have evolved.
There is a strong argument not to act at all. We can't always be a nanny state - have you noticed how old people don't die of old age any more? They die of identified things, i.e. cancer, heart disease, stroke etc - and then their relatives hop up and down demanding that the NHS should have provided better (and more expensive) treatment to prolong their suffering, I mean life.
There won't be a scary influenza outbreak - New Labour is a much greater threat to your mental health
Gordo
There is no difference between the virus that crosses from birds to humans as from humans to humans. it's the same thing.
It is impossible to absoutely protect the whole population against it and there's no need to:
a) there is no evidence that a pandemic will occur - it never has on any of the previous 'outbreaks'. The human immune system adapts very efficiently
b) the virus hits different people in different ways. The young and the elderly are most at risk as their immune systems are not strong enough to cope as well as healthy adults. i.e. most people won't be affected by it beyond feeling a bit unwell for a day or so - big deal
c) the vaccines the government are buying are effective albeit they've bought too many IMO. They will not prevent infection or feeling sick, but will prepare the immune systems of recipients to partially cope - they've bought too many as there's no need for mass innoculation and most of the population won't be badly affected (see b above). Vaccines for older 'versions' of the virus ammeliorate the affect of newer strains - only part of the virus will have evolved.
There is a strong argument not to act at all. We can't always be a nanny state - have you noticed how old people don't die of old age any more? They die of identified things, i.e. cancer, heart disease, stroke etc - and then their relatives hop up and down demanding that the NHS should have provided better (and more expensive) treatment to prolong their suffering, I mean life.
There won't be a scary influenza outbreak - New Labour is a much greater threat to your mental health
Gordo
03 March 2005, 03:28 PM
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Looks Like TB/GW Bush are going to miss out North Korea ond go straight for China - I Heard they were manufacturing these weapons of mass duckstruction.
Coat, Hat - I'm outta here
Coat, Hat - I'm outta here
12 March 2005, 04:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Ray_li
coming home tomorrow and will be back in uk on the 13th but back at work on the 15th. would it be a good op to say i've got a bit of a cold?
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