Bob Crow dead
12 March 2014, 11:30 AM
#62
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His option of living in a council house was highly criticised, and rightly so. He took a council house that could have been given to someone who wasnt earning 100k + a year.
He was a prime example of a heart attack waiting to happen. All day I've been hearing various 'friends' of his on the radio / TV saying how shocking it was as he was 'very fit' and went to the gym etc etc. he wasnt fit in the slightest. Ate very rich foods, drunk lots of booze etc etc. a heart attack waiting to happen.
He was a prime example of a heart attack waiting to happen. All day I've been hearing various 'friends' of his on the radio / TV saying how shocking it was as he was 'very fit' and went to the gym etc etc. he wasnt fit in the slightest. Ate very rich foods, drunk lots of booze etc etc. a heart attack waiting to happen.
You don't like him, that's fair enough, but show some respect for the dead. I didn't 'like' him but I can recognise what he achieved for his members. Yes, he might have damaged the economy and pissed off commuters but we criticise politicians who take the easy route, so we can't have it both ways.
Paradoxically I see many similarities between him and Thatcher, despite their differences. I wish that today's politicians would show the conviction and dedication to their cause that Crow and Thatcher did.
12 March 2014, 12:02 PM
#65
Yeah but the people who were vilifying him don't even support the idea of social housing.
They only say that to score points.
They hate the idea of someone either not owning their own home, or not paying rent to a landlord.
Why is that?
It's nothing to do with 'fairness' but making such all suffer equally.
They only say that to score points.
They hate the idea of someone either not owning their own home, or not paying rent to a landlord.
Why is that?
It's nothing to do with 'fairness' but making such all suffer equally.
12 March 2014, 12:21 PM
#66
Nobody will take you seriously unless you've got bargaining power. Fortunately for his members and unfortunately for his protagonists Bob had plenty of bargaining power and the testicular fortitude to use it. Ultimately his loyalty and effort was to get the best deal for his members. He was doing something right as he pissed a lot of people off.
He was also an opportunistic blackmailer, threatening strike actions during national events like the royal wedding, world cup qualifying matches, Wimbledon and even bribed upto £2000 for worker just to do a normal days work during the Olympics.
He causes misery for tens of thousands Londoners and commuters and costs businesses tens of millions of pounds for each day of strike action and there are many instances where his militant followers bully other RMT members in to voting for strike action. He's no more ethical than bankers we all love to vilify.
12 March 2014, 02:07 PM
#67
He was also an opportunistic blackmailer, threatening strike actions during national events like the royal wedding, world cup qualifying matches, Wimbledon and even bribed upto £2000 for worker just to do a normal days work during the Olympics. He causes misery for tens of thousands Londoners and commuters and costs businesses tens of millions of pounds for each day of strike action and there are many instances where his militant followers bully other RMT members in to voting for strike action. He's no more ethical than bankers we all love to vilify.
Too f@cking right. As already said the paymasters were hardly going to acquiesce if he'd asked nicely and promised to be a good boy. He used what means were at his disposal to negotiate a better deal for his members. The sort of thing an elected representative is supposed to do. I can imagine he was a thorn in the side for some, seen to be empowering peasants who should be seen and not heard according to the 'ruling classes'.
Comparing him to bankers is obtuse. Bankers were only acting in their own interests. They were fixing the interest rate and when things went **** up the taxpayer had to bail them out.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/tomgroen...ble-and-legit/
12 March 2014, 02:17 PM
#68
He was also an opportunistic blackmailer, threatening strike actions during national events like the royal wedding, world cup qualifying matches, Wimbledon and even bribed upto £2000 for worker just to do a normal days work during the Olympics.
He causes misery for tens of thousands Londoners and commuters and costs businesses tens of millions of pounds for each day of strike action and there are many instances where his militant followers bully other RMT members in to voting for strike action. He's no more ethical than bankers we all love to vilify.
He causes misery for tens of thousands Londoners and commuters and costs businesses tens of millions of pounds for each day of strike action and there are many instances where his militant followers bully other RMT members in to voting for strike action. He's no more ethical than bankers we all love to vilify.
If government and the companies are daft enough to concentrate EVERYTHING in one tiny area, then surely the people who are tasked with their safe transport are worth a LOT of money...after all, it "costs businesses tens of millions of pounds for each day of strike action" so they should be willing to pay to keep the transport system safe.
You seem to be saying it's fine to have all that money being made, but not much of it going to the very people who keep it happening?
12 March 2014, 02:34 PM
#69
No, the irony is that both a capitalist organisation and socialist organistation extort money from tax payers for their own interests, but just goes about it in different ways, one uses financial instruments, the other uses belligerence and threats. Both are the same in that the greedy few don't give a flying fig on the how it affects everyone else.
12 March 2014, 02:44 PM
#70
Too f@cking right. As already said the paymasters were hardly going to acquiesce if he'd asked nicely and promised to be a good boy. He used what means were at his disposal to negotiate a better deal for his members. The sort of thing an elected representative is supposed to do. I can imagine he was a thorn in the side for some, seen to be empowering peasants who should be seen and not heard according to the 'ruling classes'.
Comparing him to bankers is obtuse. Bankers were only acting in their own interests. They were fixing the interest rate and when things went **** up the taxpayer had to bail them out.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/tomgroen...ble-and-legit/
Comparing him to bankers is obtuse. Bankers were only acting in their own interests. They were fixing the interest rate and when things went **** up the taxpayer had to bail them out.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/tomgroen...ble-and-legit/
12 March 2014, 03:13 PM
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He was also an opportunistic blackmailer, threatening strike actions during national events like the royal wedding, world cup qualifying matches, Wimbledon and even bribed upto £2000 for worker just to do a normal days work during the Olympics.
He causes misery for tens of thousands Londoners and commuters and costs businesses tens of millions of pounds for each day of strike action and there are many instances where his militant followers bully other RMT members in to voting for strike action. He's no more ethical than bankers we all love to vilify.
He causes misery for tens of thousands Londoners and commuters and costs businesses tens of millions of pounds for each day of strike action and there are many instances where his militant followers bully other RMT members in to voting for strike action. He's no more ethical than bankers we all love to vilify.
One is deemed a problem, the other a right.
12 March 2014, 04:08 PM
#74
I'm guessing the irony of you wanting to evade tax is lost on you then.
12 March 2014, 04:58 PM
#75
He was also an opportunistic blackmailer, threatening strike actions during national events like the royal wedding, world cup qualifying matches, Wimbledon and even bribed upto £2000 for worker just to do a normal days work during the Olympics.
He causes misery for tens of thousands Londoners and commuters and costs businesses tens of millions of pounds for each day of strike action and there are many instances where his militant followers bully other RMT members in to voting for strike action. He's no more ethical than bankers we all love to vilify.
He causes misery for tens of thousands Londoners and commuters and costs businesses tens of millions of pounds for each day of strike action and there are many instances where his militant followers bully other RMT members in to voting for strike action. He's no more ethical than bankers we all love to vilify.
12 March 2014, 05:12 PM
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Bloke was a hero, should be given a state funeral IMO!
Not for the good work he did for his members so much, but for the fact he seemed to p1ss off so many of the posters on here who are complete ****s 
Not for the good work he did for his members so much, but for the fact he seemed to p1ss off so many of the posters on here who are complete ****s
12 March 2014, 05:24 PM
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12 March 2014, 05:35 PM
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He did what he thought was right for the people he represented and got them vastly improved working conditions and salaries as a result.
As I said before if our politicians showed a tenth of the dedication and application he did the country would be a better place.
You don't have to agree with what he stood for, but you have to admire the way he stood for it!
As I said before if our politicians showed a tenth of the dedication and application he did the country would be a better place.
You don't have to agree with what he stood for, but you have to admire the way he stood for it!
12 March 2014, 05:39 PM
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12 March 2014, 05:49 PM
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You don't have to agree with what he stood for, but you have to admire the way he stood for it!
12 March 2014, 06:01 PM
#82
Any firm evidence to back up these sweeping statements? I once played squash against a colleague who was grossly overweight and was red-faced after 30 seconds. He ran rings around me whilst I almost collapsed. I'm not saying that I know Crow was physically fit (as I don't know), but appearances can be deceptive.
12 March 2014, 06:06 PM
#83
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I respect what he stood for, but that's as far as it goes. He effectively held the country to ransom with his strategically timed strikes, punishing the millions of commuters / family's / tourists etc that just want to go about their lives doing their jobs, having a decent holiday / day out etc. good riddens to an idiot as far as I'm concerned.
If those services are so essential then its the governments job to insist on no strike contracts for rail workers, not Mr Crowe's.
12 March 2014, 06:06 PM
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OK I can't take any more of this thread without adding my thought.
Firstly I'm sorry for his family and the awful loss they must feel at such a sudden death at such a young age, that is shocking.
Now let's talk about the man.
He was an effective operator for his members. During his time as RMT leader we saw the way salaries and T&C improved.
Crow knew how important London is for the economy, and he knew how important public transport is for London. This gave him the perfect bargaining chip.
I blame the govenment for letting him and his militant bunch of upstarts get away with it for so long. The legacy of BC is drivers salaries that have ballooned to almost comical proportions. This rise in salaries has been matched by the ridiculous rise in fares (especially on the underground), ultimately it's the 'working man' (someone Crow would have extolled) that ended up paying for this.
In the case of the underground drivers I would of commissioned a study into the viability of replacing drivers with computers (which had been done in lots of major subway systems), and pushed it across the desk next time he came looking for more,> Now that really would of 'shot his fox'.
Firstly I'm sorry for his family and the awful loss they must feel at such a sudden death at such a young age, that is shocking.
Now let's talk about the man.
He was an effective operator for his members. During his time as RMT leader we saw the way salaries and T&C improved.
Crow knew how important London is for the economy, and he knew how important public transport is for London. This gave him the perfect bargaining chip.
I blame the govenment for letting him and his militant bunch of upstarts get away with it for so long. The legacy of BC is drivers salaries that have ballooned to almost comical proportions. This rise in salaries has been matched by the ridiculous rise in fares (especially on the underground), ultimately it's the 'working man' (someone Crow would have extolled) that ended up paying for this.
In the case of the underground drivers I would of commissioned a study into the viability of replacing drivers with computers (which had been done in lots of major subway systems), and pushed it across the desk next time he came looking for more,> Now that really would of 'shot his fox'.
Last edited by Martin2005; 12 March 2014 at 06:09 PM.
12 March 2014, 06:08 PM
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Not in the eyes of a right wing 'I'm alright Jack' type no, I guess not! To all the members he represented I expect so
Transport for London and other organisations his members worked for all had the opportunity to sit at the table and negotiate, but more often than not they chose instead confrontational moves such as ripping up working practice agreements and job security contracts ..... effectively bullying the workforce as many such outfits have been aboe to do since Thatcher made the trade unions a dirty word.
Bob Crow stood up to them and fought with what ever tools he had available and for the most part won! If they had talked sense from the outset there wuld have been no need for strikes!
Best of luck to him, may be rest in peace!
No I don't, neither do I admire the way he did things either, as previously stated he was an opportunistic blackmailer who was prepared to and often did cause misery to millions. Can you imagine the mess we'd be in if all union leaders were like this. Back to the good old days with no lights, no heating, no cooking, no schools, factories shut etc etc.
Bob Crow stood up to them and fought with what ever tools he had available and for the most part won! If they had talked sense from the outset there wuld have been no need for strikes!
Best of luck to him, may be rest in peace!
12 March 2014, 06:11 PM
#87
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12 March 2014, 06:11 PM
#88
In the case of the underground drivers I would of commissioned a study into the viability of replacing drivers with computers (which had been done in lots of major subway systems), and pushed it across the desk next time he came looking for more,> Now that really would of 'shot his fox'.
12 March 2014, 06:20 PM
#89