Not me.

Such is life though. Everyone has preferences on everything. Opinions and arseholes springs to mind.

 

I know the feeling!

 

You were in the preferred position of having an unmappable ECU! Now you have to make your choice!

 

Is this true? I have an ecutek map on my MY00 by Zen which I want tweeked but wont use them. I was told i'm faced with needing a full price mapping session @ £300 + vat to tweek the map (de-cats and 3 port added) if I use another mapper, but would obviously like to reduce my costs on this.

If you could give me any further info feel free to pm me.

 

Romraider & Ecuflash do not hack, or publish Ecutek maps & software. They have spent a lot of time & money reverse engineering the factory ECU

ps somebody in 2006 did hack Ecutek table definitions, called it XMLwrite & from there developed Ecuedit (based in Russia) which uses these hacked def tables & other hacks from Cobb and even Romraider.

All this Im sure you already know but I thought I would just clarify for other forum members.

 

Easy choice for me.......

You'd need a full map, but, no licence fee to pay, to the best of my knowledge.

 

Not according to andy F. Reading his post he claims that "other" mappers can read the original map, and therefore tweek it rather than having to write a full map. Would be interesting to see a trading standards point of view on this as surely, if you pay for a map then legally it belongs to you and you should have rights to it??

I was under the impression that this isnt possible, that the mapper locks out the map, puts a large clamp around your bo11ox and you're basically stuck with that mapper unless you go somewhere else.

I know that once you have a license then you only pay for mapping time, thats a one off thing that is done when its first done and remains on the ecu.

 

Intellectual property mate is my take on it. Send Andy a PM or email though, he will know better than me obviously.

 

I have PM'd you but feel free to post it up if you like.

 

lol, re read what i wrote, i did not say you were tied to one mapper i said you are tied to ecutec. and if you fall out with your mapper like some have, then you have to start again, But Only Ecutec, which your post confirms

 

Above is where you are wrong, there is software other than Ecutek that can access Ecutek maps on 01-07 cars.
Regarding your point of having to pay for a full new map if you move to another mapper, I should hope so! I wouldn't want to be just tweeking another mappers work. Unless specifically instructed, I'd start from one of my own base maps and then I know its done right I guess that approach comes from many years of Ecutek mapping where you can't steal another tuners work, you can just overwrite it with your own.

 

Just want to say thanks to Andy for clearing up the whole "ecutek vs OS" thing for me on my MY00. As he says above, any change of mapper "should" want to write their own so they know the foundations are there, and this is mainly what increases the time/cost.

Hoping to see what offers/availability people have for doing an ecutek map without pulling my pants down as I've paid £550 once for a map then been let down by customer service and got into arguments via phone etc so now I'm faced with another £300+ bill just for adding a de-cat and 3 port.

 

Hi Kev,

A remap to tie all the mods together and get things running smoothly will certainly be a benefit for the car and you should notice a fair difference. It may be worth giving one of the well known tuners a bell to find out if they recommend any other low cost mods to do before or at the time of the remap to give you any better power increases whilst you are at it.

With regards to mappers, this is a mine field and every one will have an opinion from their own experiences. Personally I would recommend talking to a number of different mappers and making your own decision on which is the best to go with for your requirements.

Cheers

Martin


Hi BrownPantsRacing,
Just wanted to ensure everyone understands the facts with regards to my car.

My car had no additional modifications following my remap.

No pipes mentioned in that thread were disconnected when the car was recovered to the subaru main dealer, where it was thoroughly inspected by them before being recovered to an alternative subaru specialists to do my repairs.

Car was mapped on V-power and was run on V-power. I was advised to use octane booster by my mapper for track events and did as I was advised to do so.

Thanks

Martin

 

Right well, I've been asked by the guys at Silverstone Autosport and the customer mentioned below to respond to this, so I am going to have to, but I didn't really want to get into any technical discussions versus the cars I had done.

Be very careful here Duncan, all cars run on the dyno day that I subsequently got asked to remap were also prior run on the day I did the maps. All showed the same problems and I run the fan much closer to the car. In addition to this the fine learning on most of the cars run showed a good majority of det had been seen on the road.

Greg's was running lean due to the induction kit and the maf having not been rescaled to suite. The learning had removed 10% of fuel and applied it since you had mapped it, I reset the ecu to run it again and it showed a safe lambda, the exhaust did not cause this.

I here what you are saying about Scotty's, which is fine, parts were changed as were a couple of others. All the cars I mapped were then dropped off the dyno and run on the road, no changes needed to be made.

That's all I want to say on the matter and hopefully we can leave it at that.

Ok so there was a little ***** waving, but I think it educated a lot on the limit of the Denso Pink label sensor! There's another post on there that has popped up about over-boosting on a Simtek that was mapped to 1.6bar on a 1.55 bar map sensor. For those that don't understand the ins and outs of this technical statement, it basically means there is no boost control. Mappers harp on about not de-catting because you will overboost, but at least in that circumstance you will usually have a over-boost safety cut. If a car has been mapped to boost beyond the map sensor limit then you have no control over the turbo whatsoever and no safety boost cut either.

This information is important regardless of how it is presented to you, sorry! It means you as a customer now know what the maximum boost you can safely run with that sensor is.

Graham

 

Hi Martin, I was talking to Howard the other day. Hope you get the car sorted soon mate.

 

Graham, I read the thread on 22b ages ago. Just wanted to thank those who contributed as I changed my map sensor via Simon based on what you guys said

 

Hi Steve,
Thanks mate, hopefully it wont take too long to get back on the road, missing 4wd in the greasy weather

 

FWIW I had my car mapped by Duncan nearly 18months ago now, and still find him very easy to contact regarding any queries I may have, contact usually being made back to me very quickly.

My car has since seen 2 full dyno sessions at completely different dyno venues, monitoring AFR etc, a few sprint days, a track day, and quite a lot of quarter mile drags, where I imagine things must get quite hot! At no dyno was I given any bad feedback about the map, only comments of good power and running being made, and the car felt great at the track events.

When I make further tweaks, I will go back to Duncan, it's that simple.

I have no personal experience of JGM's or Andy F's mapping, but my Dad does have a TD04 Hybrid from Andy F on his bugeye, and previously had a TD05 16G on his last bugeye from Andy F too. Both of which performed great and it was a pleasure dealing with Andy. It is mapped by Bob Rawle, as was his previous car too, someone who he trusts and would return to given extra mods.

Unsurprisingly, having been around the Subaru "scene" for years, I had read bad stories about all the mappers mentioned above, and many more I've not mentioned. It does not mean that given the right circumstances that I wouldn't use them though, they are only human afterall.

 

well all i now is thast my car use to det and run lean as well from y old mapper andy vey from vey sports and all the car he did were like that , my engine broke and was sorted out for fre by triton motorsports who did really ahve to seen as it was 2 years old but that what sort oif guys they are all i paid for was a a crnak and bearings they paid for the rest, then duncan graham came along and sorted out all of our cars and since then we have not had any det lights poping up and have all been very happy and i mean thats a lot of cars he sorted out half of dorset scoobys to be fair and were all very happy , i am a bit upset with all this mud slinging from the above mappers as jgm andy f , i have always held with high regard from word of mouth of many and as for this graham chap you seem to want to get your 2 pences worth, but this thread is way out of control , and as for this chap with the blown engine yeah it is bad luck but then if your traking you car hard a lot and messing with settings its going to cause damage , but then you never now it could ahve been a **** engine build maybe a friday build

 

this is a quote from engine mappers home page it seems to fit

Why is it that I sign a disclaimer against my car having a failure whilst being mapped?
Whilst we take every care of the vehicle that we are working on, we cannot accept any risk or liability for an engine or component that hasn’t been made/fitted/built through Engine Mapper. Please understand that mapping is an entirely normal and safe procedure, but will push the engine nearer it’s limits in some way or another which could cause a weak component to fail.

 

Yep, i don't know duncan or any of the others for that matter, but as soon as something goes wrong with a car he has mapped all the ecutec boys seem to jump all over him, and this has happened several times and to an outsider it does smack a bit of the old boy network, and in my eyes they do themselves no favours.

If they were really so concerned about all of us then they would do something constructive to help all concerned, including duncan and considering we the community are a large part of their lively hood they may wish to reconsider some of their conduct within it.

Now thats not aimed at anyone in particular, but life aint all about money!!!

 

I'm not trying to stir further but where has Simon (JGM) mud slung in this thread? He stated it would be unproffesional of him to say anything on the matter and then performed a little sales pitch. That's a fair response if you ask me. Andy has said a few things, of which i neither condemn or condone. He stated he's had to put it on a public forum rather than a PM, as it so far has had no effect. If thats what it takes to get things heading in the right direction then, imo, it's somewhat justified. Furthermore, Graham was advised to put up a response. Saying he seems to want to get his 2 pence worth isn't an accurate statement in my eyes. Graham had stated his events of the mapping day and it's perfectly acceptable to hear the other side of the story... Do you only read one half of a newspaper?

As for Ecutek vs open source, the arguement will always remain on which is better. To say the 'Ecutek' boys are mud slinging due to this feud is pathetic. Looks to me like they're unhappy with someone in thier line of business giving them somewhat of a bad name. Would you accept a colleague at work doing the same to your company/trade? I'm not so sure.

All of this aside, if people want to use any of the mappers, do so. It's your car, you're more than entitled to choose who you want to map your car. So let's stop with all the b*tching and leave that to the chavs on Jeremy Kyle shall we

 

I agree with you on that one, its not all about money. I do both Ecutek and Open Source mapping, guess what, there is more profit in OS! Despite this however I still recommend Ecutek.

 

if someone is really as bad at doing something as people say then you know it wont take long for them to lose customers .
from what i can make of this thread at some point most people make mistakes.. after all we all do it.. i admit i have used duncan many times now both on road and rr i trust him totally to do the right thing by me and my pride and joy.
had i of lived in areas near other mappers when i first started with my modding bug then maybe i would be saying the same about them..

let your work do the talking guys and the customers will decide!!!

 

This thread has brang back some bad memories. I still remember how i was given the car back straight off the dyno with no road tweaking and with the engine light on. 'Apparently' the engine light was cam sensor related. However it was working perfectly fine! The guy didnt give a flyn EF, when i asked him outside the dyno shop. Facial expressions say alot!

At first things are all hunky dorry, but when you have concerns etc you get ignored and get fed with lies. Makes me sick!

 

i guess no matter what your line of work is differant people will have differant views of your work.

i think the problem with modding cars is that people lose sight of what is best for there cars in search of more power or speed.

at the end of the day standard is probably safest.
sometimes you push things and they go pop.

thems the risks you take i guess

 

That is my car that you are referring to in regards to the thread i posted on 22b about my car overboosting,i only brought the car a couple of weeks ago and it is now apparent the car was mapped to 1.6 bar on the oe 1.55 bar map sensor which i find very strange to say the least! and i would like to point out that it was Duncan that pointed this out to me and told me it needed replacing with a 3 bar map sensor.

 

If someone is really as bad at doing something as people say then you know it wont take long for them to lose customers .

I'm not so sure about that, not the way people on here rubbish other peoples opinions, advice and personal experiences!!!! And go **** long into whatever they wish no matter what
advice they are given after asking for it!!!

 

A lot of folk will ask for advice, having already made their minds up that they are going to do whatever before asking.

Some people are as thick as bricks.

 

Another simple question thread got out of hand!!