Buying a used car - a rant
27 November 2004, 08:28 PM
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Buying a used car - a rant
<rant>
Today I've been looking at used cars. I want a second car that I can use for my (rather dull) commute to work and for trips to DIY stores and so on - basically, those times when it's pointless or undesirable to take the scooby. All things considered, I've pretty much settled on a Mk II Nissan Primera and a budget of about £1500. So, this morning I trawled the classified ads and picked out four to go and look at, then phoned to arrange viewings.
No. 1 was described by the dealer as 'nothing much to look at, but mechanically OK'. I took the hint, mumbled something non-committal and put a big X through it. No need to waste time looking at something scruffy when there's so many around.
So, I headed off to see no. 2. It was covered in little scratches and rusting stone chips and the front bumper was cracked. The dealer had described it as being in 'excellent' condition and asserted that 'at this age you'd expect every panel to have dents and scratches in it'. I took the car for a quick spin anyway just for reference - the clutch was grabby and there was a knock from the suspension. 0/2 so far, what a muppet. (No offence to SN's own Muppet forum regulars).
On the way back I spotted another car on a driveway with a 'for sale' note in the window, so I knocked on the door and enquired. The three foot long dent all along the passenger side which had been painted over with a brush was described as 'barely noticeable unless you're looking for it'. Erm... no.
So, off to see car no. 4. The owner wasn't in after all. The bodywork looked immaculate in the failing light, but the driver's door was sitting slightly proud of the B pillar. Can't think of any excuse for this that doesn't involve accident damage. Time to move on.
It was dark by the time I found no. 5, but it looked OK in the gloom. The back bumper (plastic) had clearly taken a nudge, but the bodywork was otherwise sound. The engine oil was clean, it had a warranty book full of stamps and came with all the old MOTs - and it's a high spec model too with lots of toys. Finally, perhaps we're getting somewhere? It drove OK - a slightly sticky clutch and a few rattles, perhaps - but the aircon doesn't work well and makes odd hissing noises every couple of minutes.
Are my expectations just too high, or are there a few gems amongst all the crap out there? Should I just go for no. 5 (and budget for a complete overhaul of the aircon - I expect the worst) or keep looking?
Why don't people look after their cars? My old scooby had 70k miles on it and, a few inevitable stone chips and car park dings aside, it was immaculate. What kind of moron expects 'scratches and dents in every panel' in a 100k car - or expects me to believe that anyone has such expectations?
</rant>
Today I've been looking at used cars. I want a second car that I can use for my (rather dull) commute to work and for trips to DIY stores and so on - basically, those times when it's pointless or undesirable to take the scooby. All things considered, I've pretty much settled on a Mk II Nissan Primera and a budget of about £1500. So, this morning I trawled the classified ads and picked out four to go and look at, then phoned to arrange viewings.
No. 1 was described by the dealer as 'nothing much to look at, but mechanically OK'. I took the hint, mumbled something non-committal and put a big X through it. No need to waste time looking at something scruffy when there's so many around.
So, I headed off to see no. 2. It was covered in little scratches and rusting stone chips and the front bumper was cracked. The dealer had described it as being in 'excellent' condition and asserted that 'at this age you'd expect every panel to have dents and scratches in it'. I took the car for a quick spin anyway just for reference - the clutch was grabby and there was a knock from the suspension. 0/2 so far, what a muppet. (No offence to SN's own Muppet forum regulars).
On the way back I spotted another car on a driveway with a 'for sale' note in the window, so I knocked on the door and enquired. The three foot long dent all along the passenger side which had been painted over with a brush was described as 'barely noticeable unless you're looking for it'. Erm... no.
So, off to see car no. 4. The owner wasn't in after all. The bodywork looked immaculate in the failing light, but the driver's door was sitting slightly proud of the B pillar. Can't think of any excuse for this that doesn't involve accident damage. Time to move on.
It was dark by the time I found no. 5, but it looked OK in the gloom. The back bumper (plastic) had clearly taken a nudge, but the bodywork was otherwise sound. The engine oil was clean, it had a warranty book full of stamps and came with all the old MOTs - and it's a high spec model too with lots of toys. Finally, perhaps we're getting somewhere? It drove OK - a slightly sticky clutch and a few rattles, perhaps - but the aircon doesn't work well and makes odd hissing noises every couple of minutes.
Are my expectations just too high, or are there a few gems amongst all the crap out there? Should I just go for no. 5 (and budget for a complete overhaul of the aircon - I expect the worst) or keep looking?
Why don't people look after their cars? My old scooby had 70k miles on it and, a few inevitable stone chips and car park dings aside, it was immaculate. What kind of moron expects 'scratches and dents in every panel' in a 100k car - or expects me to believe that anyone has such expectations?
</rant>
27 November 2004, 08:44 PM
#2
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Searching for a good used car is a pain in the rear end - quite why people say cars are immaculate and then you go to see a ScrapYard contender is beyond me 
I now will not travel much over 10 miles to see a car - been pi55ed off too many times!
However, that said - £1500 should get a decent car in the current climate, all you have done is seen the dregs that have been around for weeks ....... once you have a week or two under your belt you will get a 'feel' for the market
I went to see an MX5 at a dealers last week (7 miles away!) - described as STUNNING!! Hmmmmmmm, dents all along the passenger side -"That'll just cost £25 to sort them mate" said the dealer.
Last service carried out according to the 'Fully Stamped' book 300 miles ago - so, why was the oil like treacle, BLACK treacle!!
And why wouldn't the oil filler cap come off? It had been glued in place for some reason?????
Stunning!! Pah, HUMBUG!!
Dealers are, almost without exception, a bunch of liars and conmen!
The ladies and thickos get taken in by them don't they?
Pete
I now will not travel much over 10 miles to see a car - been pi55ed off too many times!
However, that said - £1500 should get a decent car in the current climate, all you have done is seen the dregs that have been around for weeks ....... once you have a week or two under your belt you will get a 'feel' for the market
I went to see an MX5 at a dealers last week (7 miles away!) - described as STUNNING!! Hmmmmmmm, dents all along the passenger side -"That'll just cost £25 to sort them mate" said the dealer.
Last service carried out according to the 'Fully Stamped' book 300 miles ago - so, why was the oil like treacle, BLACK treacle!!
And why wouldn't the oil filler cap come off? It had been glued in place for some reason?????
Stunning!! Pah, HUMBUG!!
Dealers are, almost without exception, a bunch of liars and conmen!
The ladies and thickos get taken in by them don't they?
Pete
27 November 2004, 09:02 PM
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in the days of dig cameras and the net there is NO reason to look at a car that turns out iffy.
find your car on trader or ebay and get lots of photos sent.
i have sold 3 cars on the net and ppl PAID IN FULL prior to even seeing them in the flesh! maybe extreme examples but shows you can get/give enough info via pics/scanned history to cover 80% of what a buyer is after.
T
find your car on trader or ebay and get lots of photos sent.
i have sold 3 cars on the net and ppl PAID IN FULL prior to even seeing them in the flesh! maybe extreme examples but shows you can get/give enough info via pics/scanned history to cover 80% of what a buyer is after.
T
27 November 2004, 09:07 PM
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I would, but I'm just not that good at spotting the garbage without a proper inspection and a test drive. I've bought a few turkeys in the past and I want to give myself the best possible chance of not making the same mistake again!
There's a reason my two Scoobies have both been brand new...
There's a reason my two Scoobies have both been brand new...
27 November 2004, 09:11 PM
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Tiggs: how many people do you realistically think would be willing or able to do that?
I don't mind travelling a bit to find a car that really is worth buying - but when people are prepared to describe as 'excellent' a car that's covered in chips and scratches, would I trust them to photograph the damage or just the panels that looked OK? Car #4 (above) would have looked OK in pics, the door not lining up was pretty subtle but enough to make me want to walk away.
I don't mind travelling a bit to find a car that really is worth buying - but when people are prepared to describe as 'excellent' a car that's covered in chips and scratches, would I trust them to photograph the damage or just the panels that looked OK? Car #4 (above) would have looked OK in pics, the door not lining up was pretty subtle but enough to make me want to walk away.
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27 November 2004, 09:19 PM
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I expect "this car is cheap because it's a pile of ****e - I have a better one but it'll cost you more".
I don't want, "you should expect it to be even worse" - or "this enormous botched repair is hardly noticeable".
I'm tight-fisted, not stupid, that's all!
I don't want, "you should expect it to be even worse" - or "this enormous botched repair is hardly noticeable".
I'm tight-fisted, not stupid, that's all!
27 November 2004, 09:38 PM
#11
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1990 VOLKSWAGEN Corrado 1.8 16v,
G reg. 6 mths MoT, clifford full closure alarm, lots of new parts, lots of receipts & service history. £1,000 . no offers.
Tel: 07734 308572
G reg. 6 mths MoT, clifford full closure alarm, lots of new parts, lots of receipts & service history. £1,000 . no offers.
Tel: 07734 308572
27 November 2004, 09:39 PM
#12
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1985 MERCEDES-BENZ 280 CE COUPE
1 family owner from new, good condition,extremely reliable, fun to drive. C Reg,2 door,2800cc,auto,180K miles,metallic silver,alloys,MoT 0705, beige velour interior,electric sunroof/windows, central locking,alarm. 180000 miles. £1000.
Tel: 07885 827426
1 family owner from new, good condition,extremely reliable, fun to drive. C Reg,2 door,2800cc,auto,180K miles,metallic silver,alloys,MoT 0705, beige velour interior,electric sunroof/windows, central locking,alarm. 180000 miles. £1000.
Tel: 07885 827426
27 November 2004, 09:40 PM
#13
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1996 VAUXHALL VECTRA 2.0 GLS 5dr Auto [AC] Hatchback
Silver. A/C, ABS, Alloy wheels. Lots of history. 2 owners from new. Recon box at 120k. MOT June 05. Tax July 05. 161000 miles. £1100.
Tel: 01932 429804
Silver. A/C, ABS, Alloy wheels. Lots of history. 2 owners from new. Recon box at 120k. MOT June 05. Tax July 05. 161000 miles. £1100.
Tel: 01932 429804
27 November 2004, 09:41 PM
#14
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1996 FORD MONDEO 2.0 GHIA X,
N reg. 59000 miles, silver, very well equipped incl., abs, e/w/m/s/r, r/locking, air/con, cruise, cd-changer, leather seats. F/S/H, MoT/tax. £1,100.
Tel: (0118) 9722808
N reg. 59000 miles, silver, very well equipped incl., abs, e/w/m/s/r, r/locking, air/con, cruise, cd-changer, leather seats. F/S/H, MoT/tax. £1,100.
Tel: (0118) 9722808
27 November 2004, 09:43 PM
#15
Scooby Regular
1997 HONDA CIVIC 1.5i LS 3dr Auto Hatchback
2 owners from new. Metalic grey. Sunroof, ABS, Anti theft system, Central locking, Electric windows, Passenger airbag. 47000 miles. £2000.
Tel: 07958 499323
2 owners from new. Metalic grey. Sunroof, ABS, Anti theft system, Central locking, Electric windows, Passenger airbag. 47000 miles. £2000.
Tel: 07958 499323
27 November 2004, 09:46 PM
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Hm...
1996 TOYOTA BLANDBOXO 2.0 cut-n-shut
N reg, but any plate on request. 41200 miles since it was last clocked. Both halves in mint condition for age. Half cloth seats, drilled brake lines, alloy headrests, full dodgy dealer service history. £1500
1996 TOYOTA BLANDBOXO 2.0 cut-n-shut
N reg, but any plate on request. 41200 miles since it was last clocked. Both halves in mint condition for age. Half cloth seats, drilled brake lines, alloy headrests, full dodgy dealer service history. £1500
27 November 2004, 10:15 PM
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The old fool has got hold of Matron's AutoTrader!
Had you considered a diesel Mercedes Andy? £1,500 should get you a decent 5 cylinder 190 on a late plate, you have to watch out for ex mini-cabs and take as careful a look at the owner as you do the car of course... Im going to get a C class diesel to replace my dielsel FIAT run about after Christmas; £2,400 with FSH ffs!
Simon
Had you considered a diesel Mercedes Andy? £1,500 should get you a decent 5 cylinder 190 on a late plate, you have to watch out for ex mini-cabs and take as careful a look at the owner as you do the car of course... Im going to get a C class diesel to replace my dielsel FIAT run about after Christmas; £2,400 with FSH ffs!
Simon
27 November 2004, 10:22 PM
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The older ones are excellent; Im wondering about the first C-Class's though... Ive heard a number of people complain about the quality of newer cars; and wtf is an A-Class eh?
27 November 2004, 10:56 PM
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I don't know anything about them - aren't they a bit thirsty? It's got to be cheaper to run than the scooby 
Is there a buyers' guide anywhere?
Is there a buyers' guide anywhere?
29 November 2004, 08:34 PM
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its a buyers market, ask for photos of EVERY panel!
the guy that bought my wifes scenic of ebay ask for that and got 64 pics.......he wanted close ups of tyres, rims, pedals, seat fabric, panels....etc.
paid what i wanted, arrived, got in car...drove it round the block then left.
worked with my £3k scenic and worked with my 20k 540 sport.
T
the guy that bought my wifes scenic of ebay ask for that and got 64 pics.......he wanted close ups of tyres, rims, pedals, seat fabric, panels....etc.
paid what i wanted, arrived, got in car...drove it round the block then left.
worked with my £3k scenic and worked with my 20k 540 sport.
T
23 December 2004, 09:53 PM
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A quick update
I took the day off to go and have another look at car no. 5 (the Primera with dodgy a/c) in daylight, so I took the opportunity to go and look at some other models too. Cars were:
- two identical Audi 80 diesel estates. The first looked good on the outside but had no oil at all showing on the dipstick, the owner looked surprised (yeah, right). The second had a passenger door a different colour from the rest of the car and horrendous overspray. Why couldn't the b*stard just tell me over the phone?
- a Toyota Carina E hatch, top book price but described as mint. The sleazy salesman politely offered to open the bonnet for me - fine - and was then called away as the phone rang. Then I found out why he'd been so keen to assist, the front grille fell off in my hand
The interior and boot were well worn, the car had clearly had a hard life and was worth no more than 2/3 the screen price. I couldn't get out fast enough.
- A Mazda 323F 2.0 V6. Absolutely immaculate, good service history, clean oil. Result! But no, the coolant is brown and I determine that a head gasket replacement (for just one bank of cylinders) is a whopping £600. Not a risk I'm prepared to take, which is a real shame as it was otherwise a lovely motor.
- A Honda Accord 2.2 Vtec. A little bit scruffy, but the problem is really that it's not economical or practical enough - I already have a thirsty 4 door saloon, after all. Also the owner obviously likes his cars - there's a brand new Evo on the drive - and the Honda feels a bit saggy like it's been driven hard.
So, with only an hour or so of daylight left, I go back for a second look at the Primera. It's not immaculate, but I don't care - this is a car for trips to supermarket car parks, after all - and no alarm bells are ringing. So, with another £75 negotiated off the price I finally get to drive home.
The next day I get the a/c looked at - it'll be £360 for a new condenser, so I'll pass until the summer - and the day after it's two new tyres (for less than the price of one boot for the scooby!) and a CD player. Mechanically all seems well, all it needs is an oil change which is a month or two overdue.
I took the day off to go and have another look at car no. 5 (the Primera with dodgy a/c) in daylight, so I took the opportunity to go and look at some other models too. Cars were:
- two identical Audi 80 diesel estates. The first looked good on the outside but had no oil at all showing on the dipstick, the owner looked surprised (yeah, right). The second had a passenger door a different colour from the rest of the car and horrendous overspray. Why couldn't the b*stard just tell me over the phone?
- a Toyota Carina E hatch, top book price but described as mint. The sleazy salesman politely offered to open the bonnet for me - fine - and was then called away as the phone rang. Then I found out why he'd been so keen to assist, the front grille fell off in my hand
The interior and boot were well worn, the car had clearly had a hard life and was worth no more than 2/3 the screen price. I couldn't get out fast enough.- A Mazda 323F 2.0 V6. Absolutely immaculate, good service history, clean oil. Result! But no, the coolant is brown and I determine that a head gasket replacement (for just one bank of cylinders) is a whopping £600. Not a risk I'm prepared to take, which is a real shame as it was otherwise a lovely motor.
- A Honda Accord 2.2 Vtec. A little bit scruffy, but the problem is really that it's not economical or practical enough - I already have a thirsty 4 door saloon, after all. Also the owner obviously likes his cars - there's a brand new Evo on the drive - and the Honda feels a bit saggy like it's been driven hard.
So, with only an hour or so of daylight left, I go back for a second look at the Primera. It's not immaculate, but I don't care - this is a car for trips to supermarket car parks, after all - and no alarm bells are ringing. So, with another £75 negotiated off the price I finally get to drive home.
The next day I get the a/c looked at - it'll be £360 for a new condenser, so I'll pass until the summer - and the day after it's two new tyres (for less than the price of one boot for the scooby!) and a CD player. Mechanically all seems well, all it needs is an oil change which is a month or two overdue.
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