Motion-Mx

iTrader: (2)

Hi,

just fitted a boost gauge to my WR1,what boost should I be getting?

on start up I'm seeing -9 PSI

normal driving varies right upto 0 PSI

boosting it got upto +20 PSI

and idling while warm again - 9PSI

this gauge isn't the best of quality,and read's +1 PSI while not even connected to the car.

thanks,Ben



I should mention,20PSI is my gauges MAX,however it doesn't have a needle stop so I'm not sure if it could show further boost or not?

Anders_WR1

iTrader: (8)

I think mine used to peak 1.3BAR on the Prodrive map (about 19 PSI), so you're on the money there if your +1 PSI.

Anders

Motion-Mx

iTrader: (2)

Cool,

yeah I'm gona buy a new gauage,something that reads to 30 PSI so I can recognize over boosting.

Thanks Anders,

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

Buy a guage that reads in BAR ...........it's a more popular unit

Shaun

Anders_WR1

iTrader: (8)

Motion-Mx

iTrader: (2)

Hey

Haha,Being 22, PSI suit's me better

aXeL

Might I respectfully suggest that a boost gauge is not the ideal tool for assessing your turbo's performance. I only mention it because because I've recently done alot of boost mapping and data logging on my car. A laptop with a data cable was very helpful. Couple of points to bear in mind:-

1) A boost gauge won't tell you boost error which is the really helpful bit when checking the turbo's performance.

The boost error on my PPP was typically 0.2 - 0.5 bar which is rubbish. With logging data I was able to adjust my initial/max WGDC tables to compensate for this. This made a significant difference in the car's response without having to turn up any of the boost target pressures.

2) It won't show boost creep/spike at all. The car has a map for boost target which depends on the throttle position and RPMs. My boost target varies between 1.003 (atmospheric) and 2.24 (full boost). Creep/Spike can happen anywhere inside/above that range but I could never see that from a gauge unless it's over the upper limit.


Just my 'two-penneth' worth. Thought I'd mention it as I was able to get soo much more out of the car by more closely matching the turbo response to engine response and not having to increase pressure anywhere. Might be useful to you.

Motion-Mx

iTrader: (2)

Hey Axel,

Thanks for your input,however I don't really understand what your telling me? are you suggesting a rolling road run? a re map?

thanks,Ben

aXeL

What I'm thinking is that you may find a data cable and a laptop much more useful for finding out whether or not your turbo is happy and doing what you want it too. Just need to plug it in and drive around for a half an hour at a time. No need for a RR. Plus it's less money paying a garage to install a boost gauge and will tell you one hell of alot more than just that. I typically log and monitor 23 variables, not just one. If you're interested, PM me and I'll email my last log results for boost mapping and a couple of screen shots of what I've been monitoring while I drive.

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

2.24 BAR is quite high boost to run

Shaun

aXeL

2.24 as stored by Pro-drive in the 'Target Boost (MT)' table - includes atmospheric pressure - slap yourself with a wet fish for forgetting this!! Actually the 'Boost Limit (CEL)' table is at 2.474 bar (35.88 PSI). If the ECU didn't subtract atmospheric pressure I suspect the car's performance would have been spectacular... for about 0.1 seconds followed by pieces of the turbo re-linering my engine

Motion-Mx

iTrader: (2)

Hey,

yeah a cabee to connect my car to my laptop would be ace! I didn't know it was that simple? what software do I need to interpret the data? and where can I buy said lead?

Thanks for your input,

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

Atmospheric pressure is not a fixed constant

Atmospheric pressure - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I guess the third decimal place is a bit flakey

Shaun

Thud....... as I get hit by the flying haddock LOL

aXeL

- good point, however the ECU only stores one reference value for STP.

Safe to say Subaru don't program this using Wiki as a reference - Lord I hope they don't. Our cars would be as reliable as Fiat...

Motion-Mx

iTrader: (2)

can you tell me what I need to hook her up to the laptop Axel?

thanks,

bluenose172

iTrader: (2)

Tactix cable/kit and download RomRaider. A boost gauge still has it's place though, what Axel is saying above doesn't have any real relavance to 99% of people, you just want to know if it's boosting correctly.

aXeL

Newer version of my datacable from here. Plugs in under the steering column
tactrix

and

Free but very powerful logging software
RomRaider - Open Source ECU Tools | RomRaider / Download

Great software for what you're doing, however I advise sticking to the datalogging tool, not the ECU Editor. Do NOT make changes to your ECU unless you're first going to invest some months studying the combustion process and fuel injection systems and lots of datalogging.

Bluenose dear sir - I disagree. 99% of people need to be seeing the boost behaviour rather than the boost limit, the latter being the only useful thing the boost gauge gives us. e.g. If our boost gauge reads 9 PSI at some point, that information is useless unless we know what the engine load is, WGDC, RPMs, throttle % etc. i.e. we want to know if 9 PSI is good or bad so we need a context.

I have a lovely example of this today. Just got the car back having had some work done to the down pipe. Drove the car home but it had no power when the turbo spooled. I could hear/feel the spool (followed by strange hissing) but no power to the engine. Plugged in the laptop and read the boost gauge - Normal readings, i.e. useless by itself. However manifold pressure was way down yet the WGDC were reading normal and no CELs. Instant diagnosis: Turbo behaving correctly but air is bleeding out before the manifold. Took 5 minutes to trace the issue to dodgy fitting on the intercooler y-pipe. Try that with just a boost gauge..

That's just one example. Point being is since the software can do much more and for those who like lots needles moving everywhere, the software can display a gauge of 'boost pressure', in many different formats too, e.g. dials, numbers, numbers with max/min displayed etc. I've had eight dials displayed concurrently but that's me

dunx

iTrader: (3)

You don't need a laptop to hear a leak !

Me trolling

bad dunx

aXeL

You do if you haven't heard it before and don't know what it is!

Me learning

bluenose172

iTrader: (2)

You were talking about boost error etc, completely irrelevant to most people. Most people get the car tuned, ask the tuner what target boost he's gone for then use a gauge to monitor that.

"
That's just one example. Point being is since the software can do much more and for those who like lots needles moving everywhere, the software can display a gauge of 'boost pressure', in many different formats too, e.g. dials, numbers, numbers with max/min displayed etc. I've had eight dials displayed concurrently but that's me" -

Ideal if you have a centrally mounted 7" screen in your dash, useless if you have it sitting on the seat next to you.

For anyone interested the new OP 2.0 Tactrix cable/dongle(without a cable plugged into PC) will log to a SD card so you can view logs on your PC when you get time.

aXeL

You missed my point. I highlighted that boost error IS relevant to anyone who wants to know if the turbo is boosting correctly. Note Motion's query about what he 'should' be seeing.

Motion, The only thing it can show you is if you're exceeding the boost limit defined in your ECU and only then if you know what that limit is (Probably 21.19 PSI/1.464 bar) for you car. Contrary to what Bluenose is saying it will NOT tell you if you're hitting the correct boost targets, of which your car has ~22 different boost targets ranging from (2.161 - 19.48 PSI). So if it hits 19.0 when it should be 10.5 - you're engine would be in alot of trouble but you won't have any way of telling from a boost gauge.

If you want a warning system, your ECU will trigger a CEL after 31 consecutive measurements of boost pressure exceeding 21.19 PSI and it will cut the fuel till the pressure drops below this. So if you want more than just pretty waving needles - use a laptop .

bluenose172

iTrader: (2)

You really are over complicating things for the OP, he just needs a decent boost gauge. The way I set my 3 port boost tables up means I have 'boost error' all over the place, but my response, spool and curve is spot on though. I know for a fact I'm not the only one that sets it up like this, so telling people to be concerned about their 'boost error' is a bit misleading.

aXeL

I think we'll just have disagree. If he wants a gauge for the sake of it - it's his money. If he want's something meaningful, that isn't it. Clearly you think otherwise.

Motion-Mx

iTrader: (2)

Hi,

I appreciate both your input,and I thankyou for your help.

I can see both points,I see how this laptop diagnosis thing could help understand specifically how the car is boosting but a good boot gauge will also show if i'm on my max boost.

I will buy a decent boost gauge,I think it's a great tool to moniter on every drive but I will also try and get hold of said cable to plug into a laptop,as it clearly has some beneffits.

thanks again,

Ben

Anders_WR1

iTrader: (8)

After my first remap (which was dyno only), I drove away and had boost spikes to 1.8BAR on the defi gauges. I knew this was wrong because the car was mapped to 1.4BAR on the dyno and the VF35 wasn't rated for much above 1.5BAR. So I drove back and we went out on the road to sort.

If it hadn't been for the defi's I would have probably throught the extra torque was down to a great remap, not dangerous boost spikes. It's possible the defi's saved my engine, so I disagree with your 'If he wants a gauge for the sake of it - it's his money' point.

I see the advantages of laptop's and data logging and I'll be checking out the logs on the Solaris when it's fitted, but most people on here only want to check for over boosting, or to show their mates how much they're running

Anders

dunx

iTrader: (3)

As soon as my Defi reads >2 bar I know it's time to check the hoses for damage....


LOL

dunx

Turbotits

iTrader: (2)

I used to log mine now and again just to check everything was ok< changed ecu now and at the moment dont have the software to do it>

During all this time i run a boost guage as well and i think a lot can be said for having one. Its a perminant install and can be monitered all the time unlike a laptop>

So my advise to the op is use both> do some logging see what the boost gauge is doing and then if you see any unusual things going on with the gauge get your laptop out> But dont be running a laptop all the time> the car is to enjoy not log it all the time

Motion-Mx

iTrader: (2)

Hey,

I started getting a slight screech when on boost every now and again. now the hose for my boost gauge melted the other day because it was too close to the turbo. so right now the gauge isn't on the car,but the hose still is.

I also re-set the ECU last night,could any of these be causing it? the car ran fine last night,once the ECU was re-set and running with no boost gauge.

however today,it's cold here...5C when i set off. the car seems to go ok,I can't tell any lack in power,just a slight screech every now and again when on boost.

I think I'm going to book an open source mapper to come and dyno is on the road next weekend.

but any thoughts on what it is before then?

thanks,

Motion-Mx

iTrader: (2)

I had a similar noise but a lot worse when I fitted a de-cat exhaust without having it mapped.

Anders_WR1

iTrader: (8)

Sounds like a boost leak, check the clamps on all boost hoses.