Claudius

Let's sum up some FACTS:
- life is more expensive in the UK than Continental Europe
- 15 countries, soon to be more, have decided on one currency
- interest rates for Euroland are decided by the ECB

Conclusion

- I dont think you can conclude from the fact that 15 countries use the Euro that that decision is right
- you cannot infer from the UK joining the Euroland that cost of living in the UK will diminish

Claudius

You have to pay fees for wiring money, no matter what currency it's in, if it goes to another country (and often if it doesnt).

Holy Ghost

sorry alcazar - that was *very* pompous tw@t of me.

i take your point on pricing. i think it'd be tough to find anything useful to buy over here that ain't cheaper over there.

however, i can't see that as a good reason for doing it on its own. the supposed fact of a free market in the EU, plus proper enforcement of regulations coupled with more vocal consumer pressure - can you hear me all you b@stard car manufacturers and dealers in the UK - should gradually bring prices closer in line.

just strikes me that it's unnecessary for us and owes more to an exercise in political vanity than anything else. plus i'm always cautious about things irreversible.

TelBoy

Cammy, ok i'll concede that Jospin and Kohl started this with decent intentions. But i believe Schroeder has pursued it dogmatically, for political rather than economic reasons. And to think they're considering allowing entry to every Balkan state you can throw a stick at just heightens my cautiousness.

But, like all these things, as the current generation of UK residents ages, and is replaced by people who have less memories of what they remember the "good old days" of the UK to be, the more likely it is that we will capitulate and join in. Hopefully by then i won't care as much that my own Government is unable to pass it's own laws.

Leslie

Holy Ghost

That is a well written post and all the points are very good.

There are all sorts of arguments for going either way of course but believe me, Federation is what will eventually follow loss of our own currency. Do people realise how important their vote is I wonder. That is the only thing left to us as far as democracy is concerned and if we lose that then we will have no control of the ruling authority. If we become federated, our votes will be for our own MEP's who will be a very small part of the European Parliament. Our own votes will lose so much power that they will be of virtually no importance any more.

Our own sovereignty is too valuable to just throw away if we want to retain our self determination. I dont really want to be ruled by those commissioners who sacked themselves when they were caught out with enormous sums of money missing from the accounts,took the compensation money due to them for losing their jobs, carried on doing the job because they said there was no-one else to do it, and then re-appointed most of themselves in the job-keeping the cash they took in the first place. How cynical can you get? They are not even elected either. We also have to remember that if we dump the Pound for the Euro or give up our sovereignty, then we are taking irreversible steps. So it is not something that should be undertaken lightly.

Corruption in places of power is getting worse as the politics of greed become more prevalent. We should not weaken our ways of dealing with it by allowing ourselves to become disenfranchised.


[Edited by Leslie - 3/14/2003 6:36:15 PM]

Holy Ghost

thanks leslie,

i share your sense of disquiet and the general degrading of our electoral influence that federalism entails.

and no, i don't think enough people realise that should/when referendum day comes, it will be the most critical and far-reaching day in our history since september 12th 1940. i don't mean to be dramatic but there it is.

Eldar

Re the French. Go to google, search "french military victories" and hit I Feel Lucky......

Colin.

alcazar

iTrader: (2)

Eldar: and??????
Alcazar

Adrian F

If the countries of Europe think a single currency is good for them does not mean it is good for us. If we have to enter a trade agreement then the NAFTA is probabaly better for UK than further integration with europe. At least you retain political independance and we have a common language.

If we truly wanted a universal currency then the obvious one would have been Dollars but the French wouldn't allow that.

Finaly the intergration of such a diverse group against the wish of a large proportion is only storing trouble for the future. The out come of these idea's is shown in the former state of Yugoslavia. Many polls in Germany show a large percentage want the Deutschmark back already