sierra sapphire cosworth...opinions please
30 October 2001, 11:09 PM
#33
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Tony,
The chap that runs this Board, Simon de Banke, has got a 3dr Rally car. I have been out in that a number of times (passenger), and vowed I would never buy a RWD car..........as i would almost certainly kill myself!!!!!
Perhaps the car was OK, it was just his driving!!!
The chap that runs this Board, Simon de Banke, has got a 3dr Rally car. I have been out in that a number of times (passenger), and vowed I would never buy a RWD car..........as i would almost certainly kill myself!!!!!
Perhaps the car was OK, it was just his driving!!!
01 November 2001, 08:20 AM
#38
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colchester mate
my r33 is being run in as we speak, should be up and running for the big jap uk meet in sussex 11th nov.
pity there aint a big essex scoobynet meet, where people can see ALL kinds of cars, skylines,cossies, pulsars etc etc. oh, and i spose some scoobys could come
my r33 is being run in as we speak, should be up and running for the big jap uk meet in sussex 11th nov.
pity there aint a big essex scoobynet meet, where people can see ALL kinds of cars, skylines,cossies, pulsars etc etc. oh, and i spose some scoobys could come
01 November 2001, 07:38 PM
#39
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Mate
Come on over to the Essex RS meet second tuesday of each month at the Belveder pub near rayleigh on The A127
id meet you on the A12 if you want and bring you in and we can have a "steady" run im sure Bluey would be up for it as well we alwasy play with each other "ooooh matron"
Theres always lots of cossies few scooby doos and other stuff all welcome
Nige
Come on over to the Essex RS meet second tuesday of each month at the Belveder pub near rayleigh on The A127
id meet you on the A12 if you want and bring you in and we can have a "steady" run im sure Bluey would be up for it as well we alwasy play with each other "ooooh matron"
Theres always lots of cossies few scooby doos and other stuff all welcome
Nige
01 November 2001, 10:05 PM
#40
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how about the reyland mondeo cossie. cossie engined with 4 wheel drive.
it's not 500bhp anymore it's now got an approx.340bhp cossie engine in it.
it's someyhing different anyway!!
it's not 500bhp anymore it's now got an approx.340bhp cossie engine in it.
it's someyhing different anyway!!
02 November 2001, 11:03 AM
#41
I did a Revs Cossy track day and stood up well to the 4x4 boys in my rwd. If things had been a little more even (what with me being hindered with a set of the diabolical Avon ZZ1s) then Im sure I could have matched their cornering speed and then out braked them (rwd front Cossy calipers are 4 pots) and pulled away on the straights (not suffering the transmission loss of a 4x4).
Its only in the wet where 4x4s get any real advantage me thinks.
I personally dont like the idea of having to spend an extra £3k on the transmission on a 4x4 to get it to cope reliably with 350+bhp where a rwd box will handle that easily. Id love a 4x4 for when its wet so I could still use the power properly but Id quickly get bored with it in the dry. Removes a lot of the 'driving experience' in my opinion. Ive a friend with a late P reg Escort thats running 278bhp and its pretty unexciting.
Having said that if I had £25 to spend on a toy and test base, as thats all our Cossy is, then chances are Id put it into an early Escort for £13k and another £12k on a 400bhp conversion, big brakes, suspension and transmission upgrade.
Bren
Its only in the wet where 4x4s get any real advantage me thinks.
I personally dont like the idea of having to spend an extra £3k on the transmission on a 4x4 to get it to cope reliably with 350+bhp where a rwd box will handle that easily. Id love a 4x4 for when its wet so I could still use the power properly but Id quickly get bored with it in the dry. Removes a lot of the 'driving experience' in my opinion. Ive a friend with a late P reg Escort thats running 278bhp and its pretty unexciting.
Having said that if I had £25 to spend on a toy and test base, as thats all our Cossy is, then chances are Id put it into an early Escort for £13k and another £12k on a 400bhp conversion, big brakes, suspension and transmission upgrade.
Bren
12 November 2001, 11:04 AM
#42
What it really boils down to is that 4wd is for pussies who can't drive a slippery stick up a dog's ****...
Real men drive rwd...
I have had the displeasure of driving 4wd and although it was fun in the wet, I would find that I would nearly fall asleep at the wheel in the dry or have to drive like a complete maniac to get the same level of "fun" that can be obtained from a rwd car (not really on on a public road).
Of course the Escorts "look" nicer, they were designed as a rally-car from the offset, whereas the Saphs were built to home in on the bigger market sector of the company director brigade, who thought that a 3-door was just to unsubtle for them. It worked as the Sapphire was THE best selling Cosworth and it is this reason ALONE that they are cheaper to purchase second hand, as there are lots about (20,000+ in both 2wd & 4x4 guise). With only 5000 3-doors and 7500 Escorts (big and small turbo models), its no wonder that these hold their values better than the Sapphires.
I love the looks of the Escort, but would only ever have one as a second car or if I was going to build one up from a shell and make it rwd...
Real men drive rwd...I have had the displeasure of driving 4wd
and although it was fun in the wet, I would find that I would nearly fall asleep at the wheel in the dry or have to drive like a complete maniac to get the same level of "fun" that can be obtained from a rwd car (not really on on a public road).Of course the Escorts "look" nicer, they were designed as a rally-car from the offset, whereas the Saphs were built to home in on the bigger market sector of the company director brigade, who thought that a 3-door was just to unsubtle for them. It worked as the Sapphire was THE best selling Cosworth and it is this reason ALONE that they are cheaper to purchase second hand, as there are lots about (20,000+ in both 2wd & 4x4 guise). With only 5000 3-doors and 7500 Escorts (big and small turbo models), its no wonder that these hold their values better than the Sapphires.
I love the looks of the Escort, but would only ever have one as a second car or if I was going to build one up from a shell and make it rwd...
12 November 2001, 03:16 PM
#43
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Mike,
As much as I respect your engine knowledge and advice, it has to be said that your knowledge on handling and what is best, is about as good as Dingys seam welding is on his Mk2!!!!!
"What it really boils down to is that 4wd is for pussies who can't drive a slippery stick up a dog's ****... Real men drive rwd..."
Granted mate.....I can't drive, thats why I have 4wd (a few driving lessons when the cars sorted, will remedy taht one), but so must be the case for Colin Mcrae, Tommi, Marcus & Richard then!!!
"I have had the displeasure of driving 4wd and although it was fun in the wet, I would find that I would nearly fall asleep at the wheel in the dry or have to drive like a complete maniac to get the same level of "fun" that can be obtained from a rwd car (not really on on a public road)."
That statement REALLY proves you can't drive then!!! I have been in a couple of 4wd cars driven by PROPER drivers. All I can say, is that my boxers have never been the same colour since.
"Of course the Escorts "look" nicer, they were designed as a rally-car from the offset, whereas the Saphs were built to home in on the bigger market sector of the company director brigade, who thought that a 3-door was just to unsubtle for them. It worked as the Sapphire was THE best selling Cosworth and it is this reason ALONE that they are cheaper to purchase second hand, as there are lots about (20,000+ in both 2wd & 4x4 guise). With only 5000 3-doors and 7500 Escorts (big and small turbo models), its no wonder that these hold their values better than the Sapphires."
Why do you think they sold more........wasn't because they were a better car you plank!!! They produced more, so more people bought them. If the 3dr's and Escort's had been produced in larger numbers, they would of all been sold!!! 
Stick to your flat cap and slippers mate!!!!!
Regards,
Shaun.
As much as I respect your engine knowledge and advice, it has to be said that your knowledge on handling and what is best, is about as good as Dingys seam welding is on his Mk2!!!!!
"What it really boils down to is that 4wd is for pussies who can't drive a slippery stick up a dog's ****... Real men drive rwd..."
Granted mate.....I can't drive, thats why I have 4wd (a few driving lessons when the cars sorted, will remedy taht one), but so must be the case for Colin Mcrae, Tommi, Marcus & Richard then!!!
"I have had the displeasure of driving 4wd and although it was fun in the wet, I would find that I would nearly fall asleep at the wheel in the dry or have to drive like a complete maniac to get the same level of "fun" that can be obtained from a rwd car (not really on on a public road)."
That statement REALLY proves you can't drive then!!! I have been in a couple of 4wd cars driven by PROPER drivers. All I can say, is that my boxers have never been the same colour since.
"Of course the Escorts "look" nicer, they were designed as a rally-car from the offset, whereas the Saphs were built to home in on the bigger market sector of the company director brigade, who thought that a 3-door was just to unsubtle for them. It worked as the Sapphire was THE best selling Cosworth and it is this reason ALONE that they are cheaper to purchase second hand, as there are lots about (20,000+ in both 2wd & 4x4 guise). With only 5000 3-doors and 7500 Escorts (big and small turbo models), its no wonder that these hold their values better than the Sapphires."
Why do you think they sold more........wasn't because they were a better car you plank!!!
They produced more, so more people bought them. If the 3dr's and Escort's had been produced in larger numbers, they would of all been sold!!! Stick to your flat cap and slippers mate!!!!!
Regards,
Shaun.
12 November 2001, 04:48 PM
#44
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Sorry, but I cant agree with you shaun. RWD is so much more rewarding to drive when you get it right. I drove my mates 350bhp 4x4 saff last night. fast? deffo. fun? not as much as my 3-door. driving a RWD is a more involving experience and therefore, more rewarding when you get it right. the likes of burnsie and co. have to drive 4wd cars to be competetive, not because they want to.
Dont get me wrong, I have a lot of respect for 4wd as it is so much faster than rwd in the right conditions. but for fun? give me my 3-door anyday.
astraboy.
Dont get me wrong, I have a lot of respect for 4wd as it is so much faster than rwd in the right conditions. but for fun? give me my 3-door anyday.
astraboy.
12 November 2001, 05:14 PM
#45
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Astraboy,
I agree with you, that RWD is more fun (from what I have been told, as i'm sure that if I had RWD I would kill myself). But your remark concerning the Rally cars, speaks for itself to state that 4wd is much better at getting the car faster from A to B.
I have to conclude that if somebody in a RWD car can keep up with a person in a 4wd car, than the 4wd car owner is obviously not that good a driver in the first place then. Hence why a Scooby is able to outpace a Ferrari.....regardless of power.
I agree with you, that RWD is more fun (from what I have been told, as i'm sure that if I had RWD I would kill myself). But your remark concerning the Rally cars, speaks for itself to state that 4wd is much better at getting the car faster from A to B.
I have to conclude that if somebody in a RWD car can keep up with a person in a 4wd car, than the 4wd car owner is obviously not that good a driver in the first place then.
Hence why a Scooby is able to outpace a Ferrari.....regardless of power.
12 November 2001, 11:52 PM
#46
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Shaun,
You've raised a few interesting points there, and there is no doubt that point to point, the 4wd has got to be quicker. It just tend to be that most road driving is straight line, with a few roundabouts thrown in for good measure, and that's where the fun is...... although I'd swap my 2wd for 4x4 in this weather!
You've raised a few interesting points there, and there is no doubt that point to point, the 4wd has got to be quicker. It just tend to be that most road driving is straight line, with a few roundabouts thrown in for good measure, and that's where the fun is...... although I'd swap my 2wd for 4x4 in this weather!
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11 December 2001 08:26 AM
