HELP...too many downpipes..
29 October 2001, 12:30 AM
#2
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The Magnex downpipe is excellent, I have one on the P1. Quality is as good as Scoobysport and is designed to mate up to a 2.5" system such as the Scoobysport or Magnex. Best thing is, Halford supply these with free fitting which saves about £150 in labour charges as it takes about 3 hrs to fit.
I think although many people strongly favour one pipe over another, the difference between them will be negligble, certainly not enough to get your knickers in a twist about
Good luck,
MS
I think although many people strongly favour one pipe over another, the difference between them will be negligble, certainly not enough to get your knickers in a twist about
Good luck,
MS
29 October 2001, 11:27 AM
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ooooo free fitting at halfords did you say? what price range are we talking about (if you know), and also if you decat your car, you need to put it back on every mot? is it best to learn to do it yourself? of pay a visit to a garadge once a year?
29 October 2001, 11:51 AM
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Martin,
Have you now got a full Magnex system or is it just the D/P. I've got the Magnex centre with no resonator and Magnex B/B, was looking at putting on a D/P now thanks to a chat with my insurance co and thought about SS or Magnex.....
Any thoughts?
Cheers
Neil.
Have you now got a full Magnex system or is it just the D/P. I've got the Magnex centre with no resonator and Magnex B/B, was looking at putting on a D/P now thanks to a chat with my insurance co
and thought about SS or Magnex.....Any thoughts?
Cheers
Neil.
29 October 2001, 12:41 PM
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Ok guys,
the Magnex pipe is £179.99 inc VAT. If you buy from any normal performance garage, they will charge you around 3 hours labour for fitting, which works out about £150. Halfords are offering free fitting on all exhausts, which on the downpipe is an unbeatable deal!
To compare, both Scoobysport and Magnex pipes basically do the same job. They remove the very restrictive cat from the system and they take away any restriction from the wastegate, which is normally blocked off by a blanking plate on the standard pipe.
The Scoobysport pipe has a large open mouthed design which encompasses both the main turbo outlet and the wastegate, whereas the Magnex is of the twin dump design such as PE, BPM or Scoobymania; the wastegate having a seperate pipe which mates to the main pipe about a third of the way down.
I was in the same position a while ago about which to go for but decided that essentially they are both much of a muchness. I in fact spoke to one of the Magnex guys and asked why they had gone for the twin dump over the single mouthed design, and I was told that after extensive testing of a variety of designs that this one consistantly produced the best results.
I am very happy with the gains, boost comes on about 500 revs lower, you can hear the turbo whistling now and torque seems to be increased throughout the range.
MOT wise, I'm not worried 'cause my car's only six months old. Otherwise, you can either replace the front pipe (which is a pain), or I have heard of people getting through by just replacing the middle cat and warming the car up before going for the test. Some decent garages may 'lend' you a special centre cat to get you through the MOT too.
Hope that helps guys,
MS.
(By the way, I used Halfords in Bracknell)
the Magnex pipe is £179.99 inc VAT. If you buy from any normal performance garage, they will charge you around 3 hours labour for fitting, which works out about £150. Halfords are offering free fitting on all exhausts, which on the downpipe is an unbeatable deal!
To compare, both Scoobysport and Magnex pipes basically do the same job. They remove the very restrictive cat from the system and they take away any restriction from the wastegate, which is normally blocked off by a blanking plate on the standard pipe.
The Scoobysport pipe has a large open mouthed design which encompasses both the main turbo outlet and the wastegate, whereas the Magnex is of the twin dump design such as PE, BPM or Scoobymania; the wastegate having a seperate pipe which mates to the main pipe about a third of the way down.
I was in the same position a while ago about which to go for but decided that essentially they are both much of a muchness. I in fact spoke to one of the Magnex guys and asked why they had gone for the twin dump over the single mouthed design, and I was told that after extensive testing of a variety of designs that this one consistantly produced the best results.
I am very happy with the gains, boost comes on about 500 revs lower, you can hear the turbo whistling now and torque seems to be increased throughout the range.
MOT wise, I'm not worried 'cause my car's only six months old. Otherwise, you can either replace the front pipe (which is a pain), or I have heard of people getting through by just replacing the middle cat and warming the car up before going for the test. Some decent garages may 'lend' you a special centre cat to get you through the MOT too.
Hope that helps guys,
MS.
(By the way, I used Halfords in Bracknell)
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29 October 2001, 12:51 PM
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Hi Martin,
I think this has made my mind up on the DP side. What a bargain! I can't imagine Halfords will be keeping this up for much longer once they get an influx of Scoobs though!
Being a tart here, but is there a difference in sound bewteen this and the SS DP ?
Cheers,
Daz
I think this has made my mind up on the DP side. What a bargain! I can't imagine Halfords will be keeping this up for much longer once they get an influx of Scoobs though!
Being a tart here, but is there a difference in sound bewteen this and the SS DP ?
Cheers,
Daz
29 October 2001, 01:15 PM
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Martin,
I've got my car booked in to have a Powerflow de-cat centre and bb on Thursday (providing I get a problem fixed first). What options did you go for on yours? The last time I spoke to the fitter he was saying that I should have a pipe with a bit of a bend in it to produce some back pressure for the turbo. Did you have a stright through? How is it? I'm looking for something a bit quieter myself. Not too quite, but just a nice burbble. I hope they can do it..
I've got my car booked in to have a Powerflow de-cat centre and bb on Thursday (providing I get a problem fixed first). What options did you go for on yours? The last time I spoke to the fitter he was saying that I should have a pipe with a bit of a bend in it to produce some back pressure for the turbo. Did you have a stright through? How is it? I'm looking for something a bit quieter myself. Not too quite, but just a nice burbble. I hope they can do it..
29 October 2001, 01:16 PM
#10
Er, do you really want Halfords to work on your car? They can break a lot of stuff getting the DP changed! You may save £150 but how much will it cost to fix it!!!!
Just a thought.
F
Just a thought.
F
29 October 2001, 02:28 PM
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Nimbus,
I went for the straight through design. I took the car on the motorway for the first time yesterday since fitting the exhaust and must warn you that although it does sound great, it is rather loud in this situation. You may be best asking for a silencer on the centre section, to avoid upsets later.
I've just realised that the only problem with recommendations is that you'll blame me if it's too loud!!
Hope you like it mate.
As for fitting a downpipe, it's not exactly rocket science. It takes a long time 'cause you have to remove the heat shields which are fiddly to get to, but it's not difficult.
If they break something, sue 'em
MS
I went for the straight through design. I took the car on the motorway for the first time yesterday since fitting the exhaust and must warn you that although it does sound great, it is rather loud in this situation. You may be best asking for a silencer on the centre section, to avoid upsets later.
I've just realised that the only problem with recommendations is that you'll blame me if it's too loud!!
Hope you like it mate.
As for fitting a downpipe, it's not exactly rocket science. It takes a long time 'cause you have to remove the heat shields which are fiddly to get to, but it's not difficult.
If they break something, sue 'em
MS
29 October 2001, 03:19 PM
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Dazzler,
both are effectively straight through pipes. It's normally silencer construction and design which affects noise levels. Both the downpipes are the same diameter and made from the same grade and thickness of steel, so noise should be the same.
To be honest, the only increase in noise was the whistling from the turbo, nothing else.
Cheers,
MS
both are effectively straight through pipes. It's normally silencer construction and design which affects noise levels. Both the downpipes are the same diameter and made from the same grade and thickness of steel, so noise should be the same.
To be honest, the only increase in noise was the whistling from the turbo, nothing else.
Cheers,
MS
29 October 2001, 05:13 PM
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If I do have a downpipe fitted, as well as a de-catted centre, what are the implications in terms of fuel and dett'ing ?
Do I need to make sure that I use better than 95RON ? It's a standard UK Turbo, if that makes any difference.
Do I need to make sure that I use better than 95RON ? It's a standard UK Turbo, if that makes any difference.
30 October 2001, 02:12 PM
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if it flows better it will run lean. This causes in cylinder temps to rise. AT this point it is more prone to det. Running 97 or more octane will help here.
The standard ecu does tend to run the car with quite a bit extra fuel, so it should be enough to keep it safe. Best bet is to bbuy a knock and lambda link and fit them before the exhaust goes on. I always recommened they should be the first purchases made for the car.
If you get used to what teh lambda link does in combination with your right foot, and then after changing it doesnt light the same leds, you will know something has changed. You wil also know what are the safe limits.
The standard ecu does tend to run the car with quite a bit extra fuel, so it should be enough to keep it safe. Best bet is to bbuy a knock and lambda link and fit them before the exhaust goes on. I always recommened they should be the first purchases made for the car.
If you get used to what teh lambda link does in combination with your right foot, and then after changing it doesnt light the same leds, you will know something has changed. You wil also know what are the safe limits.
30 October 2001, 03:55 PM
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Adam,
Sorry for the potentially idiotic question, but what does the knock and Lamda link do exactly? And, just in case, how much is it and how can fit it?
I've got a UK 99T un-modded but want to get a downpipe fitted. My only hesitation is I don't want the Prodigy booming from the car!! Well... unless it's from the ICE anyway!
Zak
Sorry for the potentially idiotic question, but what does the knock and Lamda link do exactly? And, just in case, how much is it and how can fit it?
I've got a UK 99T un-modded but want to get a downpipe fitted. My only hesitation is I don't want the Prodigy booming from the car!! Well... unless it's from the ICE anyway!
Zak
30 October 2001, 04:27 PM
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a knocklink is a microphone attached to the engine preferably the block but not as necessity. It is connected to a meter with five leds. These light as they pick up high frequency noises from the engine. Det is a high frequency noise the intensity of which when correctly set up will light the biggest brightest led on the display inside the car.
Teh other lights also illuminate but these can be indicative of background noise during normaly engine running and are nothing to worry about.
Although the warning is given after the det occurs, it may cause you to back of thereby preventing more from happening. You may notice the car being noisy due to a bad batch of fuel, and so take it easy until it has run through.
A lambda link looks like a knocklink but is wired to the lambda sensor which is located in the downpipe or in the headers of earlier cars. It has an array of horizontally arranged leds (9 I think) each one intended to point out the amount of oxygen in the exhaust, thereby indicating air/fuel ratio.
For safety, out cars should run rich on boost, and the lambda link will indicate if this is happening. If you change the downpipe, turbo, air filter, intercooler, mid section, back box, headers, map etc (anything really) the air fuel ratio will be affected and this will show you how it is affected. If the car shows that it is running leaner on boost then more fuel is needed (requires mappable ecu or chip of some kind - bad idea except unichip).
It will therefore show you if your additions have made a difference or not, and if you are going to need to compensate the fuelling. they are very useful for mapping and keeping an eye on things, but have limited ability as they only work over a small range of lambda (air/fuel ratio) meaning if the car was so rich before it would ligth up the end led, but a change in the breathing of the system, though making it leaner migth not make it lean enough to move down a further led.
Unfortunatley this is the nature of using narow band lambda sensors but it still does not stop them from being a very effective tool.
You can get both for about £200 all in and fitted from brdevelopments, and scoobymania can also supply them and probably fit them too in their new premises!
Hope this helps.
Teh other lights also illuminate but these can be indicative of background noise during normaly engine running and are nothing to worry about.
Although the warning is given after the det occurs, it may cause you to back of thereby preventing more from happening. You may notice the car being noisy due to a bad batch of fuel, and so take it easy until it has run through.
A lambda link looks like a knocklink but is wired to the lambda sensor which is located in the downpipe or in the headers of earlier cars. It has an array of horizontally arranged leds (9 I think) each one intended to point out the amount of oxygen in the exhaust, thereby indicating air/fuel ratio.
For safety, out cars should run rich on boost, and the lambda link will indicate if this is happening. If you change the downpipe, turbo, air filter, intercooler, mid section, back box, headers, map etc (anything really) the air fuel ratio will be affected and this will show you how it is affected. If the car shows that it is running leaner on boost then more fuel is needed (requires mappable ecu or chip of some kind - bad idea except unichip).
It will therefore show you if your additions have made a difference or not, and if you are going to need to compensate the fuelling. they are very useful for mapping and keeping an eye on things, but have limited ability as they only work over a small range of lambda (air/fuel ratio) meaning if the car was so rich before it would ligth up the end led, but a change in the breathing of the system, though making it leaner migth not make it lean enough to move down a further led.
Unfortunatley this is the nature of using narow band lambda sensors but it still does not stop them from being a very effective tool.
You can get both for about £200 all in and fitted from brdevelopments, and scoobymania can also supply them and probably fit them too in their new premises!
Hope this helps.
30 October 2001, 04:46 PM
#23
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Just ordered the 180 quid fitted magnex D/P from Halfords, get it fitted on Tues - be interesting to see how it compares (sound and performance) to my mates full ScoobySport system.......
BTW - already got the Magnex DeCat Centre without resonator and Magnex BB so going for the full Magnex.
BTW - already got the Magnex DeCat Centre without resonator and Magnex BB so going for the full Magnex.
30 October 2001, 05:36 PM
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Hi,
My SS downpipe required about 3% fuel in certain areas to bring the a/f ratio back to where it was previously...
Noise is quite tolerable used in conjunction with a standard center section and SS back box. Not too much difference from the BB alone (apart from turbo noises).. well.. until you accelerate anyway
Cheers,
A.
[Edited by AlexM - 10/30/2001 5:38:48 PM]
My SS downpipe required about 3% fuel in certain areas to bring the a/f ratio back to where it was previously...
Noise is quite tolerable used in conjunction with a standard center section and SS back box. Not too much difference from the BB alone (apart from turbo noises).. well.. until you accelerate anyway
Cheers,
A.
[Edited by AlexM - 10/30/2001 5:38:48 PM]
01 November 2001, 02:40 PM
#25
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Hi
Have just returned from my local Halfords to ask about this offer and was told to try Halfords Garage stores which i phoned and they said they were all AA garages now and didn't know anything about this offer!
Can anyone explain this?
Pete
Have just returned from my local Halfords to ask about this offer and was told to try Halfords Garage stores which i phoned and they said they were all AA garages now and didn't know anything about this offer!
Can anyone explain this?
Pete
01 November 2001, 08:54 PM
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Pete (Stone) 
Its through Ripspeed in Halfords, so you need to find a Halfords with Ripspeed in it and they then give you a voucher for the garage part - now run by the AA to get it fitted.
Pete (Croney)
Where did you hear that Pete? Blimey - can't believe it as they had such a good reputation for build and fit quality........
So much for the Lifetime Guarantee then........
Cheers
Neil
Its through Ripspeed in Halfords, so you need to find a Halfords with Ripspeed in it and they then give you a voucher for the garage part - now run by the AA to get it fitted.
Pete (Croney)
Where did you hear that Pete? Blimey - can't believe it as they had such a good reputation for build and fit quality........
So much for the Lifetime Guarantee then........
Cheers
Neil