382.8bhp from a VF35 :)
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IMO the only way to conclude this is a run on a different set of rollers because, im not sure if i read this right but someone has already mentioned that the rollers Big D's car was run on may actually be in question.
It doesn't IMO need to be concluded, he ran the car on two seperate occasions at 382bhp. He runs 11.8 on the quarter mile, the power obviously isn't that far out. Yes the AT and ITs are quite different, but if as said his heatshield isn't doing a good job, it's to be expected. I would like to see a pic of said heatshield though.
My Powerstation proven 373bhp VF35 Newage STi ran a 12.2 at Santa Pod, so I would say that minus the 200kg of his classic, his times make sense for the power his car is running. All this saying to run it elsewhere etc is not needed. Rolling roads are never exactly right anyway so let's say it's around 380bhp and leave it at that.
My Powerstation proven 373bhp VF35 Newage STi ran a 12.2 at Santa Pod, so I would say that minus the 200kg of his classic, his times make sense for the power his car is running. All this saying to run it elsewhere etc is not needed. Rolling roads are never exactly right anyway so let's say it's around 380bhp and leave it at that.
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I'm keeping an open mind on this one.
I don't believe there is a problem with the rollers at S4U or the way it is operated. If there is any problem it is deep in the DD software where it does the calculating back for the IT / AT. I think all DD rollers would give the same (as near as damn it) results. Whatever calc it uses is obviously consistant as it came up with the same bhp figure even when the IT was brought down by the extra air-flow.
However, I run a VF35 on my classic (2.1 stroker) and have been looking at new turbos as all the past history of these says it runs out of puff at 340 bhp. In my head I know this to be true,but in my heart (and wallet) I would love to see a VF35 running a genuine 380bhp.
I think a heat-shield and ducted air in will be required before any further rolling road sessions should be done. If the IT can be brought down to a few degrees above AT, and maybe just for arguements sake use a different rolling road, then a definative figure could be presented.
I don't believe there is a problem with the rollers at S4U or the way it is operated. If there is any problem it is deep in the DD software where it does the calculating back for the IT / AT. I think all DD rollers would give the same (as near as damn it) results. Whatever calc it uses is obviously consistant as it came up with the same bhp figure even when the IT was brought down by the extra air-flow.
However, I run a VF35 on my classic (2.1 stroker) and have been looking at new turbos as all the past history of these says it runs out of puff at 340 bhp. In my head I know this to be true,but in my heart (and wallet) I would love to see a VF35 running a genuine 380bhp.
I think a heat-shield and ducted air in will be required before any further rolling road sessions should be done. If the IT can be brought down to a few degrees above AT, and maybe just for arguements sake use a different rolling road, then a definative figure could be presented.
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Having read many threads like this on here and on MLR, a couple of things are readily apparent. You like it when your car gets a headline figure on the dyno (and want to believe it) and don't like it when it's lower than you expect (and look for a getout). And secondly the estimated ATF figures are complete horsecrap (unless measured on an engine dyno). Does anybody seriously believe that you can take the ATW figures and add around 25% to get 'real' ATF figures. Especially as there is very little consistency between the people making these 'estimations' and generally speaking the more generous they are then the more they entertain their customers. So no incentive to inflate the figures there then? The ATW figures are the only ones that really carry any weight on a rolling road.
When I bought my last car it came with dyno printouts showing 465BHP ATF and 450ft/lbs which having since done some research with the spec I have is simply not possible as although the overall spec is very good the car currently runs a TD05-16G. Having since had it mapped and dyno'ed it actually got 355ATW with 400ft/lbs. The ambient temp was 40degrees and my printout gives an estimated ATF figure of 400BHP which is probably far more realistic. With an ambient temp of 20degrees the car may have made 375ATW which is pretty much it as far as the turbo goes.
Why is it all these dyno sessions provide printouts giving a headline figure that simply cannot be proven without ripping the engine out and putting it on an engine dyno?
They should just focus on the wheel power and there would then be some consistency in the process. And less dreamers.
Kevin
When I bought my last car it came with dyno printouts showing 465BHP ATF and 450ft/lbs which having since done some research with the spec I have is simply not possible as although the overall spec is very good the car currently runs a TD05-16G. Having since had it mapped and dyno'ed it actually got 355ATW with 400ft/lbs. The ambient temp was 40degrees and my printout gives an estimated ATF figure of 400BHP which is probably far more realistic. With an ambient temp of 20degrees the car may have made 375ATW which is pretty much it as far as the turbo goes.
Why is it all these dyno sessions provide printouts giving a headline figure that simply cannot be proven without ripping the engine out and putting it on an engine dyno?
They should just focus on the wheel power and there would then be some consistency in the process. And less dreamers.
Kevin
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From: 7.74 @179 mph 1/4 mile - road legal
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You've forgotten what I said in my earlier post (open mind)
and gone and lost your sense of humour too !
(sad face) Last post 
(cheeky face)
One suggestion, if you want people to keep an open mind to accepting results they haven't seen before, you need to keep an open mind, & accept the possibility that they "may" be wrong !
and gone and lost your sense of humour too !
(sad face) Last post (cheeky face)One suggestion, if you want people to keep an open mind to accepting results they haven't seen before, you need to keep an open mind, & accept the possibility that they "may" be wrong !
It was mentioned earlier that I was arguing with some of the finest Subaru tuners in the country, I know this and I am not stupid do you think I would dare argue or try and fight my corner if I did not believe that what I have here is correct or close to it, if I had any doubt in my mind I would have gone away and shut up at the earliest opportunity. By standing up for myself I mean no disrespect either. Is the man that mapped my car not regarded as one of the finest Subaru tuners in the country and said what he had to near the start of the thread.
Cheers Iain
I've been following this thread for a while and I'm still on the fence. Pretty much everyone has made valid comments whatever tone or aim was behind them..
I've been trying to find a compressor map for a VF35 and lucked out. Has anyone actually proven their maximum air side mass flow rate range?
I've been trying to find a compressor map for a VF35 and lucked out. Has anyone actually proven their maximum air side mass flow rate range?