ossett2k2

iTrader: (9)

Hi all. I have an MY93 WRX and looking into remapping as i've done a few mods.My research finds that pre '96 cars do not have an OBDII connector?
So my question is does the piggy back chip have to be removed and flashed with new map or can i remap on the fly via some connector i don't know about? Any help much appriciated.

myblackwrx

iTrader: (1)

PolarPerformance
3 options from standard chip to a live mapping system

ossett2k2

iTrader: (9)

Ok thanx myblackwrx I was looking into remapping myself as ourkids got the hardware/sortware needed.So basicly i will need a daughter board m8?Does this have the obd connector on it?

myblackwrx

iTrader: (1)

Not sure how they remap the daughter board ,sorry, you could always contact them and ask.

ossett2k2

iTrader: (9)

Cheers I does metion something about a select port(to be released)on the polorperfromance site maybe this is it?

HELP anyone Please!!!

AndrewC

The product advertised on the Polar Performance website is the ESL Live mapping board, this is fitted to the ROM socket on the ecu and in normal use behaves just like the EPROMs or ROM boards which are available from various sources, these generally lift the boost to 1.1bar and remove the speed limiter but are based on std fuel and ignition maps to make them safe on any car.

The difference with the ESL Live board is that it can be remapped interactively via the select monitor port by an ESL dealer. This not only makes it easy to optimise the maps for a specific car but it can also be very easily mapped for different injectors, MAF, MAP sensor, etc, which at one time would require the fitting of an aftermarket ECU.

Contact Andy Stevens: service@enduringsolutions.com for more details.

Andrew...

ossett2k2

iTrader: (9)

thanx andrew m8 but i only payed 3.5k for the car and dont want to spend £550,,plus money for future remaps,so i will probably stick with my 1.1bar(maybe a bit extra with a boost controller?)and keep my eye out for a esl board and lead so i can have a go myself in the future.
Regards Rich

Scott.T@PolarPerformance

You'll also need the S/W which isn't released to the public

ossett2k2

iTrader: (9)

Cheers Scott.T So i guess the customer doesn't get a copy of the s/ware so they can have a play with diferrent maps for the future?Ourkid has the kwp2000+ but as you prob know doesn't support impreza.So it looks like a boost controller will ave to do for now,unless i stumble across some s/ware.

Sc0oby

apexi power fc the way to go never regret it

Andy Stevens

Lol. Depends how much you want to pay to lose your closed loop knock control, diagnostics and 3D boost mapping I suppose. I guess you would gain a commander if thats your thing.

It is well supported however and amazingly inexpensive by dint of the number they sell.

ossett2k2

iTrader: (9)

I see that there is some s/ware about that allows you to custom remap,send it and have your ecu reprogrammed.
Is it not possible for me to use that sw with a eprom progger to do my remapping?

Scott.T@PolarPerformance

No, because the file you created is encrypted & also not the full image.

ossett2k2

iTrader: (9)

Is it not possible to read the eprom from my ecu and then edit that map,or use my image for the parts you s/ware does provide?

Tidgy

i thought the ecutek software for early maps was due to be out by now?

Scott.T@PolarPerformance

ESL Live map Adaptor is probably what you mean and IIRC was the S/W in question on previous posts that incorrectley got linked with ECUTEK.

Tidgy

o right, maybe that then

ossett2k2

iTrader: (9)

So it seem that the only way for us enthusiasts to remap our phaze 1 impreza maybe the esl board,the use of the postman and 50 of my hard earned pounds for every custom map i want?Seems a bit tight to say i will have paid close to £600 for the board+map,and for the s/ware to be encrypted so the user has very little input?

There does seem to be user mapping s/ware about for the later imperza and because i choose to own a early classic,not being abel to learn more about the car or cusom map it everytime a add a modification make me sad! So in some of my spare time,i will be working on modifying the software i have(or should i say,,creating my own) and making a working image so that i can do my own remaps.
I will post my results and maybe a tut when i Crack this

Scott.T@PolarPerformance

Where did you get £600
The Standard ESL board is £195, which uses the old technology and the free software available on the ESL website.

Alternativley buy a 27C1028 chip, upload your map (using knicked or self-developed software and a suitable hardware TTL-RS232 interface), decode it, change it, programme it, test it, change it, programme it, test it, change it, programme it, test it, change it, programme it, test it, change it, programme it, test it.....oh!! and change it, programme it, test it until you get what you want.

Not forgetting all the chip erases inbetween the changes and the purchase of an EEPROM Programmer and the UV Eraser.

Sorry for giving the bad vibe, but over the years I have dished out alot of map parameter info in good faith.....as a private individual to private individuals...
Only for it to bite me on the ****, now I have gone commercial, by private individuals then using it for their own financial gain.

ZEN Performance

It's a familiar story, you just have to make the most of what you can offer over and above the "mate down the pub" ecu tinkerers.

borat52

I think its a bit cheeky to expect ESL to tell you exactly how they make their commercial product for free after them having put all of the hard work into deveoping it probably at considerable time and cost to them.

Andy Stevens

Will makes a sound point: About 40 odd k GBP worth of development at last count.

The reason the software is not released to the general public is I don't have sufficient resources to support the myriad of enquiries I would inevitably get from those who want to 'have a go' at mapping. A bit of market research also reveals that the majority of end users wouldn't want to map their own vehicle, which is a sensible view IMHO.

Distributors of the live hardware, three of which have posted on this thread, are professionals with a wealth of Subaru tuning knowledge who will work in an efficient, methodical manner to add the most value to the product.

If you think 550-600GBP for live mapping hardware, installation and full mapping session is too much, then you are not being realistic with your tuning budget and should probably keep the car standard or just chuck on a bleed valve, buy alot of OB and keep your fingers crossed.

If you want to go play with eproms then have a ball. If you don't value your time highly and have hundreds of hours to throw at it you might get some sort of result. If things go wrong, that 550GBP might look like surprisingly good value all of a sudden.

ossett2k2

iTrader: (9)

I am not however one of the 'majority of end users' tho! I have seen in my lifetime so far the development of computer technology,especially in my work,and now i own a car which uses this technology i want to be able to learn everything about it,,i mean its not rocket science,although my scoob does go like a rocket so tis debatable!

It actually gets me a quite excited(infact i think im a little bit wet) to think i can now swap my scewdriver for my computer to get the best out of my car.I have always worked on my own cars and am not about to change now,i meen come on guys 550-600 plus £50map when i add induction kit,,£50map when i add uprated turbo,,£50map when i add this,,£50 when i add that,,,and i goes on and on,,you see where im coming from?And really its not the cost,i just want to LEARN.


Btw I have been "Playing" with eproms for years and yes i really have had a "Ball"

and i never said i "expect ESL to tell you exactly how they make their commercial product"
i said i would have a go at developing my own.

bandit1216red

Hi all
Im new 2 scoobys n have a 95 import waggon with tdo5 turbo, z4 ecu, green filter, and full miltek exhaust.
Which made 232.2 bhp on scooby clinics dyno last week.But suffered turbo lag.
After spending many hrs reading forums about chipping remapping etc
i contacted ESL told them exactly what i was running n what i wanted.
Paid them my money and in return 2 days later recieved there daughter board already programmed.Got my local instrument tech 2 solder the chip holder on my ecu board n cut resistor.
All i will say im amazed at what a difference it makes.
Its totally transformed my scooby, no turbo lag now , probably a quite a bit more power (will dyno it again on same dyno when i get time), and probably better fuel consumption.
Im also intrested in seeing how / what exactly the remap has done n how?? but i dont have the time so i left it 2 the experts .
Thanks ESL is what im saying
And yes ive tuned motorbike engines for over 30 years n ride a 1216 bandit with 170 bhp
Regards Andy

Scott.T

iTrader: (2)

It's not £550-£600 plus £50 a map
It's £195 plus £50 a map (it will come supplied with a suitable base map, you then modify the map on a PC and and send it to Andy who will reprogramme your bard)

the £550 is for a completley different interface that requires a dealer to install, setup and live map on the road/rolling road. All Inc for £550-£600

Andy Stevens

There is some confusion here between the two products.

The postal map is being phased out. When the car it's going onto is in fine fettle it's good and an inexpensive upgrade, but having done alot of them I've come to the conclusion that when you don't get visibility of the car, you can spend so long sorting out little problems remotely it can be frustrating. This is what bandit1216red has and I'm glad he has got a good result. The £50 charge ossett2k2 refers to is actually another set of chips with a different postal map on if you go from a td04 to td05 for example. It's nothing to do with (apart from providing a bit of useful background for):

The Live map which is the new product and is only available through a select few traders who I have absolute faith in. It is the cheapest live mapping system for the target platform I'm aware of and has taken a tremendous amount of work to get where we are.

There is absolutely no comparison between playing with eproms and producing hardware, embedded code and application software to comm up with a multiplexed expansion port and overcome all the associated difficulties moving a multi-disciplined project from feasibility to production.

In laymans terms: Its been fookin difficult. However, we wouldnt have done it if we thought the end result wasn't worth the effort.

Good luck with your commercial product ossett2k2, will you be using SM technology for your hardware? How many layers on the board? What PCB design package will you use? What kind of quality system does your manufacturer/suppliers adhere to? Will you write your own dissasembler? What sdk will you write your application code in? Have you bought every single type of ECU ever produced by Subaru for your target model range? Have you bought several cars specifically for development? Have you got over a million miles on your base maps? Where will you go for prototype builds? Datasheets? Logic Analysers? Oscilloscopes? Marketing? Test Strategy? Accounts? Distribution?

Yes, I am taking the pith, but the above questions are the tip of the iceberg, believe me. Learning is to be encouraged but I fear you may have underestimated the task at hand.

Andy Stevens

Haha! Took so long to type Scott beat me to it

ossett2k2

iTrader: (9)

Sorry if i wasn't clear.Invent a new product from scratch,call it ossett's phaze I mappable ecu and make lots of money?This couldn't be further from the truth! I don't for one minute underestimate the work you have put in to get to your end product.All I want to be able to do is tune MY car,so where do i go from here?Surley it would be stupid of me to ignore the technology already available to me and not invent,but develop a product so i can use it to allow me to get to my end result.

I applaud you guys for what you have achived,im a printer by trade and i wouldn't want to go down the road you've gone,even if i did have the time and money,like i said before,,,i just want so swap mi screwdriver for mi laptop!

Any person in life in my honest opinion is capable of leaning and achiving anything they want,im a strong believer in that.And im sorry but leaning about things of which i am passionate about does excite me! After all i have leaned how to fine tune a 3 million pound printing press and get paid lots of money to do it,so **** me if i can fine tune my mark one subaru impreza WRX

Andy Stevens

All very laudable and I'm still not completely clear, but if you were trying to develop something that will talk to our board I'll save you the time, you won't be able to do it.

Outwith that, good luck with it. We certainly had fun starting out with an eprom burner many moons ago. Firing the engine on your first prototype is a moment to savour.