Mark1983

iTrader: (2)

Just to add, you can drive as perfectly/carefully as you like but no lap is never the same. A couple of weeks ago I hit fluid at the full throttle 5th gear left hand kink just before Hohe Acht with no warning, scared the crap out of me. The car was parked at Hohe Acht with the driver just sitting in the car, didn't bother getting out to flag.

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

v.good thread that one. Got room for another un on ur next trip.

So basically good idea to have a grand kicking about just in case.

Also if i crash into someone my insurance should pay out? but not for barrier repair or my own car repair.

Gilesdwrc

I'm covered by the NFU Mutual, They don't exclude the ring, Although I'm not going to be the one to test it!!

See You all on the w'end (30th- 1st June)

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

Who are you with mark?

I take it you insured with them especially because they dont exclude the ring?

Still weighing up the costs/ if its worth the risk/cost with my current policy.

perhaps it would be best to wait untill i get a new policy with a Ring covering company and go next year instead. and stick to doing the UK tracks for the time being..

Mark1983

iTrader: (2)

I'll be there although probably will only be on track early mornings and evenings, too many closures/idiots between 11am-5pm.

Mine is the blue 55 plate STi with a NorthLoop.co.uk sticker on the rear window.

fivetide

iTrader: (1)

I'm just back after the third visit with the bike...

we like this place

***onRoad Cafe Motorsport Treff/Hotel am Nürnburgring***

Its in Adenau, just up the road so a bit quieter and the bloke that runs it is brilliant. Also a bit cheaper at 35 euro a night if you share a bathroom.

Re: crashing - would agree with others, enjoy it for a drive, remember it is NOT a track it is a one way toll road with coaches, classic cars etc on it. There can be oil on any corner and it is best to drive to limits.

Best way is not to time the laps and also not to push it in the straights. Most people get it wrong under braking or because they don't have a good view of the corner. If you slow early for the bends chances are you'll go round faster. Often see people doing 120 down the straights and slam on the anchors for a corner which drops them to 80... i'll tootle past them at 100 which is the actual speed you can take the corner at if you get a good look at it (just as an example)

Also note there are limits on the ring (two specific places by the car park) BUT my mate managed to crash his bike (just skated down the road at the end of the session so no cost for closure or repairs the sod) but he DID get done for speeding.

Fine example of German logic:

Copper:

"100 euro fine for speeding"

Us:

"Eh there's no limit?"

Copper:

"He is crashing, zer for he izt going too fast. Zer for he is speeding. 100 Euro"

Not really a lot you could say to that!

Have fun at the end of the day. it'll be a mad adrenaline rush whatever!

5t.

Mark1983

iTrader: (2)

There are speed limits on the Dottinger Hohe straight and the approach to Breidscheid bridge, the two places where you can enter/leave the Nordschleife. Whether you choose to abide by these limits is your choice. In my experience the police turn a blind eye unless however in the case of your mate who crashed (all accidents are recorded by Nurburgring GmbH) the police attended and fined.

A photo of me passing the speed limit sign on Breidscheid bridge.





You can even get stopped for speeding on a de-restricted autobahn if you speed is deemed to be too fast for the conditions.

fivetide

iTrader: (1)

Cheers, new it was around the entrances/exits.

Mate crashed on a derestricted section. Touched the kerb basically and flipped the bike it was dry conditions etc so no real mitigating factor. I just like the crash = too fast = speeding. He's impressed he has a ticket for going too fast on the Nurburgring.

5t.

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

Put that in a frame and hang it on the wall then.

Cant beat the coppas logic really. No speedlimit, but if you crashed you were clearly going stupidly fast hence ticket.

It certainly seems like everyone crashes....? Anything more than a grand for barrier repairs will be to much. Fromt he look of it that focus on passion fords really belted the barrier.

I guess most people think the risk is insignificant compared to the experiance and just risk it. And it does seem like one hell of a risk. Watching a few of the vids of the Taxi's going round, if they drive like that id imagine normal people drive a lot worse making a crash common.

Enough of the doom and gloom, let me here the other side of the story for a bit .

Mark1983

iTrader: (2)

Even the Ring Taxi's have accidents. A biker died last year after colliding with the Ring Taxi.

Other side...

I compare a lap of the Nordscheife to a round of golf. You're always striving for that perfect lap/round. You do it once and it is enjoyable, improve your technique and you're hooked. I don't time my laps so a perfect lap for me is one that is smooth and gets me back into the car park. Nothing gets your heart beating like driving through the Fuchsrohle at >140mph. You'll see plenty of exotica in the car park.

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

im not surprised a biker died looking at a couple of vids.

I guess 90% of people go on effectivly un insured?

If my insurance doesnt cover the nurburgring am i technically breaking the law by driving on it uninsured..??

Ive sent my company an email to see what they say about covering me in this event. awaiting their reply.

Mark1983

iTrader: (2)

I would say the majority of British people do. Most German insurance policies cover it however German car insurance is expensive and you can't have it unless you have a German address, TÜV the car and register with the local council to get a German plate. These are also region specific so if you move areas you need to re-register. Keep an eye out for AW and DAU cars, these are the locals.

Wording the email would be key. You say Nurburgring, they say no. You would need to stress you would be driving during touristenfahrten on the Nordschleife. A toll road open to the public (however owned by the Rheinland Pflaz region) where all German road laws applies however even then I wouldn't hold out too much hope.

Insurance is such a grey area.

fivetide

iTrader: (1)

My mate's insurance technically didn't cover him as it didn't include "derestricted toll roads"

However, the german cop was only bothered that he had a certificate, he didn't read the small print. also his insurance company piad out as he simply told them he'd had an accident in Germany and they never actually asked where it was.

The bloke from On Road Cafe came out and picked him up and took him back to the hotel which is the reason i recommend them. Above and beyond that man.

Mark clearly goes round with the same philosophy as me. A brilliantly fluid lap means much more than a fast time. I have no idea how quick i've been round but i have been passed by people who have crashed two corners along...

Remember, with all the doom and gloom the vast majority (me and Mark included) make it round incident free just the same as most people manage to drive to work in a morning without a bump!

All things like this have that risk element but if you are aware of it then you'll be on your mettle watching out for idiots. Its those that just go banzai that tend to have the problems!

Be sure to stay on the right though and check your mirrors when you go to overtake. The rules are there for a reason so obey them... especially if you have only used a couple of laps of a 25 lap ticket as they will take it off you with no refund!

5t.

Mark1983

iTrader: (2)

The Nordschleife has a capacity of circa 250 cars at any one time so if you consider the sheer volume of traffic ratio to accidents it's quite small. Even the most experienced ringers crash though, I know people who do 1000 laps a year and have ended up leaving via the air ambulance let alone sponsoring sections of Armco.

Definitely keep your eyes on your mirrors. Noobs don't realise how fast a GT3 can teleport into your rear window.

I stick to the rules religiously, I have no intention of parting with my (€1075) season ticket

At the end of the day it's probably safe to say you'll have a trouble free trip and thoroughly enjoy yourself

p1doc

55 laps and 2 crashes no armco both relatively minor offs
martin

Ginge !

iTrader: (1)

ive done 52 laps. 1 spin but im slow

cossie-nutter

iTrader: (45)

And there was me about to say pm MADDOG as he's the best person to ask! lol

p1doc

it felt pretty fast when i went off lol
martin

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

Yeah mad dog has very kindly offered me some advice. The help from you guys is really appreciated. as this could potentially be quite serious.

Im swaying between each. Right now im thinking the potential financial risk is just to high.

Im thinking ill wait till next year, take out insurance with someone who doesnt exlucde the ring, then go in compartive comfort and spend the 1.3k its gonna cost me on a few open pit days and a holiday in the sun or something.

I really did plan to go to nurburgring this year, that was my goal since about 2 years a go lol and i keep missing it. Perhaps i should just bite the bullit, one life live it. Is the potential risk of complete financial bankrupcy really worth 2 days on a track..? Thats the question at the end of the day. or perhaps thats where half the thrill is...

c

cossie-nutter

iTrader: (45)

As for insurance...

A friend of mine! (NEVER TO BE NAMED!!!) Smashed his BMW M3 55 plate up while at the ring to the point it cost him loads of money to get it pushed outside the gate then got it snuck back into the UK then claimed off his insurance sneakily! He can drive and been going there for years but on this occasion he crashed out of his control!

Also another mate broke down and dropped lots of oil that cost him doller because they shut the track and is also still going through courts now because a biker came off because of the oil!) He was arrested and ordered to pay X Amount! But the guy is still trying to claim more off him!

There is no point to my post to be honest but think Insurance when going over there is a must!

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

thanks cossie-nutter. i guess for tonight at least ive made my mind up to hold out untill i can find some reasonable insurance.

knowing me ill say sod it tomorrow morning

p1doc

go out there with NO intention to race and enjoy yourself
martin

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

That would be the case, but if my engine goes pop spewing oil over everywhere, o i have to swerve to avoid a car and take out 100m of armco. Doesnt matter if your intending to race those events could be crippling.

As cossie has pointed out above...

fivetide

iTrader: (1)

That's easy to sort - Get the car serviced and checked over before you leave. If you don't think your car can handle 15 miles of hard(ish - if you don't push it too much) driving then there are a few issues there!

I think the plan to have a full on assualt might be off but why not go and just do a couple of laps, hang out in the car park, look at the auto exotica there and generally have a good time?

The surrounding area and roads are superb too. Nothing stopping you heading down the Rhine or even... through to Stelvio and covering one of the great EU roads (we did it in reverse though... France, Switzerland, Italy, Austria, Germany, Belgium and then home. Great loop.

5t.

p1doc

exactly if car has had a service should be fine,would you never go onn a track day for fear of oil spillage etc,half the ring trip is looking at great cars great food and the general petrolhead atmosphere,you could go round with your right hand indicator on permanently and still get a 11 minute lap lol
martin

Mark1983

iTrader: (2)

Some of the local roads are very good. I love the road from adenau to Hohe Acht, it's used in the German rally. Also the road from Nurburg to Mayen is nice and twisty. I've got the police accident statistics from 2008 and there are more accidents on the local roads that the Nordschleife.

Stelvio... it's 7 hours away

Even the Porsche Museum (a must if you like Porsches) in Stuttgart is a 6 hour round trip.

fivetide

iTrader: (1)

If you'll re-read i suggested it as part of a bigger holiday... we stayed one night in each country. Fantastic trip and something we do each year.

This time we did

Belgium (Ostend)
Germany (Adenau)
Germany (Gottingen 2 nights, spent a day riding around the local mountain roads)
Belgium (Antwerp)

Ferry to/from Dunkirk.

5t.

scoobyc

iTrader: (2)

yeah good points.

Re the service. The car is solid, but that doesnt mean that any moment something could go very wrong.

The autoexotica and people wuold be great.

I think im gonna do a few more track days this year, and go next year when i can have a go on the track without being too worried. Need to put my sensible hat on for this.