steve McCulloch

Whats the list price of HKS Headers and what should I realistically have to pay for them if I chose to get them?

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

Steve, they're listed at 815 quid, plus vat

I think your target price is going to be around 750 to 800 all in.

That certainly makes the ION ones look like good value.

Also I belevie that Hayward and Scott now offer a Manifold of their own that isn't to disimilar to the HKS...although I think Pat and Mark weren't too happy with the collector design on the HKS or the Haywards kit...and if that were the case Haywards would be your best bet as they could easily customise it

Pavlo

You can get an equivalent HKS style manifold for about £450 if you spend wisely.

Especially as you go to the US frequently it makes life very easy.

Best price I've seen was Gruppe-S in the US. They can also make some arrangements to reduce the overall cost once landed in the UK.

For something as complex as a turbo I would stick to a UK source. Harvey has had excellent service from iON in Canada, it's just the delays and delivery cost that put me off. However, you may find that there is an iON distributer very close to home in the near future. Local support would help I think, although the iON stuff aint cheap!

Also consider head work and cams. Expect to pay up to £600 for reprofiled cams with all new springs and retainers to suit. These would be high lift medium duration jobbies to give good top end without sacrificing low end grunt.

Personally I would say that for a 2.0 my (totally gut feel opinion) is that a GT25 with custom up and downpipe would be perfect. The nice thing about the Garrett stuff is the wheels and covers are all matched, so if you want to go bigger it's just a case of swapping them and rebalance, so quick turn around.

Paul

scoobyexhausts

edited to remove commercial content.

[Edited by P20SPD - 2/24/2003 7:24:25 PM]

R19KET

IMO, the HKS headers are fine, to a point. Ultimately, I think they are restrictive for high power cars, unless they are modified.

I use "custom" Hayward & Scott headers on my car. After two sessions on the engine dyno, Pat and I decided the twin up pipes were too restrictive, and I decided to get them modified.

Running the same boost, this gained 13% more torque, and 6% more BHP.

The issue had nothing to do with Haywards work/design, because they made them to a very specific design I gave them.

Mark.

NINJA

mark are u selling modified headers and if so what price..my email is paul.brian&whsmithnet.co.uk

steve McCulloch

Are Hayward/Scott similarly priced to HKS...

scoobyexhausts

Hi the price for the 4-1 header using standard up pipe or a de-cat up pipe is approx £650 +vat

steve McCulloch

That price sounds much better...... somehoe though I dont feel I woud be retaining the std up-pipe....

Mark A

so would the H/Scott 4-1 be less restrictive than the HKS one then??..

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

Steve, the HKS is a 4-1 design...I think it's the collector area (where it goes from 4 to 1) that could do with some work on the HKS...not having seen the Haywards one yet I wouldn't know if it's the dame, or if it's had a bit of Pat's influence on the design

steve McCulloch

H/S are very busy - tried a few times to get through.. I'll get there in the end...!

So how does this differ from the Ion one then.. as I remember reading a thread, must be well over a year ago saying that Ion were rather similar in design to HKS..?

I have not decided on any yet..... but now have a supplier if I take the HKS route... thanks....

Anyone got any piccies that could explain to me this 4 to 1 collector design

Terrible I dont even understand the concept of the 4-1 and the difference between this and the 4-2-1...... why is the 4-1 better than the 4-2-1... in laymans terms... Mark/Pat??

nom

Pat/Mark? No, but here's an idiot's guide from an idiot

4-1's better at the top end, so good if you want more power
Although they're a tad less driveable tha the 4-2-1 if you're one of those who pads about at the diesel end of the rev range. Which I don't think is your plan

Hmm, just thought - you may also be asking what it means? It's the way the collectors are organised - all 4 tubes of exhaust can go into one at the same time, or they can go in stages - from 4, then two of those pair into 2 (only 2 tubes left), then these remaining 2 tubes join into one. And, yes, a picture may have been easier, but with all the tubes writhing around each other it's actually quite hard to see anyway!

[Edited by nom - 2/24/2003 2:39:01 PM]

Gussie Cup

Steve - Have you considered equal length headers?

I've just bought the PE setup but haven't picked the car up yet so can't give any on the road experiences right now.

btw, I'm running a Turbo Dynamics MD270 turbo.

Ben

WendyT

pics here

www.scoobyexhausts.com

Halfway down the page!

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

Hmmm, different, slip joints on all 4 of the pipes going into the collector there then (H&S)

Could do with being a large bore pipe too IMHO

iON Performance

steve McCulloch - our headers feature no slip-joints, as well as they come with a matching cat-less up-pipe. We use a heavier gauge of T304SS. Our flanges are also thicker. Our headers comes standard with 1700F+ ceramic coat as well.

edited to remove commercial content.

[Edited by P20SPD - 2/25/2003 8:52:03 AM]

dowser

Tim - larger bore pipes will increase the spool point, while flowing more at the top end (imho).

I'll be trying to map around one of the H&S designs on an STi7 soon.

Richard

Tim W

iTrader: (1)

I thought it was esential to have some form of expansion joint between the banks, without and the expansion of the pipes could cause gasket failure.

The expansion (slip) joints on my HKS manifold have never leaked as far as I can tell, and I know they are free to move.

scoobyexhausts

You do need some sort of expansion joint, we do a double slip joint on all the connecting joints so as it can move side to side ( cylinder head to cylinder head )and front to back on the 4-1 collecter so as to eliminate and pressure points.

steve McCulloch

I'm sure that Bob Rawle had originally ordered me some Ion headers but there were problems with the machine being used to make them.. hence why I was looking elsewhere.. I may have got it wrong.. but I was supposed to be getting some initially by the end of Jan before some machine broke.. my apologies if this is not Ion

I think the alternative being suggested was not feasible.. some sort of welding and messing around

iON Performance

Tim W - depending on how the part was designed, as well as the material, you may or maynot need slip joints.

steve McCulloch - unfortunately the mandrels making that one tight radius piece had broken before. We've found a way to go around this problem and still make the headers.