ECU Remap - Open source or ECU Tec = Same results?
24 March 2011, 06:23 PM
#31
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why should we not hear about bad experiences......as i said ALL i EVER hear is how GREAt mappers are, and HOW SUPERB their services are....must be a lot of guys to proud to just say..."£500 is a joke amount of money for what is basically very little work"....but of course the gains are there for all to see.....
so i guess its all about what kinda coin you have at the time....for pure BHP gains and no requirement for anti lag or launch or whatever i would go open source, even if just becuase i dont think a mapper makes as much coin off of it, which is why EVERYONE is keen to down grade it.....guy that have spent on ECUTEK will tell you its a MUST, those who have'nt will say it is not necessary, the mappers (or SNET GODS) will tell you whatever free's your coin up...no offense to anyone its surely just pure business....
so i guess its all about what kinda coin you have at the time....for pure BHP gains and no requirement for anti lag or launch or whatever i would go open source, even if just becuase i dont think a mapper makes as much coin off of it, which is why EVERYONE is keen to down grade it.....guy that have spent on ECUTEK will tell you its a MUST, those who have'nt will say it is not necessary, the mappers (or SNET GODS) will tell you whatever free's your coin up...no offense to anyone its surely just pure business....
You will find a lot of loyalty amongst the vast majority of members with a preference for 'their' mapper, I am very happy with the free advice and backup I have received from Bob.
I ran a Group Buy with Bob last year and all told there were 30+ very happy customers, I didn't receive one complaint about poor service, poor maps or the perception of poor value for money.
Given the cost of the engine upgrade/rebuild I'm currently having done then I consider the price of the next map to be paltry compared to what a poorly written map will produce.
I don't care if Bob uses Ecutek, OS or an Abacus in order to get the final result as I am paying for his skill and expertise rather than which software package he prefers to use.
If money really is a problem when looking at a remap or tweak then you can always find cheaper alternatives to the mainstream if you are prepared to look. I myself know of one 'Subaru' specialist who will remap your car for you; it will have a generic or a 'close enough' map uploaded into your ECU and only cost around £200 I believe, but what will it cost in the long run...
Oh, and by the way learn how to use the English language properly, the correct use of grammar and punctuation make reading posts so much easier.
24 March 2011, 07:20 PM
#32
Scooby Regular
PMSL; my grammer or my ability to use it has nothing to do with the posts that you read on SNET, its more about time constraints for me; anyway:
You are very condescending or endevour to be. Which is partly why i felt the need to post quoting you previously. Patronising people about "bad mouthing businesses", then going on with dross.
You are living proof of my exact point. Bob Rawle, you had to name him. It is without doubt mapper snobbery. Its all your opportunity to tell everyone how awesome you are.
For the OP:
I hope you can see through the course of this thread how there are clearly those SNET users who have to physically hold themselves back from kidnapping their mappers. Running away with them and marrying them to live a life of "mapper awesomeness", telling each other how many times you posted each others names on SNET; happily ever after.
On the flip side there are real people, who say go for whats cheapest depending on your requirements. It IS ok to not be able to "name your mapper" in the tales of "mapper snobbery" that infest SNET, but clearly if you want them to love you, you should name them.....a lot.
But hey thats all my opinion and it will take a nation of millions to stop us....as they say.
You are very condescending or endevour to be. Which is partly why i felt the need to post quoting you previously. Patronising people about "bad mouthing businesses", then going on with dross.
You are living proof of my exact point. Bob Rawle, you had to name him. It is without doubt mapper snobbery. Its all your opportunity to tell everyone how awesome you are.
For the OP:
I hope you can see through the course of this thread how there are clearly those SNET users who have to physically hold themselves back from kidnapping their mappers. Running away with them and marrying them to live a life of "mapper awesomeness", telling each other how many times you posted each others names on SNET; happily ever after.
On the flip side there are real people, who say go for whats cheapest depending on your requirements. It IS ok to not be able to "name your mapper" in the tales of "mapper snobbery" that infest SNET, but clearly if you want them to love you, you should name them.....a lot.
But hey thats all my opinion and it will take a nation of millions to stop us....as they say.
, BUT WHICH IS BEST........FIGHT!!!
24 March 2011, 07:59 PM
#34
Scooby Regular
Are you a mapper?
....if so what is your name (so i can drop it in on my threads and possibly add a link on my signature, then i can think you are "my mapper" and you give me special treatment)......are you interested in marriage, and talk of "mapper awesomeness"??....pm me if so!
Last edited by SpecDscooby; 24 March 2011 at 08:00 PM.
24 March 2011, 08:32 PM
#36
Are you a mapper?....if so what is your name (so i can drop it in on my threads and possibly add a link on my signature, then i can think you are "my mapper" and you give me special treatment)......are you interested in marriage, and talk of "mapper awesomeness"??....
pm me if so!
....if so what is your name (so i can drop it in on my threads and possibly add a link on my signature, then i can think you are "my mapper" and you give me special treatment)......are you interested in marriage, and talk of "mapper awesomeness"??....pm me if so!
24 March 2011, 10:06 PM
#39
Engine Specialist
My opinion is customer focussed only. I have always wanted to give the best advice I can to questions asked of me whether or not that person is spending money with me. In terms of customer satisfaction, I can only see OS mapping being the best value for money solution. Ultimately though if your OS/EcuTek mapper cannot perform, then it matters not if you pay him pounds or penuts, your car will still explode!
I cannot justify the added value in charging a customer £550, rather than £225 and that added value that they might receive based on the majority of customers. There are a very few that would see the real benefits of features in Race rom from EcuTek, but otherwise the value of EcuTek is not good enough for me to want to choose that over OS as the ultimate bhp/torque graph will be the same.
The mapper is the ultimate difference as to whether you receive a good or bad map, customer service and overall support. You would receive all these from me, as the customer understanding, enjoyment and service is the ultimate way to run a business and that's how I run mine!
On the mapping snobbery note I hope I never fall into the category of tuners that think they are amazing at what they do and have nothing to learn. I have already received such snobbery from those about my price, but I will stand firm that my customers have and will always receive the ultimate customer experience and if they don't they will get their money back!!
Perhaps we should have a tuner OS/EcuTek map off?
Graham
I cannot justify the added value in charging a customer £550, rather than £225 and that added value that they might receive based on the majority of customers. There are a very few that would see the real benefits of features in Race rom from EcuTek, but otherwise the value of EcuTek is not good enough for me to want to choose that over OS as the ultimate bhp/torque graph will be the same.
The mapper is the ultimate difference as to whether you receive a good or bad map, customer service and overall support. You would receive all these from me, as the customer understanding, enjoyment and service is the ultimate way to run a business and that's how I run mine!
On the mapping snobbery note I hope I never fall into the category of tuners that think they are amazing at what they do and have nothing to learn. I have already received such snobbery from those about my price, but I will stand firm that my customers have and will always receive the ultimate customer experience and if they don't they will get their money back!!
Perhaps we should have a tuner OS/EcuTek map off?
Graham
24 March 2011, 10:22 PM
#40
SpecDscooby has a very good point regarding cult/mapper followings. I would understand if they did it for free ,but the way people go on about some mappers is just silly.
Enginemapper point sums it all up for me in this paragrapgh.
"I cannot justify the added value in charging a customer £550, rather than £225 and that added value that they might receive based on the majority of customers. There are a very few that would see the real benefits of features in Race rom from EcuTek, but otherwise the value of EcuTek is not good enough for me to want to choose that over OS as the ultimate bhp/torque graph will be the same."
Sure a good mapper would reccomend OS if they can produce the same results at a fraction of the price. I guess they have to recoup some of the £4k+ plus investment to justify useing Ecutek.
Enginemapper point sums it all up for me in this paragrapgh.
"I cannot justify the added value in charging a customer £550, rather than £225 and that added value that they might receive based on the majority of customers. There are a very few that would see the real benefits of features in Race rom from EcuTek, but otherwise the value of EcuTek is not good enough for me to want to choose that over OS as the ultimate bhp/torque graph will be the same."
Sure a good mapper would reccomend OS if they can produce the same results at a fraction of the price. I guess they have to recoup some of the £4k+ plus investment to justify useing Ecutek.
24 March 2011, 10:27 PM
#41
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PMSL; my grammer or my ability to use it has nothing to do with the posts that you read on SNET, its more about time constraints for me; anyway:
You are very condescending or endevour to be. Which is partly why i felt the need to post quoting you previously. Patronising people about "bad mouthing businesses", then going on with dross.
You are living proof of my exact point. Bob Rawle, you had to name him. It is without doubt mapper snobbery. Its all your opportunity to tell everyone how awesome you are.
You are very condescending or endevour to be. Which is partly why i felt the need to post quoting you previously. Patronising people about "bad mouthing businesses", then going on with dross.
You are living proof of my exact point. Bob Rawle, you had to name him. It is without doubt mapper snobbery. Its all your opportunity to tell everyone how awesome you are.
I have no such 'mapper snobbery' despite what you think; as I posted previously I don't care if Mr Rawle used OS or any other software to arrive at the final result. As I stated earlier the cost is relative, and once the licence is in place map tweaks or wholesale changes are very similar between all the established mappers.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with telling other members of a good service provided by any specialist; I can assure you that if I got poor service that I would warn other members of that as well.
The reason that I mentioned Bob's name was as he is the only mapper that I have used to date, I can speak from personal experience and professional service I have received.
If you haven't already done so that I would like you to do a search on the Group Buy that I organised and look for any complaints or problems that arose from that, I don't think that you will find any.
The Subaru 'specialist' (who is in the South Wales area) I made mention of was or is providing a very similar service to some 'mappers' in the West Midlands area I believe, and there were a lot of engine failures as a result (at least 7 I believe).
It is obvious that your viewpoint is entirely different from mine but please tell us of your own mapping experiences.
24 March 2011, 10:51 PM
#42
Scooby Regular
My opinion is customer focussed only. I have always wanted to give the best advice I can to questions asked of me whether or not that person is spending money with me. In terms of customer satisfaction, I can only see OS mapping being the best value for money solution. Ultimately though if your OS/EcuTek mapper cannot perform, then it matters not if you pay him pounds or penuts, your car will still explode!
I cannot justify the added value in charging a customer £550, rather than £225 and that added value that they might receive based on the majority of customers. There are a very few that would see the real benefits of features in Race rom from EcuTek, but otherwise the value of EcuTek is not good enough for me to want to choose that over OS as the ultimate bhp/torque graph will be the same.
The mapper is the ultimate difference as to whether you receive a good or bad map, customer service and overall support. You would receive all these from me, as the customer understanding, enjoyment and service is the ultimate way to run a business and that's how I run mine!
On the mapping snobbery note I hope I never fall into the category of tuners that think they are amazing at what they do and have nothing to learn. I have already received such snobbery from those about my price, but I will stand firm that my customers have and will always receive the ultimate customer experience and if they don't they will get their money back!!
Perhaps we should have a tuner OS/EcuTek map off?
Graham
I cannot justify the added value in charging a customer £550, rather than £225 and that added value that they might receive based on the majority of customers. There are a very few that would see the real benefits of features in Race rom from EcuTek, but otherwise the value of EcuTek is not good enough for me to want to choose that over OS as the ultimate bhp/torque graph will be the same.
The mapper is the ultimate difference as to whether you receive a good or bad map, customer service and overall support. You would receive all these from me, as the customer understanding, enjoyment and service is the ultimate way to run a business and that's how I run mine!
On the mapping snobbery note I hope I never fall into the category of tuners that think they are amazing at what they do and have nothing to learn. I have already received such snobbery from those about my price, but I will stand firm that my customers have and will always receive the ultimate customer experience and if they don't they will get their money back!!
Perhaps we should have a tuner OS/EcuTek map off?
Graham
Graham (if i may).....this is without doubt one of the most honest, straightforward posts i have ever read on scoobynet. Good for you. It is extreamly refreshing to me to hear a mapper of all people straight up saying there is in real terms little to no point spending the extra £££ on ECUtek etc for the average driver. As and when i want a map on this car, you have just won my interest and i would hope a great many others.
Cannon Fodder, oh Cannon Fodder....Graham has just sumed up my experience of mapping.....but it is very nice to hear it from the horses mouth....OS is in real terms for the average driver as good as a licenced map, just half the price....our opinion can and will differ, and so it should i'm sure you will agree. My view point is narrow?....well perhaps, but narrow in the sense that we are a mappers dream come true, and for me as with anything its all about the £££'s......
Here is a thought:
All of Scoobynet boycot mappers until they lower their prices, and get other forums in on the act too....do you think they would?...i DO, in time they would since i betcha 50% of their custom comes via this forum, and 80% forums over all.....I dont wanna put anyone out of business here that's not my point, but for me mapping is an easy win for the mapper. I believe for what you get in terms of power they work out cost effective. Also i believe for what you get in terms of labour they are NOT so cost effective.
This entire thread for me was about OS over ECUTEK etc. We now have a mapper telling us that OS is totally fine and equals gains for the average user, so i guess our opinions stop there. Enjoyable thread, thanks to all.
Last edited by SpecDscooby; 24 March 2011 at 10:55 PM.
24 March 2011, 11:03 PM
#43
Scooby Regular
p.s.
Seriously Cannon Fodder, none of this was any kind of slant on you, and i hope you understand that. If i had a good experience i would go back too i'm sure; if the price was right.
BTW
Enginemapper is in Wales too???.....food for thought perhaps?
I think my grammer is ok too, btw
Seriously Cannon Fodder, none of this was any kind of slant on you, and i hope you understand that. If i had a good experience i would go back too i'm sure; if the price was right.
BTW
Enginemapper is in Wales too???.....food for thought perhaps?
I think my grammer is ok too, btw
24 March 2011, 11:16 PM
#44
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p.s.
Seriously Cannon Fodder, none of this was any kind of slant on you, and i hope you understand that. If i had a good experience i would go back too i'm sure; if the price was right.
BTW
Enginemapper is in Wales too???.....food for thought perhaps?
I think my grammer is ok too, btw
Seriously Cannon Fodder, none of this was any kind of slant on you, and i hope you understand that. If i had a good experience i would go back too i'm sure; if the price was right.
BTW
Enginemapper is in Wales too???.....food for thought perhaps?
I think my grammer is ok too, btw
I would be happy to use Graham but he is at least 3.5 hours drive one way from me on a good day, so what I would save on cost I would lose in fuel and time taken.
It really doesn't matter to me what software a mapper uses to gain the results; I'm only interested in their skill and experience.
I have also recommended OS mappers to people I know; RaceDynamix has recently mapped 2 Impreza's in the Swansea area (one JDM Blobeye STi and one JDM Bugeye STi) after I was asked who I would chose in terms of cost/experience.
So my question is to Duncan - can I have some commission?
24 March 2011, 11:21 PM
#46
I have also recommended OS mappers to people I know; RaceDynamix has recently mapped 2 Impreza's in the Swansea area (one JDM Blobeye STi and one JDM Bugeye STi) after I was asked who I would chose in terms of cost/experience.
So my question is to Duncan - can I have some commission?
So my question is to Duncan - can I have some commission?
25 March 2011, 09:35 AM
#48
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That is the great thing about not living in a communist state...
it is called FREEDOM OF SPEECH....
clearly JDM Stig feels aggrieved by Andrew Carr, and outside of a liable suit which would frankly be laughed out of court there is nothing you...bigsinky, or Andrew Carr can do about it.....
it is called FREEDOM OF SPEECH....
clearly JDM Stig feels aggrieved by Andrew Carr, and outside of a liable suit which would frankly be laughed out of court there is nothing you...bigsinky, or Andrew Carr can do about it.....
Other users have the right to sue you for defamation if they can prove
you damaged their reputation or good name with false information. You
can be sued for libel if another user can prove you have distributed
defamatory statements about them in a public area -- such as a news
group or mailing list or public forum. take a look at Godfrey v Demon Internet.
I think you will find there is a lot he can do about it. i am actually surprised the moderators on here have not removed the comments before now. they are usually pretty quick to remove comment like this for fear of getting IB into a civil suite.
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