Labour are doing a cr4p job!!
28 November 2004, 12:58 PM
#1
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Labour are doing a cr4p job!!
Some on SN would say - so, logically, the Tories should be about to wipe Labour from the political map ................
So, could someone explain this?:-
Michael Howard's Conservatives are trailing Labour by a wider margin than in their landslide general election defeat under William Hague, according to a new poll.
The survey, published in the Independent on Sunday, put the Tories on 31%, some 11 points behind Labour's 42%.
In a further blow to Mr Howard, those taking part rated Charles Kennedy's Liberal Democrats as a more effective opposition to Labour than the Tories.
In a mark of how far Mr Howard has to go to convince voters he is on the winning side, the survey found 42% of those questioned expected the Conservatives to remain out of power for 10 years or more - rising to 53% of younger voters in the 18 to 24 age group.
Mr Kennedy has made replacing the Conservatives as the effective opposition in Westminster his key goal for this Parliament.
The survey suggested 44% of voters believed he had achieved his aim, compared to 41% who said the Tories still provided the main opposition to Tony Blair's Government.
Among non-Tory voters, the margin was even wider, with 53% plumping for the Lib Dems as the effective opposition, against 34% for the Conservatives.
But the Liberal Democrats still trailed the Tories by 11 points on voting intention, with 20%.
The poll suggested that the Conservatives are doing significantly less well now than under former leader Iain Duncan Smith.
In the final months before Mr Duncan Smith's removal a bloodless coup in November 2003, Labour enjoyed an average lead in the polls of just five points. The Tories secured 35.2% of the vote in the 2001 election against Labour's 41.4% - a margin of 6.2 points.
Can I, finally, get agreement on SN that the Tories are finished?
That Labour WILL be in power for, at least, another decade
And that I have been talking absolute sense all these years?
Carry on, Blair - the country is behind you!
Pete
So, could someone explain this?:-
Michael Howard's Conservatives are trailing Labour by a wider margin than in their landslide general election defeat under William Hague, according to a new poll.
The survey, published in the Independent on Sunday, put the Tories on 31%, some 11 points behind Labour's 42%.
In a further blow to Mr Howard, those taking part rated Charles Kennedy's Liberal Democrats as a more effective opposition to Labour than the Tories.
In a mark of how far Mr Howard has to go to convince voters he is on the winning side, the survey found 42% of those questioned expected the Conservatives to remain out of power for 10 years or more - rising to 53% of younger voters in the 18 to 24 age group.
Mr Kennedy has made replacing the Conservatives as the effective opposition in Westminster his key goal for this Parliament.
The survey suggested 44% of voters believed he had achieved his aim, compared to 41% who said the Tories still provided the main opposition to Tony Blair's Government.
Among non-Tory voters, the margin was even wider, with 53% plumping for the Lib Dems as the effective opposition, against 34% for the Conservatives.
But the Liberal Democrats still trailed the Tories by 11 points on voting intention, with 20%.
The poll suggested that the Conservatives are doing significantly less well now than under former leader Iain Duncan Smith.
In the final months before Mr Duncan Smith's removal a bloodless coup in November 2003, Labour enjoyed an average lead in the polls of just five points. The Tories secured 35.2% of the vote in the 2001 election against Labour's 41.4% - a margin of 6.2 points.
Can I, finally, get agreement on SN that the Tories are finished?
That Labour WILL be in power for, at least, another decade
And that I have been talking absolute sense all these years?
Carry on, Blair - the country is behind you!
Pete
28 November 2004, 01:05 PM
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No No No No NO
that answer your question pete!!!
and to make you really special and part of the labour doctrine
send me all your money,, there going to fleece you anyway
never in my life have i been so opposed to a ruling government....
if you embrace it that strongly pete
bog of to europe and become a model citizen!!!!!!
Mart
that answer your question pete!!!
and to make you really special and part of the labour doctrine
send me all your money,, there going to fleece you anyway
never in my life have i been so opposed to a ruling government....
if you embrace it that strongly pete
bog of to europe and become a model citizen!!!!!!
Mart
28 November 2004, 01:09 PM
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Yes many (inc me) would say Labour are doing a cr@p job, but that doesnt automatically mean they think Tories would do a better job.
Thats the problem - who do you vote for who'll stick up for the average person??
Thats the problem - who do you vote for who'll stick up for the average person??
28 November 2004, 01:11 PM
#6
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On the contrary, if you hate it here ...... LEAVE!
Its simple, even for the village idiots
I will assume, quite correctly, that if you stay and choose to live in the UK led by Labour that you are happy to do so!
So STOP the bl00dy moaning - LEAVE, and close the door behind you ............ we need winners here not losers who just whinge and moan and whinge and moan and whinge and moan
BUT DO NOTHING!!
Pete
Its simple, even for the village idiots
I will assume, quite correctly, that if you stay and choose to live in the UK led by Labour that you are happy to do so!
So STOP the bl00dy moaning - LEAVE, and close the door behind you ............ we need winners here not losers who just whinge and moan and whinge and moan and whinge and moan
BUT DO NOTHING!!
Pete
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28 November 2004, 01:15 PM
#8
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Originally Posted by Chip
Pete,
Friendship over mate. Labour are nothing but a bunch of W@ankers.
Chip
Friendship over mate. Labour are nothing but a bunch of W@ankers.
Chip
Pete
28 November 2004, 01:18 PM
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Originally Posted by pslewis
On the contrary, if you hate it here ...... LEAVE!
Its simple, even for the village idiots
Its simple, even for the village idiots
28 November 2004, 01:19 PM
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It is interesting that there would appear to be no alternative to Labour. I agree that the Tories are probably dead in the water and there are still a lot of people who will not forget them giving the police a pay rise to beat the crap out of the miners.
However, just because Labour are the only alternative doesn't mean to say that they are the best alternative or are any good for the country. You need only look at post revolution Russia to see how Stalin put himself in a position to be the "only alternative" despite not even having a lot of support within the Party. When Lenin died Stalin was the "only alternative" because he used a lot of nasty tricks to create that situation, I don't think poor Trotsky even knew that he wasn't in the running until he came to take control and found another bloke in his seat, and he hid his evil intentions in spin and bluster while he went about murdering and imprisioning anyone who didn't take his fancy. He also encouraged everyone in the country to report wrong-doers to him, just like all these Labour government "hotlines" where you can report people for a wide range of crimes. Anyone with an interest in such things will find the parallels quite remarkable.
Now, the Labour party have to be somewhat more careful than Stalin but if they get another term then I suspect that they may see it as a ticket to develop their oppression of the peasants, and those who are not part of their cause within the industrial proletariat, even further.
Many people who might gloat because they see Labour as the only alternative may not be so gloating when the realise the full consequences of a one party state led by a massive ego bent on enforcing his will upon the people whether they like it or not.
To be honest Pete your post is more frightening than anything else. Anyone for 25 years in Siberia for not agreeing with Pete? That time is coming soon.
However, just because Labour are the only alternative doesn't mean to say that they are the best alternative or are any good for the country. You need only look at post revolution Russia to see how Stalin put himself in a position to be the "only alternative" despite not even having a lot of support within the Party. When Lenin died Stalin was the "only alternative" because he used a lot of nasty tricks to create that situation, I don't think poor Trotsky even knew that he wasn't in the running until he came to take control and found another bloke in his seat, and he hid his evil intentions in spin and bluster while he went about murdering and imprisioning anyone who didn't take his fancy. He also encouraged everyone in the country to report wrong-doers to him, just like all these Labour government "hotlines" where you can report people for a wide range of crimes. Anyone with an interest in such things will find the parallels quite remarkable.
Now, the Labour party have to be somewhat more careful than Stalin but if they get another term then I suspect that they may see it as a ticket to develop their oppression of the peasants, and those who are not part of their cause within the industrial proletariat, even further.
Many people who might gloat because they see Labour as the only alternative may not be so gloating when the realise the full consequences of a one party state led by a massive ego bent on enforcing his will upon the people whether they like it or not.
To be honest Pete your post is more frightening than anything else. Anyone for 25 years in Siberia for not agreeing with Pete? That time is coming soon.
28 November 2004, 01:21 PM
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I'm afraid we all took the spin and bulls**t that came with Tony Blair and his cronies with 'New Labour' and voted them in and now we are paying for it.
We have never been as highly taxed as we are now, we are now living in a virtual police state where innoccent people are being fleeced i.e. car drivers
and criminals are getting away with murder due to the beurecracy that comes with Labour who also seem to be railroading us all into joining the Euro whether we like it or not.
The alternative i'm afraid is not too good.
The Tory party at this moment in time is a waste of space and until we boot out Michael Howard and replace him with a strong leader with a bit of clout and charisma then i can only see Labour getting in again and if they do we are all f****d.
We have never been as highly taxed as we are now, we are now living in a virtual police state where innoccent people are being fleeced i.e. car drivers
and criminals are getting away with murder due to the beurecracy that comes with Labour who also seem to be railroading us all into joining the Euro whether we like it or not.
The alternative i'm afraid is not too good.
The Tory party at this moment in time is a waste of space and until we boot out Michael Howard and replace him with a strong leader with a bit of clout and charisma then i can only see Labour getting in again and if they do we are all f****d.
28 November 2004, 01:24 PM
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Thread Starter
We have NEVER had it so good!
Lowest Unemployment
Lowest Interest Rates
Your houses have gone up by an average £100,000 !! Yes, thats right!
And all Labour are asking for is a small amount back to make the NHS, Schools and Infrastructure World Class ................ and you moan and cry!?
Pathetic!
Pete
Lowest Unemployment
Lowest Interest Rates
Your houses have gone up by an average £100,000 !! Yes, thats right!
And all Labour are asking for is a small amount back to make the NHS, Schools and Infrastructure World Class ................ and you moan and cry!?
Pathetic!
Pete
28 November 2004, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by The Chief
I'm afraid we all took the spin and bulls**t that came with Tony Blair and his cronies with 'New Labour' and voted them in and now we are paying for it.
28 November 2004, 01:31 PM
#16
Biggest amount of personal debt and personal borrowing ever.
Houses have gone up, but so have taxes and average worker wages have remained far behind the % proportional level of increase. In short, refering to and average bank statement: more money out and less money in.
So what houses are worth 100K more it means nothing, the wages don't cover the asking price. Equating to big time borrowing. Add that the average houshold spending is through the roof, even on basic consumables. We've never had it so bad! There is a lovely ticking bomb.
Houses have gone up, but so have taxes and average worker wages have remained far behind the % proportional level of increase. In short, refering to and average bank statement: more money out and less money in.
So what houses are worth 100K more it means nothing, the wages don't cover the asking price. Equating to big time borrowing. Add that the average houshold spending is through the roof, even on basic consumables. We've never had it so bad! There is a lovely ticking bomb.
28 November 2004, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by pslewis
Average wage is £35k - whats wrong with THAT!?
Granted, its a struggle on that money - but, life has always been like that!
Pete
Granted, its a struggle on that money - but, life has always been like that!
Pete
Average wage is closer to £26k. If you think life is a struggle on £35k, care to comment on how people can cope on £26k? Go on, give them the benefit of your NL wisdom.
Last edited by FlightMan; 28 November 2004 at 08:21 PM.
28 November 2004, 01:53 PM
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Hey Pete, I was feeling you until you said.
Went a bit too far with that one.
I can't believe the Tory's actually think that Howard is more electable than IDS, infact I can't believe they think he is electable at all.
I dont care how poor Labour is supposed to be or how good the Tory's are promising they will be I could never vote for that two faced, Thatcher loving, slimeball that is Howard. The man hasn't got an ounce of conviction or a single backbone in his body.
Cheers
Lee
And that I have been talking absolute sense all these years?
I can't believe the Tory's actually think that Howard is more electable than IDS, infact I can't believe they think he is electable at all.
I dont care how poor Labour is supposed to be or how good the Tory's are promising they will be I could never vote for that two faced, Thatcher loving, slimeball that is Howard. The man hasn't got an ounce of conviction or a single backbone in his body.
Cheers
Lee
28 November 2004, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by pslewis
We have NEVER had it so good!
Lowest Unemployment
Lowest Interest Rates
Your houses have gone up by an average £100,000 !! Yes, thats right!
And all Labour are asking for is a small amount back to make the NHS, Schools and Infrastructure World Class ................ and you moan and cry!?
Pathetic!
Pete
Lowest Unemployment
Lowest Interest Rates
Your houses have gone up by an average £100,000 !! Yes, thats right!
And all Labour are asking for is a small amount back to make the NHS, Schools and Infrastructure World Class ................ and you moan and cry!?
Pathetic!
Pete
.......Were at the end of a boom now, house prices are already crashing, trillion pounds of debt is starting to take its toll - noticed the reports on christmas high street spending recently? And oh less people claiming income support but funny how theres a hell of a lot of people of incapacity instead....
28 November 2004, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by FlightMan
Average wage is closer to £26k.
Cheers
Lee
28 November 2004, 05:03 PM
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You realluy ought to get your facts right before you shoot your mouth off PSL.
Who can believe a poll these days anyway. Far too small a sample and they can be made to say whatever you want.
Les
Who can believe a poll these days anyway. Far too small a sample and they can be made to say whatever you want.
Les
28 November 2004, 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by pslewis
We have NEVER had it so good!
Lowest Unemployment
Lowest Interest Rates
Your houses have gone up by an average £100,000 !! Yes, thats right!
And all Labour are asking for is a small amount back to make the NHS, Schools and Infrastructure World Class ................ and you moan and cry!?
Pathetic!
Pete
Lowest Unemployment
Lowest Interest Rates
Your houses have gone up by an average £100,000 !! Yes, thats right!
And all Labour are asking for is a small amount back to make the NHS, Schools and Infrastructure World Class ................ and you moan and cry!?
Pathetic!
Pete
along with our currency and the fact that a whole history will be wiped put by some power mad muppet..
why is it that every labour government floats the euro president idea??
do they not realise that all the rest of europe wants to do is asset strip us and dump all there problems on us!!!
billy liar uses the US as his model on which the presidancy ethic is based..
however he is so blinkered he misses the fundamental reason why the US works...
WHY??? because they all swear aleigance to the flag, no matter what ethic, creed, race, colour or religion,,, they are all free to practice, but they are BOUND and ABIDE by the laws they swore alliagence to..
unlike the fecked up system he would have... all free to do wah t they want and then cop out on every human rights escape clause they could find.
you cant have unity and integration without everyone singing from the same hymn sheet..
you only have to look at his houshold to see the rift him and her both have different ideas of what they want and will work..
go on pete have the courage of your blinkered convictions ... go live in euroland..
M
28 November 2004, 06:11 PM
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Originally Posted by pslewis
Average wage is £35k - whats wrong with THAT!?
Granted, its a struggle on that money - but, life has always been like that!
Pete
Granted, its a struggle on that money - but, life has always been like that!
Pete
Failing that, fix that short circuit between your @rsehole and your mouth.
28 November 2004, 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted by mart360
And surrender our sovereignty the whole thing which makes us what we are..
along with our currency and the fact that a whole history will be wiped put by some power mad muppet..
why is it that every labour government floats the euro president idea??
do they not realise that all the rest of europe wants to do is asset strip us and dump all there problems on us!!!
billy liar uses the US as his model on which the presidancy ethic is based..
however he is so blinkered he misses the fundamental reason why the US works...
WHY??? because they all swear aleigance to the flag, no matter what ethic, creed, race, colour or religion,,, they are all free to practice, but they are BOUND and ABIDE by the laws they swore alliagence to..
unlike the fecked up system he would have... all free to do wah t they want and then cop out on every human rights escape clause they could find.
you cant have unity and integration without everyone singing from the same hymn sheet..
you only have to look at his houshold to see the rift him and her both have different ideas of what they want and will work..
go on pete have the courage of your blinkered convictions ... go live in euroland..
M
along with our currency and the fact that a whole history will be wiped put by some power mad muppet..
why is it that every labour government floats the euro president idea??
do they not realise that all the rest of europe wants to do is asset strip us and dump all there problems on us!!!
billy liar uses the US as his model on which the presidancy ethic is based..
however he is so blinkered he misses the fundamental reason why the US works...
WHY??? because they all swear aleigance to the flag, no matter what ethic, creed, race, colour or religion,,, they are all free to practice, but they are BOUND and ABIDE by the laws they swore alliagence to..
unlike the fecked up system he would have... all free to do wah t they want and then cop out on every human rights escape clause they could find.
you cant have unity and integration without everyone singing from the same hymn sheet..
you only have to look at his houshold to see the rift him and her both have different ideas of what they want and will work..
go on pete have the courage of your blinkered convictions ... go live in euroland..
M
28 November 2004, 06:17 PM
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Yaka,yaka,yaka................
Tony will win the next election.its a historical FACT.no party has EVER gone from a 150 majority to defeat.
Its the election after that counts.
(see you all in 2010)
Tony will win the next election.its a historical FACT.no party has EVER gone from a 150 majority to defeat.
Its the election after that counts.
(see you all in 2010)