bloke

Something I haven't seen for a while...a woman heavily pregnant smoking...

I found it quite repulsive...almost wanted to speak to her about it.

Anyone else feel the same?

Puff The Magic Wagon!

iTrader: (2)

Don't worry m8 - you're not alone

I find ALL smoking repulsive

imlach

I'm sad to say that at the maternity entrance to the Royal Infirmary in Edinburgh, it is all too common to see expectant mothers smoking outside the building.

We're not talking 1 or 2 women a month, but loads of women per day

All heavily pregnant.

catherine666

To be honest its only men that would say something like that. Because i think that smoking 2 or 3 a day esspecially if ur heavily pregnant is fine, its only at the beggining of the pregnancy that its really bad and dangerous. Anyway do you have any idea how hard it is to give up if you've been smoking for a long time not to mention the stress!!!!

imlach

Catherine666 - if you're for real, you're going to get mauled on here.

The effects are not just stunted growth in the early stages.....there ARE detrimental effects on the baby at all stages.

IMHO, it's pretty selfish to impose your smoking on your child at ANY stage (pre & post birth). Yes, we understand it is hard to give up, but most people would sacrafice a lot for their children.

Jerome

I'm a smoker and I still find it extremely disconcerting to see a pregnant woman smoking. Probably hypocritical to say it though.

If having a child isn't enough motivation to give up, then maybe those women concerned should reconsider having children in the first place - at least until you can give up that is.

I don't accept it is only harmful at the beginning. It's probably more harmful at the beginning, but still harmful through the rest of the pregnancy.

This article seems to support my theory.

fatherpierre

Catherine, I suppose having the odd 10 pints of Stella or the odd wrap of heroin is ok as long as it's in moderation?

Nothing like giving your kids the best start in life by having them pop out wanting a ***.

That was one stupid, stupid comment.

scoobypreza

I'm with you on that one Puff.

When I lived at home my parents were both heavy smokers. I hated it
I would dread bringing anyone home to my house as I knew the house would be stinking. No matter how much I avoided my mum and dad when they were smoking I would always end up leaving the house stinking.
I used to have massive arguments with my parents because they would shout at me for waving the smoke from my face if they were smoking on the same room as me. I spent most of my teenage years in my bedroom because I couldn't bear to be in the living room full of smoke.

I would spend the entire journey in a car feeling sick because my mum would be smoking away without a thought that the car would be filling up with smoke. Don't even get me started on people smoking when driving!!!!

I always vowed that when I got my own house I would never let anyone smoke in it. My dad complains now because I shove him out of my back door when he wants to light up. And then he leaves his horrible *** ends littering by my door. He doesn't even consider that I might find it repulsive.

The thing is I have no objection to someone smoking.
If you want to do it that’s fine. Its your choice and you are perfectly entitled to take what ever risks you want with your body.
But for me it is not my choice. I know there are endless arguments about passive smoking. I wont start that one!!!!

And now I'm pregnant............
As a lot of you know I've had a complicated pregnancy so far.
When I go to the hospital it breaks my heart when I see heavily pregnant women standing outside the maternity unit smoking.
I have been so desperately trying not to lose my baby....doing everything I can to give my baby a chance at life. I haven't had a single cup of tea or coffee since I found out I was pregnant. Not one sip of alcohol and not one breath of anyone’s cigarette smoke.
When I walk into the hospital I hold my breath because I have to walk past those selfish people who fill the air with smoke near the hospital entrance.

I appreciate it is hard to give up smoking. I understand its not easy.
But smoking is the mothers choice not the baby’s. Smoking is going to do nothing but harm the baby. I know I’m not a smoker and I don’t know what it is like to be addicted to anything. I do however know how it feels to be pregnant and I know how precious this little baby that is inside me now is. I would NEVER do anything to my body that would even possibly slightly harm my baby and I don’t understand how any mother could.

All the publications on Sudden Infant Death Syndrome say that you shouldn’t let anyone smoke near your baby. I know there have been millions of babies that been raised in homes with smokers with no problems at all. But to me it just isn’t worth the risk.

These are just my opinions. I don’t want to offend anyone. Its just one subject that I feel pretty strong about.

Cath
Mrs.Scoobypreza

Fatman

I'm a male non-smoker, but here's my thoughts. If a woman/couple has taken the decision to have a child then they're charged with nurturing that thing which we hold most sacred; life. I fail to understand why anyone would consciously continue to do something they know could seriously harm their unborn child.

How bloody selfish! Please, show your child a bit more respect and don't smoke.

ProperCharlie

i certainly don't agree that "only a man" would say it's sad to see pregnant women smoke. as cath says, most women want to give their baby the best chance, whatever that takes. my partner was a smoker for 15 years or so before we decided to have a child, but once we decided - that was it, not one more cigarette. i wouldn't even have agreed to try and conceive the baby if i wasn't 100% she would stay off the cigs. the good thing is that now the baby has been born, she has totally lost the urge to smoke and now finds it as unpleasant as i do, so she's done something for her own health as well as the baby's.

Hanley

Listen guys

At the end of the day it's a free world, we have the freedom to do what we want when we want. That's why people died in 2 World Wars.

I don't particularly think it's a good idea for the mother or father to smoke when expecting a baby but I'm not going to pass judgement.

I bet some people don't like the fact that I removed all the cats from my car and pollute the atmosphere when I drive around town - but I removed them anyway.

People seem to forget these days that people still have some freedom to make their own decisions.

ProperCharlie

hanley - i'm not saying that people can't make their own decisions, but that doesn't alter the fact that some desicions are better than others. smoking harms the baby - that's a fact. surely parents would not want to harm their baby before it's even born? i can accept that it happens, just as child abuse happens - doesn't make it right, though, does it?

Hanley

ProperCharlie

I'm not disagreeing with you

But people still have a basic right to make decisions on what they do (within reason) whether we like it or not.

It wouldn't suprise me if drinking whilst pregnant also affects the baby - Jordan is a good example here.

Everyday we turn on the TV and some beaurocrat is telling us something different is bad for us today - if we avoided everything they said was bad for our health we wouldn't be able to go anywhere, see anyone, eat anything or drink anything.

I'm an ex-smoker and I don't like the smell of smokers anymore but I certainly wouldn't start preaching to them like I knew better.

Rant over

ProperCharlie

sure - i'm not saying that we should have cigarette police who go around arresting pregnant smokers (although i'm sure a few people on here would think that's a pretty good idea ) but the thing is:

well we do know better. smoking in pregnancy isn't one of those marginal issues like whether or not eating the occasional fried breakast will lead to heart disease - the weight of evidence is overwhelming. so we do know better, and therefore intelligent people should act on this knowledge.

imlach

Hanley,

The basic problem with your argument is that there is a baby involved who is not able to change the decision.......the baby does not have "freedom of choice" does it?!

So, it is not your "right" to smoke when pregnant as there is a 2nd party involved who cannot alter that decision.

How would you like it if you were born with a cleft palatte and you KNEW it was highly likely due to smoking.....you'd prob feel a bit of anger towards your mother for being selfish...........especially when it is well proven medically of the effects of smoking on the development of the baby in the womb. Overwhelming evidence in fact.....not just a tiny hypothetical link.

OllyK

I know smoking causes lots of problems, but attributing it to things that are unproven is rather un-necessary.

imlach

Depends what you read........

I read "The deformity may be caused by cigarettes in up to one in five cases, according to the study"

That suggests to me there could be a link.

Sadly I chose a bad example, but it's just one of numerous........

ProperCharlie

from an american medical website.

Fatman

The association between cleft palates and smoking is a discussion that could take this thread off it's intended track. That was one of a number of conditions that could have been referred to. The point is that there is overwhelming evidence that smoking during pregnancy is harmful to the child.

OllyK

imlach

There is a big difference between:
and
I agree it may increase the probability, but if somoking casued cleft palate, non smoking parents would never give birth to a child with this condition. This is patently not the case.

I also agree that smoking while pregnant is not a wise move, nor is drinking, taking drugs, eating a poor diet, lifting heavy loads, punching yourself in the stomach, breathing the normal air in Loas Angeles and a million and one other things, and indeed many of these things apply when you are not pregnant as well. Taking certain drugs when not pregnant can then cause issues later in life.

At the end of the day it is down to the person concerned to make that decision. You may not agree with it, but while it is not illegal it is their right to carry on. The problem is if people get on their high horse and say "they shouldn't be allowed to do that", another group will start doing the same thing with your beliefs and will want to ban all internal combustion engines as there is a reasonable causal link to asthma in children from the polutants put out from motor verhicles and before you know it you can't do anything.

imlach

OllyK - you missed the main point.......

It is not JUST your choice - it is the choice of the baby too (and the baby has no part in persuading you against the decision)

OllyK

And as soon as the baby "pops" out it is able to start making decisions for itself?? Nope, the parents continue to be responsible for making the decisions for it. By law until they are 16.

The parents have the responsibility for the child. They make the decisions and do what they feel is right ot acceptable. If they cross the line accepted by society then (if your lucky) social services step in.

It's not just your choice to drive a de-catted car, you are poluting my air, you are affecting my kids health. It's not just your choice to dig up that plant in your back garden as it is turning CO2 in to O2 which needs to carry on happening for the benefit of everybody in the world.

OK, I am being a little flipant here, but there is very little (if anything) that you or I can do that has absolutely NO effect on another person. This isn't a personal attack imlach but I would guess that you are also anti-abortion? Don't feel oblidged to answer that.

imlach

Ollyk - dangerous to make assumptions about me.
I hate it when people on here try to "fit" you into a pigeon hole when they quite clearly know nothing about me or my thoughts.

Therefore, I'm not going to answer that on principle!

Hanley

imlach

You're talking as if a baby can make decisions before and just after it is born - it can't.

Infants do not have any self-awareness until at least 1 year old - therefore how can they have a right to make a decision??

As much as you don't like it - I don't like it either - if a pregnant woman decides to smoke it is her right to do that. Until it is made illegal then there is nothing we can do about it - she has the basic right of freedom of choice.

ProperCharlie

but as i keep saying just because someone has the *right* to do something, doesn't make it the right thing to do

OllyK

It wasn't an assumption, just a guess.
Wasn't trying to fit anybody in to any kind of pigeon hole at all, just asking a question.
I know something about some of your thoughts as you have been expressing them on here, I wouldn't however suggest that I know much outside the scope of what has been discussed to date.

Which is why I was keen to point out that I wasn't expecting an answer, just posing the question to see if you were prepared to give out some more information. No big deal either way.

imlach

Hanley,

However, the baby has to live with the consequences of smoking for the whole of its life.....

Just because it can't speak up until 2 years old does not make it acceptable to not think about it's life!!

OllyK

Ohhhhh - contencious point!!! It does not make it the right thing to do in your opinion. In their eyes and the eyes of the law it is perfectly acceptable oherwise a) they wouldn't do it and b) it would be illegal.

OllyK

Who says the mother has not thought about it?? There are still plenty of people out there who don't belive that smoking is dangerous. Many people continue to hold a belief even when all the evidence points to the conterary, history is full of it and there are plenty of things around today that apply as well.