Mac drive formatting
11 July 2007, 11:23 PM
#1
Mac drive formatting
Right. I've got a Powerbook G4, I bought it damaged. It just hangs when its says starting Mac OS. Don't know what version, as it won't start.
I'm very new to Mac's, so I'm having a play around with Mac's version of DOS (don't know what its called). Done an fsck -f. My impression is that, that checks the hdd to see if its OK. Its come back OK.
Now the questions:
1. How can I view the files already on the disk, in this sigle user mode?
2. How can I reformat it in this mode? I don't now how to view the drive, its not like DOS where c: is the hdd.
3. What can I do to get it running? I have a legit copy of OS X 10.2 start up disks, but I can't boot from them
I'm very new to Mac's, so I'm having a play around with Mac's version of DOS (don't know what its called). Done an fsck -f. My impression is that, that checks the hdd to see if its OK. Its come back OK.
Now the questions:
1. How can I view the files already on the disk, in this sigle user mode?
2. How can I reformat it in this mode? I don't now how to view the drive, its not like DOS where c: is the hdd.
3. What can I do to get it running? I have a legit copy of OS X 10.2 start up disks, but I can't boot from them
12 July 2007, 12:51 AM
#2
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Yes you can view files, the unix equivelent of dir is ls. Paths are separated with /, the root of the drive instead of being C: is /
So to list directories on the root of the drive you'd issue the following command:
ls -la /
This will display all files and folders
you can use cd, as you would in DOS to enter the directories and use the ls command again to view the contents.
As for formatting via the command line, I think the diskutil command might do it, you'd want to enter "man diskutil" to bring up the manual page for it to find out the correct command to use.
As for getting it up and running, well, if you format the drive and you don't have boot disks then you're a bit stuffed.
What I'd suggest is the following. Reboot the machine and immediatley hold down the shift key and keep it held down. See if the machine boots up at that point, if so then it sounds as though there is a problem with a startup item, which we can troubleshoot. If that does not work then a bootable install disk is the best thing to use.
You say your cd's are not bootable, try the following. Reboot the machine and immeditatley hold down the option/alt key and keep it held down until you see the startup disk selector screen. Insert your 10.2 CD and press the round arrow button (indicating refresh) and see if it displays the CD, if so, click on it to select it, then click the other arrow button to get it to boot up from that CD.
If that does not work, hmm, well, you'll need a bootable OS CD of some sort.
So to list directories on the root of the drive you'd issue the following command:
ls -la /
This will display all files and folders
you can use cd, as you would in DOS to enter the directories and use the ls command again to view the contents.
As for formatting via the command line, I think the diskutil command might do it, you'd want to enter "man diskutil" to bring up the manual page for it to find out the correct command to use.
As for getting it up and running, well, if you format the drive and you don't have boot disks then you're a bit stuffed.
What I'd suggest is the following. Reboot the machine and immediatley hold down the shift key and keep it held down. See if the machine boots up at that point, if so then it sounds as though there is a problem with a startup item, which we can troubleshoot. If that does not work then a bootable install disk is the best thing to use.
You say your cd's are not bootable, try the following. Reboot the machine and immeditatley hold down the option/alt key and keep it held down until you see the startup disk selector screen. Insert your 10.2 CD and press the round arrow button (indicating refresh) and see if it displays the CD, if so, click on it to select it, then click the other arrow button to get it to boot up from that CD.
If that does not work, hmm, well, you'll need a bootable OS CD of some sort.
12 July 2007, 09:41 AM
#3
Thanks for the reply.
I was hoping to reformat the drive, and then see if I could re-install the OS from scratch. Because it seems I cannot install it any other way so far. All of the commands I use in diskutil seem to ask for pemission of the drive to perform these actions.
I've tried booting it with the option key held down, and got the menu selector. Without a disk, it shows the HDD as an option, then with disk in and refreshed, it shows the OS disk. If I select this, it boots from it, and the apple logo with the spinning timer thing shows up. I heard it can take over 20mins to boot from disk, but after about 20 mins or so, it shuts down.
I also have another G4 Powerbook that shows the a folder with a question mark, that changes into the OS logo, on bootup. So I can assume the OS is messed up. I get the same thing when I try booting from the disks I've got, waiting 20 mins or so, then shut down.
I heard some of the OS X's are updates, and cannot be installed from fresh. Maybe its that?
I was hoping to reformat the drive, and then see if I could re-install the OS from scratch. Because it seems I cannot install it any other way so far. All of the commands I use in diskutil seem to ask for pemission of the drive to perform these actions.
I've tried booting it with the option key held down, and got the menu selector. Without a disk, it shows the HDD as an option, then with disk in and refreshed, it shows the OS disk. If I select this, it boots from it, and the apple logo with the spinning timer thing shows up. I heard it can take over 20mins to boot from disk, but after about 20 mins or so, it shuts down.
I also have another G4 Powerbook that shows the a folder with a question mark, that changes into the OS logo, on bootup. So I can assume the OS is messed up. I get the same thing when I try booting from the disks I've got, waiting 20 mins or so, then shut down.
I heard some of the OS X's are updates, and cannot be installed from fresh. Maybe its that?
12 July 2007, 12:38 PM
#4
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If diskutil is asking for permission to the drive then it sounds as though you've not mounted it read/write. Boot into single user mode, don't run the fsck command but do run the following:
/sbin/mount -uw /
This will mount the root filesystem with read/write permissions. Then you could try the diskutil commands
If the bootloader is allowing you to select the CD when you insert it that's something. Try that again, and as soon as you click the arrow and it goes to boot from the CD, hold down Shift key and keep it held down, see if it boots.
What exact spec is the powerbook? I ask as they should be able to run 10.2, certainly the first gen ones could. The later aluminum might not be able to run 10.2, which could explain why the machine won't boot from the CD.
I am wondering if perhaps the hard drive is on the way out. The machine can take a very very long time to boot, if it'll boot at all, and this is from the internal drive, let alone a boot disk.
As for the other powerbook, I have seen machines briefly show the question mark and then switch to the OS logo, typically if they get to that point they have found the OS, but there is possibly an underlying problem.
I don't suppose you have a mac that is working and that has a firewire port, if so then turn off both machines, powerup the "bad" one and as soon as makes the startup chime, hold down the "T" key and keep it held down until you see a blue screen with a firewire logo on it. Plug a firewire cable between the "bad" and the "good" machine, then powerup the "good" machine. The hard drive from the "bad" machine will show up on the desktop of the good machine (it's known as firewire target disk mode).
This will allow you to examine the disk, plus run disk utility or any other diagnostic utility (TechTool Pro and Disk Warrior beinggood examples) against it and see what happens.
What you can also do is to pop the 10.2 CD into the machine and have a look at it, I'd try running the installer and see if it plays ball, what should happen is it'll reboot from the good machine, boot up the installer and then you should be able to reinstall the OS by selecting the drive from the bad machine that is connected via firewire.
As for the OS X disks being updates, I think with some of the early ones that might have been the case, but as far as I remember, from 10.3, all the install CD's I have are the full OS. I've certainly got 10.3.0 and 10.3.3 full installer disks, along with various versions of 10.4. as well. One thing it might be is that some disks are specific to a particular mac model, so if the disks you have were supplied with a specific machine they might not work on another machine. I'm fairly sure the disks I have with my iBook won't allow me to install the OS on, for example, my G4 Tower.
/sbin/mount -uw /
This will mount the root filesystem with read/write permissions. Then you could try the diskutil commands
If the bootloader is allowing you to select the CD when you insert it that's something. Try that again, and as soon as you click the arrow and it goes to boot from the CD, hold down Shift key and keep it held down, see if it boots.
What exact spec is the powerbook? I ask as they should be able to run 10.2, certainly the first gen ones could. The later aluminum might not be able to run 10.2, which could explain why the machine won't boot from the CD.
I am wondering if perhaps the hard drive is on the way out. The machine can take a very very long time to boot, if it'll boot at all, and this is from the internal drive, let alone a boot disk.
As for the other powerbook, I have seen machines briefly show the question mark and then switch to the OS logo, typically if they get to that point they have found the OS, but there is possibly an underlying problem.
I don't suppose you have a mac that is working and that has a firewire port, if so then turn off both machines, powerup the "bad" one and as soon as makes the startup chime, hold down the "T" key and keep it held down until you see a blue screen with a firewire logo on it. Plug a firewire cable between the "bad" and the "good" machine, then powerup the "good" machine. The hard drive from the "bad" machine will show up on the desktop of the good machine (it's known as firewire target disk mode).
This will allow you to examine the disk, plus run disk utility or any other diagnostic utility (TechTool Pro and Disk Warrior beinggood examples) against it and see what happens.
What you can also do is to pop the 10.2 CD into the machine and have a look at it, I'd try running the installer and see if it plays ball, what should happen is it'll reboot from the good machine, boot up the installer and then you should be able to reinstall the OS by selecting the drive from the bad machine that is connected via firewire.
As for the OS X disks being updates, I think with some of the early ones that might have been the case, but as far as I remember, from 10.3, all the install CD's I have are the full OS. I've certainly got 10.3.0 and 10.3.3 full installer disks, along with various versions of 10.4. as well. One thing it might be is that some disks are specific to a particular mac model, so if the disks you have were supplied with a specific machine they might not work on another machine. I'm fairly sure the disks I have with my iBook won't allow me to install the OS on, for example, my G4 Tower.
13 July 2007, 10:50 AM
#5
Thanks for the replies. I think I will leave the reformat as a last resort then.
Pretty sures its a 1.67ghz Powerbook, I think I saw that near the battery. Its aluminum, got a gig of ram.
With regars to the hardrive. I suppose I could take it out, and connect it to my PC via USB. I should be able to run a defrag on it, test it out.
I do have another working mac, a Macbook Pro, but don't have a firewaire cable. I could get one on the weekend though, and give that a try.
The original OS disks I've got are for a PowerMac G4, but assumed they would work with the PowerBooks. So that solves that one.
Anyway, thanks for the help so far. I'll get busy with it on the weekend, and report back.
ta
Pretty sures its a 1.67ghz Powerbook, I think I saw that near the battery. Its aluminum, got a gig of ram.
With regars to the hardrive. I suppose I could take it out, and connect it to my PC via USB. I should be able to run a defrag on it, test it out.
I do have another working mac, a Macbook Pro, but don't have a firewaire cable. I could get one on the weekend though, and give that a try.
The original OS disks I've got are for a PowerMac G4, but assumed they would work with the PowerBooks. So that solves that one.
Anyway, thanks for the help so far. I'll get busy with it on the weekend, and report back.
ta
13 July 2007, 12:47 PM
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When you say you can connect the drive via USB to the PC, one assumes you've got an external enclosure that'll handle the smaller drives that the laptops use as they aren't the normal hard drive size.
There is also the fact that the PC probably won't see the drive if it's running Windows, as typically they don't see HFS+ formatted drives
If you have an enclosure that'll handle the drive, then pop it in the enclosure and hook the enslosure up to the Macbook and see if the drive comes up. That will at least allow you to have a look at the disk and run diskutility on it and see what it pics up. You probably won't be able to boot from it as the MacBook won't handle 10.2, but you can at least find out what's up with it. A firewire cable might not be the godsend it seems at this juncture, as you may be able to see the drive (as you would via the usb enclosure) but you still won't be able to install 10.2 on it when it's connected to the MacBook as the host would be the MacBook and that won't run 10.2, so the installer won't run. Don't use the disks that came with the MacBook either, as they will probably be intel only and that won't work on the PPC laptop.
There is also the fact that the PC probably won't see the drive if it's running Windows, as typically they don't see HFS+ formatted drives
If you have an enclosure that'll handle the drive, then pop it in the enclosure and hook the enslosure up to the Macbook and see if the drive comes up. That will at least allow you to have a look at the disk and run diskutility on it and see what it pics up. You probably won't be able to boot from it as the MacBook won't handle 10.2, but you can at least find out what's up with it. A firewire cable might not be the godsend it seems at this juncture, as you may be able to see the drive (as you would via the usb enclosure) but you still won't be able to install 10.2 on it when it's connected to the MacBook as the host would be the MacBook and that won't run 10.2, so the installer won't run. Don't use the disks that came with the MacBook either, as they will probably be intel only and that won't work on the PPC laptop.
Last edited by Markus; 13 July 2007 at 12:50 PM.
13 July 2007, 06:22 PM
#7
Yes I've got an external enclosure, I use the 2.5 hdd's as media players, and portable storage.
Didn't think of that. I'll use the usb link up straight to the macbook. my macbooks on 10.4. Why won't it run 10.2 if thats an older version? Is it because its Intel based like you said?
Didn't think of that. I'll use the usb link up straight to the macbook. my macbooks on 10.4. Why won't it run 10.2 if thats an older version? Is it because its Intel based like you said?
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14 July 2007, 12:09 AM
#8
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It won't run 10.2 for a few reasons, the main one being that all versions of the OS prior to 10.4.4 were PowerPC only, so they would not run on the Intel architecture. Even if the machine were PowerPC then it's possible it may not run 10.2 either. For example, my G4 iBook will not run 10.2, 10.3 is the earliest OS that it will support.
This isn't too surprising considering that 10.2 is now obsolete. It was released in 2002 and the last update, 10.2.8, was released in October 2003, there were a couple of security updates for it, but once 10.4 was released (late 2005) it was no longer supported. I think the same will happen to 10.3 when 10.5 is released in October.
As with any OS, the manufacturer will always try and ensure that you move to the latest version of the OS, and obviously, newer machines are designed to only run the latest version of the OS.
This isn't too surprising considering that 10.2 is now obsolete. It was released in 2002 and the last update, 10.2.8, was released in October 2003, there were a couple of security updates for it, but once 10.4 was released (late 2005) it was no longer supported. I think the same will happen to 10.3 when 10.5 is released in October.
As with any OS, the manufacturer will always try and ensure that you move to the latest version of the OS, and obviously, newer machines are designed to only run the latest version of the OS.
15 July 2007, 12:36 AM
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to boot a mac from CD you hold down the "C" key while booting, this then boots to the CD (providing it's a bootable copy)
then when in the boot menue you select "utilities" and then run the disk restore utility...
....well that what i did with my MacBook Pro anyways
feel free to correct me..
then when in the boot menue you select "utilities" and then run the disk restore utility...
....well that what i did with my MacBook Pro anyways
feel free to correct me..
16 July 2007, 01:21 PM
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Your machine will only work with 10.4 mate so you will have to get a copy of that.
Boot from the C key and then go through the installer and choose the Erase and install option if you have to
Boot from the C key and then go through the installer and choose the Erase and install option if you have to
16 July 2007, 11:16 PM
#11
Right guys, I'm currently still working on these when I've got time.
I'm installer a 4 CD version of 10.4. It goes through the whole process, then says it cannot be installed at this time. The log seems to point to the final CD, having errors with the print drivers. Is there anyway to skip this?
Also, another machine I have mentioned, has no screen. when display it throught my monitor, it looks like it only shows one side of the screen. As the cursor goes all the way to the left and off the screen. I've trien the function button and F7, which looks like the VGA/LCD button, it hasn't done anything, any ideas?
I'm installer a 4 CD version of 10.4. It goes through the whole process, then says it cannot be installed at this time. The log seems to point to the final CD, having errors with the print drivers. Is there anyway to skip this?
Also, another machine I have mentioned, has no screen. when display it throught my monitor, it looks like it only shows one side of the screen. As the cursor goes all the way to the left and off the screen. I've trien the function button and F7, which looks like the VGA/LCD button, it hasn't done anything, any ideas?
17 July 2007, 12:13 AM
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Joey,
In relation to the printer drivers, when you boot from the first CD you'll get to the screen where you can select the drive you want to install on, there should be a "Customize" button on that dialog, or the next one. Click that and you can decide exactly what to install, at this point I'd uncheck the options for printer drivers, in fact, don't bother installing additional languages either.
This should hopefully allow you to get the base OS on the machine.
As for the other machine with no screen, do you see the dock at all or the menu bar? You could try a reboot and zap the PRAM (reboot and hold down command + option + P + R, keep them held down until the machine chimes again) and see if that helps with the display.
In relation to the printer drivers, when you boot from the first CD you'll get to the screen where you can select the drive you want to install on, there should be a "Customize" button on that dialog, or the next one. Click that and you can decide exactly what to install, at this point I'd uncheck the options for printer drivers, in fact, don't bother installing additional languages either.
This should hopefully allow you to get the base OS on the machine.
As for the other machine with no screen, do you see the dock at all or the menu bar? You could try a reboot and zap the PRAM (reboot and hold down command + option + P + R, keep them held down until the machine chimes again) and see if that helps with the display.
17 July 2007, 09:32 AM
#13
Thanks Markus.
I'll re-install from the first CD then, as now it just asks me to begin installation from the 2nd CD onwards. So I'll give the customisation a try.
On the one with no screen, it almost caught on fire last night. I had the case half open with the charger in, One of the ribbon cables started melting to the metal fan. So I'll be using that for spares
I'll re-install from the first CD then, as now it just asks me to begin installation from the 2nd CD onwards. So I'll give the customisation a try.
On the one with no screen, it almost caught on fire last night. I had the case half open with the charger in, One of the ribbon cables started melting to the metal fan. So I'll be using that for spares
21 July 2007, 02:55 PM
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No problem at all Joey 
One major bit of advice for you. If you're not at 10.4.10 yet, go and download the combo updater and use that to apply the update, don't use software update. I've not (touches wood) had a problem with SU, but a few people have, so given the grief you've had getting the machine back, this could push you over the edge if it fouls up
Might also be worth checking to see what updates SU mentions and going to Apple Downloads and downloading the files from there and applying them one at a time.
Also and this is very very very important, when you're installing these things do NOT use the machine at all. Make sure all apps are closed. Key point is when the installer is saying "Optimizing Mac OS". It's updating the prebinding and if you do anything on the machine whilst this is happening it can cause all sorts of problems.
One major bit of advice for you. If you're not at 10.4.10 yet, go and download the combo updater and use that to apply the update, don't use software update. I've not (touches wood) had a problem with SU, but a few people have, so given the grief you've had getting the machine back, this could push you over the edge if it fouls up
Might also be worth checking to see what updates SU mentions and going to Apple Downloads and downloading the files from there and applying them one at a time.
Also and this is very very very important, when you're installing these things do NOT use the machine at all. Make sure all apps are closed. Key point is when the installer is saying "Optimizing Mac OS". It's updating the prebinding and if you do anything on the machine whilst this is happening it can cause all sorts of problems.
30 July 2007, 07:08 PM
#16
Hi Markus, the laptop I had a problem with on this thread is all running fine. However, I've just sold my mac book pro with 10.4.10 installed, but I want to reset to factory settings. I done it before, and when it boots up it prompts you to set the language etc. I just can't remember how. Do you know? Thanks
31 July 2007, 02:20 AM
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Sounds like it's running the setup assistant, which will ask all that type of info. Basically I'd leave it like that and let the new owner set the other options up. The reason I suggest this is that at one point it'll ask for an owner name and it's probably best if they choose one, rather than you doing it. As long as you send the install disks with it then all should be fine, as worst case they can boot from the install disks and reinstall.
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