mitsy19

give me???my bugeye is going,will i notice any difference??

addison

STI or WRX?
totally different to drive,
watch your speed as it will not feel as fast, but it is

aXeL

I test drove a 2.5 STI PPP as a candidate upgrade from my 2.0 STI8 PPP:

Pros - No turbo lag, bags of instant low down torque

Cons - Totally gutless after 'approximately' 5500 rpm when compared to my 2.0. It was the second 2.5 I'd driven and I'd been hoping that being an STI PPP, it wouldn't have the same problem but no such luck.

Suffice to say I didn't buy it. Although if someone tells me it can be tweaked to pull hard all the way to the limiter like mine then I might change my mind, otherwise my 2.0 feels loads more fun to me...

bigsinky

2.0 will always feel more spirited unless the 2.5 has been tweaked. its a totally different power delivery in the 2.5, so of course it will feel different. if you have the money a 2.33 is the way to go

Mikkel

You can make a 2.5ltr STI pull as well, if not better, than a 2.0ltr UK STi at all ranges of the engine with very simple upgrades (i.e. an exhaust and a remap). A 2.0ltr car can be made to work better in the higher rev range but that will cost you a lot of money.

2.5ltr STi or a JDM 2.0ltr depending on your driving style.

Butty

iTrader: (2)

I think the lack of urge above 5.5k rpm (and also the 2 litre) is down to the VF turbos rather than engine - but it is much more noticeable on the 2.5 engined cars.
ON the 2.5 STi, its either a different turbo or alternatively keep the VF43 and add methanol to gain power with induction changes to avoid the power droop at the end of revs.
Nick

Mikkel

So would you go twin scroll on the UK 2.5ltr?

my06 ppp silver

iTrader: (2)

as a daily driver imo the 2.5 wins hands down. as said though for smile factor get a ppp sti though. yes the 2.0 is quick but all this talk about being gutless after 5500rpm is not truly important on our "roads" anyway. to explain, has anyone here bothered looking at what speed they are actually doing in 4th (2 gears to go still!!) at 5500 rpm? I DO, and take it up to 5500 in 5th and you are doing silly speeds and pulling like a train!!! hardly gutless imo, oh and btw it is ridiculously quick from 70mph up but it is only just coming alive from 4th gear and up.

Butty

iTrader: (2)

Not a std VF twin scroll as it will have the same power loss droop - perhaps whatever one is fitted to the T25 to make the power but not lose the low end torque?

addison

well said!
if your driving on the road, takes you above 5500 you need to look at the way you drive

you will do it when you are remaping or at odd times but it's not needed when having fun on B roads.

on the track is diffrent
but with a few mods like mine it will pull all the way 350 bhp/400ft-lbs
that makes a 2.5 a nice road car

Butty

iTrader: (2)

Perhaps I'm having too many "odd times" on the motorway than most?

If I wanted to keep in the 3,000- 5,500 rpm range then I'd have bought a diesel......there aren't enough revs on a std 2.5 engine as it is.

aXeL

Hear hear! I can't believe people question why one would rev a scoob above beyond 5500. There are a number of gears before 4th - Commence flame war...

BTW Butty, I don't know about the turbo on the 2.5 but the stock VF35 on my 2.0 is plenty powerful for enabling the car to pull really hard to the limiter - after I'd tweaked the breathing and done a few re-maps (like 30 of them )

Mikkel, fixing the 2.0 to pull hard high up costs nothing more than a data cable, a dremel, a wideband sensor and some study (Or rather lots of study). I don't know where the peak power is on my car anymore but it 'feels' somewhere around 7000rpm...

addison

where do you guy live and drive? tesco's, M25? LOL
i would be interested to know without being funny
or upsetting you

i don't think you have lived with a 2.5 to say the thinks you have

maybe in spring you should come to Scotland and we could show you some good roads?

and that's meant in a friendly way maybe we could both learn something

that what it's all about

aXeL

Well said sir. I'd love to see a properly sorted 2.5. And you're correct, my time with a 2.5 was very short. Scotland is lovely but is unfortunately a bit of a trek for me from West Berks...

One thing I did notice was that the hawk eye PPP I drove had far more responsive steering that my STI8. The turn in was much more sharp which I fell in love with immediately.

And yes you're right - Tesco's (Busted!) Actually the rural roads around me tend to be more for tractors which is why I went for another scoob rather than an M5/RS4.

Butty

iTrader: (2)

See my garage - you must have a left arm like popeye with all that gear changing
I'm far enough South to have a big choice of A roads and motorways but not too South to miss the traffic.
I was also going to say I have an understanding boss who doesn't care about fuel costs on the Scoob, but I'm destined to have a diesel next year.

aXel - I forgot to include the 2.5 STi gearing which is a little longer and could magnify the 5.5k rpm drop off.




Nick

53

iTrader: (41)

Seats are not as supportive and they sit higher and the Drive by Wire feels different to cable IMHO.

I think 4.5-5k revs is about 125mph in 5th. Pulls in 6th regardless 70 -100 cruising is low revs and very quick on overtaking. 1st 2nd 3rd to the redline is a polite yet brief introduction to 4th which will take you deep into 5th. You don't really have to spank the 2.5 to get quick fast, where as the 2ltr needed much more redline.

daijones

My 2.5WRX came with a PPP on it, and it tailed off pretty quick above 5500 rpm. Took it to powerstation for their power upgrade, now much better, power keeps building to the red line. I guess it's the PPP map that leads to the drop off beyond 5500

Potiriadis

I traded from bugeye STi to a STi Hatch, until I had PPP'd I was quite disappointed. I find that the hatch is faster but, it is a sense of torque picking you up and throwing you at the horizon. It takes an adjustment to change from high revving bug to torquey hatch, but once you have adapted to it, it has its own highlights.

I also run a WRX hawkeye which is all torque between 2,500 and 5,500 , and then runs out of ideas. Again, if you are sensitive to your car, and adapt your style, there are few faster ways to cover ground.

The same is true about my focus ST, funnily enough, turbo charged 2.4l engine. Just surf the torque on boost.

I don't care what anyone claims (with the exception of BMW) this is nothing like driving a turbo diesel where you have a power band of about 1,500 rpm, or sometimes (Golf TDi I tried) a few hundred.

Love my scoobs, love my wife even more for letting me have them!

frayz

iTrader: (7)

All 2.5s mapped or not will feel slack after 5500rpm if theyre on the stock turbo.

The simple fact of the matter is the engine is consuming too much air for the turbo to fill at those rpm levels. Thus the boost drops considerably and this obviously reduces torque. Its the torque drop that makes you feel like theyre slowing down.

In reality, 5500rpms in a 2.5 is really motoring on. And the torque delivery in the 2.5 is stunning.

Bolt a proper turbo to a 2.5 and have the best of both worlds