Notices
Non Scooby Related Anything Non-Scooby related

Scottish Independence

Old Sep 8, 2014 | 11:28 PM
  #991  
Carnut's Avatar
Carnut
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,626
Likes: 0
From: I'll check my gps
Default

Originally Posted by nizmo80
no ! westminster know they are stronger with us together

and scotland is waking up to the fact that we are better off apart
Westminster and half of Scotland which is a lot more than the yes vote.

Have you not stopped to ask yourself if the majority are right?
Reply
Old Sep 8, 2014 | 11:30 PM
  #992  
nizmo80's Avatar
nizmo80
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (2)
 
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,719
Likes: 0
From: the rev limiter
Default

Originally Posted by chris j t
Westminster and half of Scotland which is a lot more than the yes vote.

Have you not stopped to ask yourself if the majority are right?
westminster and england dont have a vote so its not the majority really is it
Reply
Old Sep 8, 2014 | 11:33 PM
  #993  
jonc's Avatar
jonc
Thread Starter
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,647
Likes: 22
Default

Originally Posted by nizmo80
more scare mongering just goes to show how desperate westminster and the no campaign have become
say what you will about me being blind to the truth but I know westminster will do anything to try scare the scottish to stay in the union
and they influence majority of the newspapers

their scare mongering tactics and lies have pushed the voters into the yes campaigns favor already just clutching straws now LOL
It's not scaremongering when the reality is billions being wiped off scores of Scottish companies today is it! The views expressed in the the article are not of Westminsters, but that of financial analysts and economists from various financial institutions in the market. The views of the UK market and from institutional investors globally to the Yes vote has been realised today and this was based on just opinion polls. You are of course entitled to view what was reported in the media was engineered by Westminster, but the reality of what happened today on the market is a prospect that Scottish businesses can expect to face more of on a Yes vote.


Originally Posted by nizmo80
LOL the no campaign and westminster will try anything to scare a no vote out of us LOL

pretty funny when they get caught out again lying

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...itics-29087393
Right, what did you expect Tesco to say, that it's prices will rise after independence before it has actually happened. For company where pricing is crucial in maintaining its customers, that'll be great move for Tesco's business and drive it's customers to its competitors!

Won't there be transaction costs to consider that'll be passed on to its customers? This is what Alex Salmond keeps banging on about on the likely outcome where there is no currency union.
Reply
Old Sep 8, 2014 | 11:35 PM
  #994  
Carnut's Avatar
Carnut
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,626
Likes: 0
From: I'll check my gps
Default

Originally Posted by nizmo80
westminster and england dont have a vote so its not the majority really is it
Yes but the opinion of the majority should count for something. Its not as big of a gamble for the rest of the uk hence only Scotland has a vote.
Reply
Old Sep 8, 2014 | 11:44 PM
  #995  
Carnut's Avatar
Carnut
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,626
Likes: 0
From: I'll check my gps
Default

Nizmo80 are you not concerned that westminster may be keeping some of its powder dry? after all they are the ones who have given Scotland the opportunity and they could have a back up plan if the yes vote is successful.

Scotland may well be better off with the yes vote but like wise it could go **** up. I am not sure I would want to take the chance myself but all power to you.
Reply
Old Sep 8, 2014 | 11:57 PM
  #996  
ScoobyWon't's Avatar
ScoobyWon't
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 16,694
Likes: 0
From: Pot Belly HQ
Default

Originally Posted by nizmo80
Not only the scottish dont really like you the welsh and irish think england are arrogant pr1cks too with pretty much alot of other countrys as well

And as for being liked from other countrys
its just because mostly we go over with better attitudes and are a lot more friendly
unlike jumped up arrogant b@stards like the english.
A lot of non-English speaking nations assume that all visiting drunks trashing the local beaches are English, just because they speak English. In my experience, these people can't tell the difference between an Englishmen, a taff or a sweaty sock.

I must admit, it was always amusing watching the jocks get upset when the Spanish/Canarians asked them whereabouts in England they were from
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 06:35 AM
  #997  
lozgti1's Avatar
lozgti1
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 3,916
Likes: 71
Default

What is wrong with the Scottish people?! Not going to wade back through 995 posts but is it the biggest chip ever in the history of chips on shoulders??!

And no,Mel Gibson wasnt really scottish.Sure thats been raised

Oh,and Gascoigne,s goal against Scotland best ever
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 06:50 AM
  #998  
JGlanzaV's Avatar
JGlanzaV
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (3)
 
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 5,021
Likes: 1
Default

Originally Posted by chris j t
Lets just stick with the debt for a minute, you are actually saying that England is a failure? The debt is due to a global problem and something you are going to have to learn yourself if the yes vote is successful is its not just about managing your own affairs but managing them in a world market. The uk has been able to stand much stronger than a lot of the world and Europe and this debt is nothing more than a business loan, something many successful business have.

Do you really have that attitude towards the English? The English as ive said have been more than welcoming to the Scottish over recent years and speak highly of Scotland but it would appear that you dont deserve any of it.

Ask yourself self this, why does the EU so desperately want the uk/England? I just wounder if they will be banging on the door of Scotland with such enthusiasm is the yes vote is successful.

It would be real shame if the yes vote is swung due to emotions as we could be stronger together but I suspect that this could be the case.

Theeu won't be banging on their door at all they won't be allowed to join for 5-10yrs!

So with no currency, no trade partnerships, no bank, no security forces, no passports, no driving lisences, and no employment once the mod leave and most importantly, no money!!!!!

This is gonna go really well for you guys, everything you have is because of England, wait until you have to stop piggybacking all of our services (passports etc) and find the money to set all this up for yourself.

How can anyone have a credible argument for independence when they can't even tell you what you will be paid in, the UK have already said you won't be using our currency yet I don't see any other suggestions or predictions of what will be used instead. Salmond is a one trick pony who couldn't answer a question straight if his life depended on it. He still talks about a currency union that we have already ruled out.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 08:39 AM
  #999  
mrtheedge2u2's Avatar
mrtheedge2u2
Scooby Regular
20 Year Member
Liked
 
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,194
Likes: 31
Default

I hope Scotland does get independence.....even if just to get them to stfu about it. I never cared when I was young and I do not care now.

Maybe I am being naive but I never saw the benefit of Scotland being part of the UK other than 'space for if we need it' and I am sure Scotland never saw the benefit of being part of the UK either.

I hope Scotland get independence and I hope they make a success of it. It will be difficult as you will not qualify for EU membership or to use the Euro for many years. If you do, salut to you. But if you "yes" people get to go it alone and it is a disaster then I hope you dont whine about how it is all Englands fault.

I do not trust politicians from Scotland nor England. I put my trust in the opinions of economists and financial experts who probably actually know the real economic implications and all seem unanimous in their verdict.

Last edited by mrtheedge2u2; Sep 9, 2014 at 08:53 AM.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 08:56 AM
  #1000  
jonc's Avatar
jonc
Thread Starter
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,647
Likes: 22
Default

Originally Posted by JGlanzaV
Theeu won't be banging on their door at all they won't be allowed to join for 5-10yrs!

So with no currency, no trade partnerships, no bank, no security forces, no passports, no driving lisences, and no employment once the mod leave and most importantly, no money!!!!!

This is gonna go really well for you guys, everything you have is because of England, wait until you have to stop piggybacking all of our services (passports etc) and find the money to set all this up for yourself.

How can anyone have a credible argument for independence when they can't even tell you what you will be paid in, the UK have already said you won't be using our currency yet I don't see any other suggestions or predictions of what will be used instead. Salmond is a one trick pony who couldn't answer a question straight if his life depended on it. He still talks about a currency union that we have already ruled out.
It's never been about a credible arguement for independence. Alex Salmond has promised that there will be a currency union, that bank deposits will be safe and mortgages will be unaffected just as it is now for the UK. But the reality of this is lost in the all the bluster, and the truth is that Alex Salmond is in no position to make such promises and that sums up a lot of his his campaign and policies. It is a case of who shouts the loudests and since Alex Salmond has bought up all the bill boards sites I think the only thing you'll see from now until the day of the referendum is a country plasted with Yes posters.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 10:07 AM
  #1001  
hodgy0_2's Avatar
hodgy0_2
Scooby Regular
15 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 15,634
Likes: 22
From: K
Default

the No campaign are now offering Enhanced Devolution - and it is being championed by Gordon Brown, Ironic that Cameron suddenly needs Gordon Brown to dig him out of a whole

It just shows how much the No vote are running scared

But interestingly I heard on the news yesterday that Alex Salmond did offer to have a third choice on the ballot box - funnily enough called Enhanced Devolution but the arrogance and hubris of Westminster said no - it needs to be a simply binary in / out choice (presumably because the thought they would walk the No vote)

I think it is the above shiftyness and arrogance of Westminster that some Scots find so appalling
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 10:12 AM
  #1002  
ScoobyWon't's Avatar
ScoobyWon't
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 16,694
Likes: 0
From: Pot Belly HQ
Default

Originally Posted by jonc
It's never been about a credible arguement for independence. Alex Salmond has promised that there will be a currency union, that bank deposits will be safe and mortgages will be unaffected just as it is now for the UK. But the reality of this is lost in the all the bluster, and the truth is that Alex Salmond is in no position to make such promises and that sums up a lot of his his campaign and policies. It is a case of who shouts the loudests and since Alex Salmond has bought up all the bill boards sites I think the only thing you'll see from now until the day of the referendum is a country plasted with Yes posters.
Salmond needs, and wants, a currency union, but as everyone knows, he might not get it.

iScotchland has four options as far as most of the finance experts suggest:

In view of all that’s happened in Europe, it is extraordinary that Scots could think monetary union with Westminster perfectly compatible with full scale independence. This is none the less the platform sold to them by the Yes campaign. All the evidence suggests that a shared currency without shared government doesn’t work. Monetary union requires a high degree of both fiscal and banking integration. Mr Salmond proposes the very reverse.

The reasons for this have been exhaustively explained elsewhere already, but bear brief repetition. Countries with their own currency shouldn’t logically ever run into fiscal difficulty. In a downturn, when spending rises and tax revenue falls, they can always print money to cover the shortfall. The printing press also gives them the wherewithal to bail out insolvent banks, and thereby prevent wider economic collapse. With a shared currency, these privileges are denied, if only because more solvent nations tend to refuse liability for insolvent ones.

Any monetary union with the rest of the UK is therefore certain to involve a high degree of continued fiscal and financial oversight by Westminster. Without such controls, monetary union would be unacceptable to the rest of the UK. But with such controls, it would be equally unacceptable to Mr Salmond. Independence would count for little if Westminster continued to dominate Scottish affairs. The Scots can have monetary union if they like, but they cannot also have Mr Salmond’s promise of welfare-max, otherwise known as socialism.

Three other alternatives exist – the hard peg of sterlingisation, the slightly softer peg of a currency board, or a completely free floating independent currency.

The last of these possibilities has been all but ruled out – and for fairly obvious reasons. Scotland has a lot of debt, both public and private. As home to the UK’s two largest banks, total debt is off the scale relative to GDP once financial liabilities are also taken into account. It would be impossible for the new currency to stand behind such mountainous foreign currency obligations. And if sterling debt was redenominated in the local currency, it would be tantamount to default, creating a massive financial and economic crisis.

Debt is what renders parallels with the “velvet separation” achieved by the Czech Republic and Slovakia back in the early Noughties largely invalid. The two new countries started out with a common currency – the Czech koruna – but concern about the potential liability to the Czech Republic caused the currency union to be dissolved a few years later. This was achieved with little mishap because the debts involved were still relatively insignificant.

With Scotland, it would be a different ball game, which is why we can expect both Royal Bank of Scotland and Lloyds Banking Group to announce they are re-domiciling south of the border within hours of a Yes vote. Even if they thought it worth the risk of staying, the Bank of England would not. To forestall a run on the two banks, they would have to remain safely under the Bank of England’s wing.

This leaves sterlingisation or currency board arrangements similar to those operated by Hong Kong. The latter option, which demands foreign exchange reserves of at least the same size of the monetary base to work convincingly, would appear a non starter, at least in the short term. Where is Scotland going to get reserves of this order of magnitude from?

So sterlingisation it is – a perfectly acceptable solution, and actually a very good one if you believe in low taxes, a small state, and much smaller, low risk banking system. This, unfortunately, is not how independence is being sold. Denied the flexibility to borrow and print at will, Scotland would have to fund its spending through higher taxes, which would in time render the country uncompetitive and therefore unable to sustain its welfare promise.
All the talk of Scotland not taking it's share of the UK debt with it is unworkable. If Scotland does not take it's share, it will be seen as the financial markets as defaulting and will see lenders being less willing to lend Scotland money. If lenders do lend money to a defaulted Scotland, it will be at much higher rates.

City analysts from Goldman Sachs and Berenberg, a German-based multinational bank, published reports concluding a Yes vote would force Scotland into deeper austerity, requiring a “significant reduction in the provision of public services” to gets its finances in order.

In a separate analysis, Iain McLean, professor of politics, predicted every Scot would be £480 worse off under independence now thanks to sharply declining oil revenues.
All three agreed that a separate Scotland would pay a higher interest rate on its borrowing, an additional cost that would be passed onto borrowers and mortgage holders.
Still, let the Scots decide if they want independance. I wish they could see that true independance would mean cutting all ties to rUK, including sterling and the BoE, and that joining the EU and the Euro is handing over powers to Brussels, rather than taking it back from Westminster, which is hardly independance.

All hail King Alex the first
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 10:38 AM
  #1003  
alcazar's Avatar
alcazar
Scooby Regular
20 Year Member
Liked
Loved
Community Favorite
iTrader: (2)
 
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 40,788
Likes: 30
From: Rl'yeh
Default

TBH, I don't blame ANYONE wanting not to be ruled by Westminster.
They don't REALLY give a sour toss about anyone but London, the home counties and the SE...except at election time.

I'd like to see Humberside and Yorkshire devolve next.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 11:01 AM
  #1004  
Geezer's Avatar
Geezer
Scooby Senior
 
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 5,826
Likes: 0
From: North Wales
Cool

Originally Posted by nizmo80
westminster and england dont have a vote so its not the majority really is it
He said Westminster and half of Scotland, so if you discount Westmister (and rightly so), then you still have at least half of the population who don't want it.

I work with loads of Scottish people, and I reckon the Yes vote amongst them is about 10% at best. It seems to be the younger, more inexperienced ones who want it. Anyone who has even slight appreciation of the chaos that could ensue are firm no voters.

Looking at your use of language and basic economic understanding, I'd say you are both
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 11:03 AM
  #1005  
Fat Boy's Avatar
Fat Boy
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 4,262
Likes: 1
Default

Good post Scoobywont.

Gordon Brown isn't helping out Cameron, he's desperately trying to keep the labour voting base that is the vast majority in Scotland. Cameron doesn't exactly have a big group of voters to try and please in Scotland, but the Labour Party will not be back in power in Westminster for decades if their Scottish voting base is removed

I seriously don't think Salmond wants it deep down either - he's like a little bloke at a fight saying "let me go, I'll batter them" until he's let go and then he realises it's all a terrible mistake. He's probably hoping the split doesn't go through but he's playing to the crowd by saying "let us go, let us go". He doesn't have a clue on how it's all going to work but then that shouldn't be a surprise to a lot of potential voters - see below joke that was sent to me by a Scottish friend.

Alex Salmond walks into a RBS branch to cash a cheque. As he approaches the cashier he says, "Good morning, Ma'am, could you please cash this cheque for me?"

Cashier:"It would be my pleasure sir. Could you please show me your ID?"

Salmond :"Truthfully, I did not bring my ID with me as I didn't think there was any need to. I am Alex Salmond, the leader of the Scottish National Party and First Minister of Scotland !!!!"

Cashier:"Yes sir, I know who you are, but with all the regulations and monitoring of the banks because of impostors and forgers and requirements of the legislation, etc., I must insist on seeing ID."

Salmond : Just ask anyone here at the bank who I am and they will tell you. Everybody knows who I am."

Cashier: "I am sorry, Mr. Salmond , but these are the bank rules and I must follow them."

Salmond :"C'mon lassie . I am urging you, please, to cash this cheque."

Cashier: "Look Mr. Salmond, here is an example of what we can do. One day, Tiger Woods came into the bank without ID. To prove he was Tiger Woods he pulled out his putter and made a beautiful shot across the bank into a cup. With that shot we knew him to be Tiger Woods and cashed his cheque. Another time, Andre Agassi came in without ID. He pulled out his tennis racket and made a fabulous shot where the tennis ball landed in my cup. With that shot we cashed his cheque.

So, Mr. Salmond , what can you do to prove that it is you, and only you?

Salmond stands there thinking, and thinking, and finally says, "Honestly, my mind is a total blank...there is nothing that comes to my mind.............. I can't think of a single thing. I have absolutely no idea what to do and I don't have a clue."

Cashier: "Will that be large or small notes , Mr. Salmond ?


Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 11:38 AM
  #1006  
ditchmyster's Avatar
ditchmyster
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (7)
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 13,624
Likes: 7
From: Living the dream
Default

You still banging on about this.

I think your the perfect example of the vocal minority and your going to lose the vote because of the way it's being force fed by the yes brigade.

I predict a win for the NO side with a big turnout of around 90% of which the yes voters will get about 30% odd and the no will be in the 60%+ region.

10 days to go and we will know jismo.

Have a nice day.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 12:01 PM
  #1007  
Devildog's Avatar
Devildog
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 4,430
Likes: 1
From: Away from this place
Default

Originally Posted by jonc
What, despite the fact that the 3 main parties have said no to a currency union, that it's still most likely true that there will be a currency union. Why then if it is likely to be true are the markets spooked?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/e...-the-lead.html

And why are they so spooked?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...austerity.html
We've been through this too may times to be still discussing it Jon. Of course they will say that. And that's one of the reasons why the markets are spooked. Confirm a currency union on independence and we may well see some confidence return. Another example of better together and westminster shooting itself in the foot perhaps?


From your first link

"Uncertainty causes speculators to feel jittery and that translates into sterling weakness.”

No one is more guilty of driving that uncertainty than the negativity of the "no" campaign.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 12:03 PM
  #1008  
jonc's Avatar
jonc
Thread Starter
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,647
Likes: 22
Default

Originally Posted by hodgy0_2
the No campaign are now offering Enhanced Devolution - and it is being championed by Gordon Brown, Ironic that Cameron suddenly needs Gordon Brown to dig him out of a whole

It just shows how much the No vote are running scared

But interestingly I heard on the news yesterday that Alex Salmond did offer to have a third choice on the ballot box - funnily enough called Enhanced Devolution but the arrogance and hubris of Westminster said no - it needs to be a simply binary in / out choice (presumably because the thought they would walk the No vote)

I think it is the above shiftyness and arrogance of Westminster that some Scots find so appalling
The same can be said of Alex Salmond and the SNP. I don't expect that to change after independence. Politicians will always be politicians whatever side of the boarder. The Scottish Government have always blamed Westminster for all of Scotland's ills and Westminster has always been their get out of jail card. Well all that could change as Alex Salmond and SNP will fail to deliver what they promised post independence. But I'm sure he'll be able to worm his way out of it and with a nice fat severance package, he is afterall a politcian.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 12:13 PM
  #1009  
Devildog's Avatar
Devildog
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 4,430
Likes: 1
From: Away from this place
Default

Originally Posted by Fat Boy

but the Labour Party will not be back in power in Westminster for decades if their Scottish voting base is removed


Its been evidenced that is most likely incorrect. There are only 59 Scottish seats against a total of 650. Taking out the Scottish seats would leave 591 in the rest of the uk.

Will the conservatives win 296 seats in the next general election?

"Yes, Cameron would have had an outright majority at the last election but anlysis shows that most general election results would have been the same, albeit with changed majorities. In recent times, Margaret Thatcher's Conservatives would have enjoyed a massive 174-seat majority in 1983, bigger even than the 144-seat majority they achieved. In 1992, Tory John Major would have had a 71-seat majority, as opposed to the 21-seat majority which occurred. And, without Scotland, Tony Blair's Labour majority would have been cut from 179 to 137 seats in 1997, from 167 to 127 seats in 2001, and from 66 to 43 seats in 2005"
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 12:47 PM
  #1010  
jonc's Avatar
jonc
Thread Starter
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,647
Likes: 22
Default

Originally Posted by Devildog
We've been through this too may times to be still discussing it Jon. Of course they will say that. And that's one of the reasons why the markets are spooked. Confirm a currency union on independence and we may well see some confidence return. Another example of better together and westminster shooting itself in the foot perhaps?


From your first link

"Uncertainty causes speculators to feel jittery and that translates into sterling weakness.”

No one is more guilty of driving that uncertainty than the negativity of the "no" campaign.
And did you read the second article? Even if there was a deal for a currency union the market analysts and economists don't see that situation as any better either, ie the underwritting of a completely separate country for the rUK economy. Yes the currency one of the issues and it is one that is caused by Alex Salmond who called for independence, not the Westminster. All the three main parties and the Bank of England have already confirmed No to a currency union, but Alex Salmond still insists he well get it and has no provision or provide details of an althernative plan in the likelyhood that he will not get it.

The uncertainty of Plan A and the lack of Plan B hit Scottish businesses yesterday because the financial markets have no idea what currency these businesses will be trading with. The only ones who are making provisions are the Scottish businesses that can afford to do so and relocate to rUK. But the overbearing uncertainty surrounding independence is the actual break up of the union and what will happen after independence, not just in terms of what currency iScotland will use, but the break up of assets, provisions of services, taxation, investment, revenue etc etc in both private and public sector with Plan B or not.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 12:57 PM
  #1011  
neil-h's Avatar
neil-h
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 4,224
Likes: 0
From: Berks
Default

Have to say the No campaign is starting to get really undignified. All this "oooooh we'll give you more powers if you stay" strikes me as pandering to the Scottish and I'm sure most people will see it for what it is. Now we've also got Cameron/Miliband/Clegg jetting off up north to go and grovel as well.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 01:01 PM
  #1012  
f1_fan's Avatar
f1_fan
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (9)
 
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 20,035
Likes: 0
From: .
Default

Originally Posted by neil-h
Have to say the No campaign is starting to get really undignified. All this "oooooh we'll give you more powers if you stay" strikes me as pandering to the Scottish and I'm sure most people will see it for what it is. Now we've also got Cameron/Miliband/Clegg jetting off up north to go and grovel as well.
Great isn't it? Cameron will forever be know as the PM that didn't take Scotland seriously until it was to late .. hopefully His political CV is looking oh so wonderful
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 01:04 PM
  #1013  
jonc's Avatar
jonc
Thread Starter
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 7,647
Likes: 22
Default

Originally Posted by neil-h
Have to say the No campaign is starting to get really undignified. All this "oooooh we'll give you more powers if you stay" strikes me as pandering to the Scottish and I'm sure most people will see it for what it is. Now we've also got Cameron/Miliband/Clegg jetting off up north to go and grovel as well.
Agreed, all it will do is undermine the credibility of the No campaign. It is too little too late and smacks of desparation. The policies they are now pushing are just as bad as as SNP's Plan A in terms of what these policies are and how they will be provisioned.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 01:13 PM
  #1014  
neil-h's Avatar
neil-h
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 4,224
Likes: 0
From: Berks
Default

Originally Posted by f1_fan
Great isn't it? Cameron will forever be know as the PM that didn't take Scotland seriously until it was to late .. hopefully His political CV is looking oh so wonderful
It does have that feel doesn't it, like they all woke up this morning and thought '**** we better do something about that'. Especially seeing they've now dug out Gordon Brown from where ever on earth he was hiding.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 01:17 PM
  #1015  
Carnut's Avatar
Carnut
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,626
Likes: 0
From: I'll check my gps
Default

Desperation desperate to what, keep Scotland so we can be stronger together, whats wrong with that?
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 01:19 PM
  #1016  
neil-h's Avatar
neil-h
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 4,224
Likes: 0
From: Berks
Default

Originally Posted by chris j t
Desperation desperate to what, keep Scotland so we can be stronger together, whats wrong with that?
Yeah but there are ways and means of doing things. Batting away the yes campaign as a passing inconvenience then running off to Scotland begging them to stay a week before the vote isn't one of them.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 01:22 PM
  #1017  
Fat Boy's Avatar
Fat Boy
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 4,262
Likes: 1
Default

Originally Posted by Devildog
Its been evidenced that is most likely incorrect. There are only 59 Scottish seats against a total of 650. Taking out the Scottish seats would leave 591 in the rest of the uk.

Will the conservatives win 296 seats in the next general election?

"Yes, Cameron would have had an outright majority at the last election but anlysis shows that most general election results would have been the same, albeit with changed majorities. In recent times, Margaret Thatcher's Conservatives would have enjoyed a massive 174-seat majority in 1983, bigger even than the 144-seat majority they achieved. In 1992, Tory John Major would have had a 71-seat majority, as opposed to the 21-seat majority which occurred. And, without Scotland, Tony Blair's Labour majority would have been cut from 179 to 137 seats in 1997, from 167 to 127 seats in 2001, and from 66 to 43 seats in 2005"
Either way can Labour be relaxed about an impact of losing say 20-40 certain labour MPs? Probably not as it will hardly improve their chances.

I'm no Tory ( or politicians in general ) supporter, but Labour is not presenting a credible challenge to even this lot in power at the moment. As for Clegg's support base....
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 01:23 PM
  #1018  
Carnut's Avatar
Carnut
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 2,626
Likes: 0
From: I'll check my gps
Default

Originally Posted by neil-h
Yeah but there are ways and means of doing things. Batting away the yes campaign as a passing inconvenience then running off to Scotland begging them to stay a week before the vote isn't one of them.
It looks desperate on both sides to me.
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 01:25 PM
  #1019  
f1_fan's Avatar
f1_fan
Scooby Regular
iTrader: (9)
 
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 20,035
Likes: 0
From: .
Default

Originally Posted by neil-h
It does have that feel doesn't it, like they all woke up this morning and thought '**** we better do something about that'. Especially seeing they've now dug out Gordon Brown from where ever on earth he was hiding.
If ever proof of their desperation were needed there it is right there
Reply
Old Sep 9, 2014 | 01:29 PM
  #1020  
neil-h's Avatar
neil-h
Scooby Regular
 
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 4,224
Likes: 0
From: Berks
Default

Originally Posted by f1_fan
If ever proof of their desperation were needed there it is right there
That's what I thought, you know things are getting bad when Gordon Brown is your secret weapon.
Reply

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

All times are GMT +1. The time now is 12:05 AM.