tony de wonderful

I put an offer in for a terrace house and the owner accepted. Said I wanted a building survey done of course.

The terrace has a cream render on the front and back and the survey says there are some cracks in this render in a few places and that the render should be replaced.

Under both first floor the widows the damp meter reads damp and the report says this is often seen on period terraces that have been rendered.

So bottom line is the render would need chipping off and replacing at some point.

Survey says £4k estimate. A quick look online says this is ballpark, although maybe a little high.

Other than a minor pointing issue on the extension the building is solid.

I'm really umming and ahing about whether to phone the EA and revise my bid down a little, maybe 2k, so split this cost, or just eat it cos I don't want to lose the house. There isn't much for sale near me right now in my budget and although the terrace is small it's in a good area and nice.

Turbohot

My God! Long time no see, man! Welcome back and hope the house pans out well for you.

Personally, I'd want them to pay all that 4k, I mean give me the discount of the 4k, but do as it suits you. All the best.

TECHNOPUG

iTrader: (1)

They can only say no.

dpb

spooky coincidental popping up same week as Ding

ditchmyster

iTrader: (7)

Welcome back.

Tell them your findings and revise the offer by the £4k estimate and see what they come back with, as above they can only say no.

Personally I'd have all the render off re point and replace any bricks that have blown, did this on my first house on one wall, that way you'll not have any damp issues in the future.

David Lock

The only real worry is if the house has sunk a bit cracked walls. Any cracks inside although plaster board might hide these? Not on clay is it?


I wouldn't worry too much if you really want the place but you could chat to agent who might have a feel for how generous vendor is but remember he is representing vendor on one hand but wanting to close a deal on the other. I'd settle for £2k off and if I was broke just repaint the render if cracks aren't too bad. Did surveyor give a reason for damp indications? How old is property - the older ones often have lime/cement grouting so bricks do move about a bit.


Good luck, dl

tony de wonderful

Having thought about this yes my concern is that the render cracks may be just a symptom of a worse issue, esp as they run from the corners of the window.

The survey said no evidence of structural problem but what they write is so caveated by maybes and probabilities that it's an **** covering exercise. I'll try and phone the surveyor tomorrow and see what else he thinks.

The age is early 1900's and it's a terrace.

tony de wonderful

Yeah I'd love to be take the render off before buying it. Then no secrets.

tony de wonderful

I phoned him up and he said he's confident it's not structural. Cracks are old he says and nothing seen internally to suggest damage to wall itself.

hodgy0_2

a couple of points

1. I suspect it is a bit of a buyers market - perfectly acceptable to revise your offer down (until the point you exchange)

2. point 1 needs to be measured against how badly you want the house/property, and how desperate the vendor is to sell, is it worth losing over a couple of k


3. be aware of unreasonable expectations - the property is over a hundred years old - presumably anything structural would be covered by insurance anyway

Lenders would not lend against a property that was falling down

tony de wonderful

On a slight tangent, what do you need to get home insurance? Does loads of stuff need paperwork/certification like gas, power etc?

hodgy0_2

in short I don't know

but anyway you have two types, contents and structural

I think structural insurance is pretty much to cover the lenders interest in case the building collapses/catches fire - and is usually mandatory to get the mortgage

stuff like gas / electrics usually needs building regs sign off

but I don't think it is mandatory and actually required to get a mortgage

but your surveyors / solicitor should be able to clarify all this

I would take mine or anyone's word for it - and if you question the professional advice you are getting - get another professional's

tony de wonderful

No mortgage needed for me, but I would assume that the building survey I had done would have been enough to satisfy a hypothetical lender anyway, and/or structural insurance?

steve05wrx

Hi,
Please don't assume!
Some surveys are hardly worth the paper they are written on.
Was it a full structural survey you had done - or simply a typical mortgage survey?
Cheers
Steve

tony de wonderful

It was a building survey, the most comprehensive one you get.

David Lock

If you really like it I'd go for it and if you can get a couple of grand off that's a nice Christmas extra
We had a large 3 storey terrace in London a while back built in early 1900s which had some cracks here and there but I reckoned it had lasted for 100 + years and through two World Wars and had a house each side holding it up Risk in these type of places is neighbour dismantling chimney breast without doing it properly. Smashing house with wonderful ceiling height and spacious rooms - some character which Bovis won't give you. Now worth around £2m but with yellow lines outside.


Life's too short to worry about some minor cracks. Insurance will be fine as long as it doesn't flood in the area.


dl

hodgy0_2

yeah, my thoughts

they knew how to build houses back then - not the rubbish new builds you get now

some feel like they are made of bog roll

PaulC72

cracks look like they are from age movement rather than anything serious, if you went for the top survey which was a structural survey then you may have some protection from the survey companies PI.

I would explain to them what the problem is, ask for the 4k off and see what they say, they may say no, then you decide what to do, they may meet you half way which is where you currently sit or they may give you the lot as their own position may dictate what they want to do.

You have nothing to lose and I would bet that they will not say forget it all for the sake of a deal through a bit of a discussion.

The EA may ask to see the survey, I would suggest you provide only the relevant section ;-)

(Just done it on our house move which we completed last Friday)

Good luck.

gary77

iTrader: (1)

It doesnt look much to worry about .but i find it a bit odd the cracks go straight up from the corner and not along then up following the line of the lintel above the window. Im no expert but id want to see what condition the lintel is in .

I,ll post up some pictures of real cracks in an old house im working in at the moment . And nobody(archatects or engineers) seem concerned by them .

tony de wonderful

Now that I did check and its lowest risk. I know the area anyway and the river is several m lower and the high risk area is 400 m away.

johned

For me it would depend on the age of the house and the price as in old houses nothing is spot on so balance that against the price or buy new or nearly new and suffer all the problems that come with new houses.

scoobiepaul

I am guessing the property has solid walls? Has the interior been recently plastered/decorated? if it has I would get an expert in to assess the cracks and damp issues that you are worried about.

gary77

iTrader: (1)

This house is probibly close to 200 years old .
Theres cracks all over it.floors are up and down but nobody seems concerned about

David Lock

Bit of lining paper - job done


d

gary77

iTrader: (1)

It'll add character

That wall is getting taken out to make the space bigger .but it shows the amount of settlment and the building is considered structually sound. Well at least the structural engineer hasnt seen the need for anything to strengthen the building .

The building is having £600 k spent on it .and its not like the owners are short of money if it needed anything .

Kind of puts the small cracks in that render in perspective .
My guess would be that the lintel has failed and the brick work has slipped down slightly .are the windows fairly recent ? It could be that the old windows were supporting some of the weight if the brickwork above and removing them has allowed the brickwork to drop slightly .

Thats a similar issue to what we have in that older property but with doorways that are being removed .there are no lintels above some doors and the door frames themselves are supporting the brickwork above to an extent .

tony de wonderful

The windows are modern double glazed, they don't look all that old but also not brand new.

The same terraces in the row have a very heavy and thick looking lintel which sticks out beyond the brickwork maybe 1/4 an inch. I think in this house's case the render covers the existing lintel with a thin layer so you can't see it anymore, although the top window hints at the shape of the original lintel through the render (if you know what I mean?).

The walls would be solid yeah and the surveyor said interior looked fine. Plaster and paint wasn't old but also not recent.

Interestingly on next door's front, the render doesn't cover the lintel which is painted over instead.

I think though the original sills have been removed.

Unrendered terrace on same row:



Next door with rendering but not over the lintel with is just painted:

taylor85

iTrader: (5)

Only way to ell how bad it actually is to rip it all over and have a good look at the state of the brickwork, OR have a thermal imaging survey done!

My local pub just had their render removed and someone had painted it with road paint, the render couldnt breate and held the water in! therefore the brickwork just rotted away causing alot of problems

tony de wonderful

I guess that's an issue with any rendered wall, you never know what lurks underneath.

If I get the house I'd probably plan to hack and replace render at some point.

Doesn't anyone know if home insurance will cover existing problems which could not be reasonably known at present? Like for example if you hack render off and uncover a structural problem?

Devildog

Nope - it won't

Buildings insurance will cover fire, flood damage (provided you're not in a high risk flood area) damage from bust pipes, storm damage, certain accidental damage to the fabric of the building and so forth. It won't cover a pre existing defect that you don't know about on purchase.

Devildog

What would worry me more is the apparent removal of the sills. Although your surveyor should have raised that if it was an issue.

Call the surveyor and chat it through with him.