You've missed my point completely. The plane was travelling straight and level and seen in formation with the two F16s by a local witness, moments later if 'fell from the sky like a stone'. Obviously it was flying using the auto-pilot as all contact had been lost hundreds of miles before. That's why I wonder what happened; you dont think that it ran out of petrol do you....?


Simon

 

All speculation at the moment....best wait for the black boxes to be analysed to find out what really happened.

 

Hmmm, when was the last budget carrier you've been on that had leather seats?: http://www.flyhelios.com/about_fleet.php Journalists making stuff up again I suspect

Although they only had that particular plane for just over a year.

 

greek bloke on the radio this morning said he doubted that any infromation could be retrieved from the flight recorder due to its condition.

what a nightmare.

 

I'm waiting for the black box results.






And I'm really, really hoping that 1 of my friends wasn't on that flight.

 

Air Berlin, last Wednesday (Fokker 100)

 

Don't know how I haven't heard about this before but just seen this - shocking

 

I have never flown on a small plane in Europe without leather seats (737/A3xx series)

 

The guy who claimed to have received a text from someone on board has been arrested by Greek Police apparently?

It does seem very odd that something knocked out, or killed the pilots instantly - but then a while later the F16 pilots claimed to have seen 2 people fighting the controls?..

Must have been horrific for those onboard

 

I think the words BUDGET airline is the hint here

Show off

 

We were.....communicating You know.......the bird

 

No, that includes budget airlines. Virgin Express, Easyjet and German Wings.

 

Well I HAVE flow on a most budget lines within Europe WITHOUT leather seats.


....not so sweaty on your **** either

 

The whole thing seems very odd. How do you fight the controls? Who opened the cockpit door? Who disengaged the autopilot?

 

When I wrote that I was being facetious; now the Greek government's line is that it did run out of fuel! How the f*ck can that be? Considering that, firstly: flying in a straight line, the plane hadnt reached its destination and secondly: they were fighting a fuel fire over two square kilometres of scrub on live television 30 minutes after it crashed?


Simon

 

With the latest info it looks as though there was either a rapid decompression, or even a slow one and the cockpit alarm did not work so the pilots were caught out, or more likely the pilot's oxygen supply was not working even though the passengers' was. The captain may have gone back to get a portable supply but was overcome by anoxia. They don't appear to have initiated an emergency descent anyway.

I bet there will be some tricky questions for the aircraft operators eventually!

Les

 

Ryanair seats are leather... surely you're not suggesting they're anything other than BUDGET!!

 

F16's were allegedly scrambled as the plane wasn't answering the radio. (Emergency security response plan)

Pilots have to manually grab the oxygen mask, where cabin is automatic. Slow depressurisation/no pressurisation at all on climb out, *plus* no cockpit warning (or ignored - "this plane keeps having a false warning", could have meant auto-deployment in the back, while the cabin crew just slipped out without noticing - outrageous fortune, but it may be possible to construct a plausible scenario.

I have to say the fuel doesn't make sense... short of destination, plus they carry reserve anyhow. Probably a case of "lies to children". Possibly the autopilot hit a waypoint, and changed something? Possibly the passengers managed to disengage.. pure speculation. If they were on oxygen in the back they'd have had to disconnect to reach the cockpit.. giving them a short while before they too keeled over.

As for the door.. I was sat on a flight last night thinking about being in that situation.. there's a bottle of medical oxygen in the front left cupboard on an A320.. portable breathability, and a potentially useful battering ram? I'm sure most aircraft carry one somewhere.

I *REALLY* doubt there's an axe on board.. wouldn't be too difficult to overpower a steward and get hold of that now would it? (Of course I'm probably wrong...)

Bottom line is we will probably never know. It's a tragedy, and very sad. Air travel is quite safe, but when things go wrong it tends to be catastrophic.

 

A work colleague of mine was travelling on the plane.

Paris Demetriou was travelling with his fiance on holiday to greece.

He was an excellent enginner and will be trully missed. Farewell Paris may God rest your soul.

 

There are reports of Helios passengers complaining that the air-conditioning on previous flights had been mal-functioning, some reported it was too hot, others that it was too cold and the flight attendents had to pass out blankets. There are also (unsubstantiated) reports that one of the aircraft's air-conditioning packs was unserviceable. This in itself does not mean it was unsafe to fly, but it might mean that some flight restrictions were necessary. Note that "air-conditioning" systems on aircraft are nothing like those in cars or offices, they also provide cabin pressurization amongst other things.

Whatever caused the depressurisation, and whether fast or slow, there should still have been enough time for the flight crew to get their oxygen masks on.

 

A slow loss of pressurisation is more dangerous that a rapid one. With a rapid one there is plenty of evidence that is has happened, loud bang, whooshing noises, misting up etc.

Anoxia is insiduous in that as is takes effect the average person will feel euphoria and not even realise what is happening until they lose control of their actions. Its a bit like getting pissed! If the cabin pressure warning had failed the crew may never have known what had happened since they cannot see the passenger's oxygen masks dropping down. The crew carry their own proper oxygen face masks ready for immediate use and as I explained earlier the operating pilot should either have his mask hanging on his headset or be wearing it depending on the altitude they were flying at. Even that would not help if it was hanging and he was overcome by hypoxia before he knew about the failure.

I have been in the decompression chamber many times doing both anoxia runs to help me to recognise the symptoms or explosive decompressions for training purposes. It is a real eye opener to realise how it can overcome you without you even knowing it was happening.

Les

 

I flew on helios from bristol to laranca and back in 2001 ......I found it ace,giving loads of sweets to my kids,also playing greek music when boarding,it to had leather seats, I counld'nt fault the airline...jon

 

I never really thought of it before but cabin depressurisation would have been a very serious problem with Concorde. With a cruise altitude of 60,000ft, the pilots would have had very little time to get their masks on, and a fast descent to 10,000ft would have been exciting! Does anyone know if one of the Concorde pilots always had to wear his mask during cruise?

 

It was certainly part of RAF transport regulations for carrying passengers above 35K feet I think, I cant remember the actual heights for hanging the mask or actually wearing it by the operating pilot. As I understood it, it was part of general air regulations which we always followed on the VC10. In this case it should certainly apply to the Concorde crews.

Les

 

Concorde crews did not wear O2 sets during the cruise.

 

That does surprise me.

Les