zhastaph

I've always understood that the max distance is 100m (per run).

Our installation team need to run a length of about 250m, how strict is this 100m? I've always seen RS232 being quoted at 15m but we have many installations in excess of 50m

If we use STP can this go further?

Wireless isn't really an option.

Cheers

boxst

Hello

I have always been told 100 meters, and haven't really tried to exceed it. Can't you put a hub half way to wherever you are trying to connect?

Steve.

darlodge

Max recommended length is 100m however you can use either one long cable or use a few 100m lengths and use couplers but you are very likely to experience data loss or packet drops. I personally avoid running anything over 50m.

If they added a switch or even a hub every 100m the signal would be loads better.

Darren

zhastaph

This is what they're going to do if they have to, having extra hubs add to the unreliablity of the system as they can be disconnected.

What about STP? Anybody have any experience? Can it be run further?

ozzy

STP is most often used in Token Ring networks (my only experience of it).

Advantage is it's less susceptible to radio & electrical interference. It has no effect on overall distance of individual runs.

Like anything, the cable is gauranteed to perform to a certain level. UTP and STP is 100m individual segments. You can get more out of it, but that's down to the quality of the cable and hubs/switches used. I wouldn't count on it though.

CAT5E, CAT6, etc.. are all to do with their ability to handle increased bandwidth/frequencies and are still restricted to 100m runs (charactaristic of twisted pairs).

How far are your runs? What about running something like a fibre backbone and moving a switch/hub closer to the devices.

Stefan

ozzy

Sorry, just re-read your intial post.

250m. Daisy-chaining multiple hubs/switches is a bad idea and poor design, so I would look at running a fibre backbone (max 2.5km IIRC). All you'll need is a switch at either end supporting a fibre connection.

Then you can just run UTP to the desktops.

Stefan

Scoobydid

If your running outside between buildings you should use fibre for a number of reasons;
Optical fibre has the following benefits over copper cabling:

Greater distance capability
Signals can be sent over a far greater distance using fibre optic cable.

Electrical separation
If a copper cable is run between two locations or buildings you can get a voltage running down the cable if they are on different phases. In extreme cases, this can cause hardware damage.

Lightning damage
If copper cables are run externally, particularly at a height, they can work as a very efficient lightning conductor! This is not good for the hardware at either end. Fuses are available which are reputed to alleviate this problem, however there is the risk that the lightning could still jump the gap, or they may not blow in time to save the hardware.

Assuming a clear duct with pull wires, I would charge about £1100.00 inc RJ45 - fibre media adapters which can just plug into the switches or PC's, whatever you have.
If you want to know any more mail me.

Cheers
Andy

sti555

I've successfully run a couple of installs with a high quality cat5e both over 160 & 180metres.. with very good network performance, low latency etc, I can understand what the other peeps here are saying re fibre is the way forward for these sort of runs, but this is only temporary so could'nt justify the cost or install time..

Have also used the "daisy chain" method with good results, again another quick budget job, be aware no all switchs/hubs/routers etc will work over 100m, bit of trial & error to get a lan connection.

I have found the d-link 614+/624+ wireless routers are handy & work well over distance.

Why not consider a wireless point to point high gain antenna based setup or Access points in repeating mode.. or a mix of wired/wireless connections?/

I do quite alot of installs & site testing so email me if you need more help

David_Wallis

depending on the bandwith required.. ie 10mbps..

you could go backwards and use 10base5

and AUI connectors..

IMHO..

Fibre is the only 'real' way to do this..

assuming you are installing it yourself, you can buy cheap pre-terminated fibre..

No offence to the price mentioned prior, but I have had multimode 24 pair fibres installed.. including 19" panels and termination (both SC and ST) done for less than that. but we do have a fair bit of fibre and use it for distances less than even 100m

depending on what you want to connect and what future bandwith you require then.. its got to be fibre... Add spare pairs as the cost is minimal.. bearing in mind you need at least one pair.. per device.. (normally)

Also remember than you can run gigabit comfortably over fibre...

Ive also used cat 5 in excess of 100m..

ps rs485 has greater distance than 232 too irc

zhastaph

Many thanks everyone for your input. Tomorrow we're going to look seriously into the costing of using fibre for the route.

It's funny you should say that, we are actually replacing an RS485 based system.

Scoobydid

No offence taken David but I would be interested in your installers, they can sub for me any day at those rates.
Trade cost for 250m of 24 core with connectors and breakout boxes is a shade over a grand (excluding labour) so for 24 pair (ie 48 core), you must be off with the fairies mate

It was only a finger in the air price and did include everything, not just a dark fibre.

David_Wallis

Lol..

We put a fair bit of work their way.. we also have people in house capable of terminating fibre.. Ill terminate anything copper.. just hate over 100pair..

Besides I do IT not voice or data anymore..

http://www.minitran.co.uk/acatalog/Main_OCC_88.html

OCC 9/125 Singlemode Cable

fair enough only 12 pair.. 24core..

2.25per meter.

David

Scoobydid

LOL...........

Who do you use?, I don't do much fibre or copper any more, too busy selling it, though I did get out on the tools last Friday night to help out a customer - beats going to the pub
Your right though it starts to get a bit boring after 100 pair.

I wouldn't use single mode over a distance as short as that, the cable will be cheaper sure, but the terminations are more expensive as most people still splice these days, and singlemode GBICS and media adapters will outway the saving on cable.

Their multimode prices are way out, standard nexans 4 core for 90ppm, I get Gigalite II (extended distance) for about that, and they are charging £1.50 per m.

If you get their book prices and your happy with that, your bonkers, I can sell most of that kit to you for less than them.

Seriously David, if I can't match the prices your paying, I know an excellent disty who will.

Cheers
Andy