So Brexit seems to be a good thing then.
16 September 2019, 04:33 PM
#5341
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This doesn't make any sense at all. No deal means WTO rules, which we have to abide by as a member of the WTO, no favourites, no exemptions, so all of our trade will have the same tariff. If you are saying that we will unilaterally reduce our tariffs across the whole shooting match, and at the same time hoping the world will do the same to us, then that seems rather optimistic. Sure we will potentially have very cheap imports, but will have no power over our exports, our economy will be at the mercy of foreign countries, our industry (what is left of it) will be out competed by cheap imports!
16 September 2019, 06:06 PM
#5342
Scooby Regular
This doesn't make any sense at all. No deal means WTO rules, which we have to abide by as a member of the WTO, no favourites, no exemptions, so all of our trade will have the same tariff. If you are saying that we will unilaterally reduce our tariffs across the whole shooting match, and at the same time hoping the world will do the same to us, then that seems rather optimistic. Sure we will potentially have very cheap imports, but will have no power over our exports, our economy will be at the mercy of foreign countries, our industry (what is left of it) will be out competed by cheap imports!
16 September 2019, 09:18 PM
#5343
Scooby Senior
17 September 2019, 02:34 PM
#5348
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I have asked you this before, but what benefit does leaving the EU provide you...cos it won't be financial!
17 September 2019, 02:40 PM
#5349
Scooby Regular
And that link tells you tarifs are a part of incredibly complex deals that govern all elements of how we trade...it also says it's likely to take considerable time to pit in place.
I have asked you this before, but what benefit does leaving the EU provide you...cos it won't be financial!
I have asked you this before, but what benefit does leaving the EU provide you...cos it won't be financial!
17 September 2019, 03:21 PM
#5350
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17 September 2019, 03:37 PM
#5352
Scooby Senior
The EU import tariffs are the WTO tariffs, they cannot be higher!
The WTO does not set tariffs, each country or unified trading block in the case of the EU, sets its own external tariffs. In the absence of any full trade deals or smaller trade agreements between two countries, then the WTO tariffs are applicable.
You cannot set a higher tariff than the WTO tariff for a particular country, whatever you set your WTO tariffs at, everyone gets that rate by default.
If you have a full blown trade deal or a smaller trade agreement then this could reduce or eliminate tariffs for imports from the country you have the deal with, but if you were then to change your WTO tariff to a lower tariff, then this would override the tariff set in the trade deal.
So your statement that "EU tariffs are higher than WTO" is simply not correct!
If we were to leave with no deal, then yes, we could set our own tariffs to zero, which would mean that imports from the UK would not be more expensive, however, it would also mean every other country in the world could import to the UK with zero tariffs. This could be vary dangerous to our domestic producers who are currently competitive in price against other EU countries, but may be somewhat expensive compared to say China. This is the whole reason why tariffs exist in the first place, to protect domestic producers who otherwise could not compete against countries with cheaper labour costs and lower working standards.
The other side is we cannot control the import tariffs of other countries and in particular the EU. That means our exporters immediately become more expensive when exporting to other EU countries or countries with an EU trade deal or trade agreement. The EU currently has many trade deals and agreements in place and is advanced in negotiations of many more. You can see a list of all the EU agreements here!
So, under a no deal Brexit, our domestic producers are very likely to suffer against cheaper imports and also likely to suffer when exporting to any country which was previously covered by an EU trade agreement. Yes, we can then negotiate new trade deals and yes, some deals (likely the ones with smaller countries) will be quite quick, but generally trade deals take years of negotiations and the country with the biggest market will normally get the better deal. The EU as a single market is able to get trade deals which are largely to the advantage of the EU, but the UK on its own is not such a powerful player and would never get a trade deal with any of the big countries that would be better than the EU. A trade deal with the US for example would be largely to our disadvantage, meaning the US would gain more access to the UK market than the UK would gain of the US market.
The WTO does not set tariffs, each country or unified trading block in the case of the EU, sets its own external tariffs. In the absence of any full trade deals or smaller trade agreements between two countries, then the WTO tariffs are applicable.
You cannot set a higher tariff than the WTO tariff for a particular country, whatever you set your WTO tariffs at, everyone gets that rate by default.
If you have a full blown trade deal or a smaller trade agreement then this could reduce or eliminate tariffs for imports from the country you have the deal with, but if you were then to change your WTO tariff to a lower tariff, then this would override the tariff set in the trade deal.
So your statement that "EU tariffs are higher than WTO" is simply not correct!
If we were to leave with no deal, then yes, we could set our own tariffs to zero, which would mean that imports from the UK would not be more expensive, however, it would also mean every other country in the world could import to the UK with zero tariffs. This could be vary dangerous to our domestic producers who are currently competitive in price against other EU countries, but may be somewhat expensive compared to say China. This is the whole reason why tariffs exist in the first place, to protect domestic producers who otherwise could not compete against countries with cheaper labour costs and lower working standards.
The other side is we cannot control the import tariffs of other countries and in particular the EU. That means our exporters immediately become more expensive when exporting to other EU countries or countries with an EU trade deal or trade agreement. The EU currently has many trade deals and agreements in place and is advanced in negotiations of many more. You can see a list of all the EU agreements here!
So, under a no deal Brexit, our domestic producers are very likely to suffer against cheaper imports and also likely to suffer when exporting to any country which was previously covered by an EU trade agreement. Yes, we can then negotiate new trade deals and yes, some deals (likely the ones with smaller countries) will be quite quick, but generally trade deals take years of negotiations and the country with the biggest market will normally get the better deal. The EU as a single market is able to get trade deals which are largely to the advantage of the EU, but the UK on its own is not such a powerful player and would never get a trade deal with any of the big countries that would be better than the EU. A trade deal with the US for example would be largely to our disadvantage, meaning the US would gain more access to the UK market than the UK would gain of the US market.
17 September 2019, 04:14 PM
#5355
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<Waits for someone to appear and tell us we could be the biggest if we went alone...don't you know we used to rule the world.>
21 September 2019, 04:30 AM
#5357
Single market that enforces regularity and standards between each state- no longer described as countries. The free single market which as decimated economies of the southern (states) sorry countries whilst benefiting the stronger northern powerful eg Germany France. Further compounded by free movement- draining the decimated economic countries of youth so vitally needed to train and rebuild their own country.
Until - the federal takeover of each national identity is complete there will never be an EU model worth being part of.
Federal takeover will never be accepted by Germany- because Germany doesnt want to be absorbed, it just wants to sell its goods cheaply to other (states)- sorry countries
Germany is refusing to swallow the additional payments of the UK leaving.
The EU project is dying from within systematically by a rigid system run by a cash swallowing behemoth of an organisation called the EU
The EU market globally is shrinking year on year due to its rigid anti competitive structure against outside countries. Its also at the whim to the two power economic power houses China and USA. USA has a president currently who is rebalancing the global trade as he sees the USA being disadvantaged the EU tariff system. If Trump gets re elected he will turn his full attention on the EU to crush the EUs tariffs . Germany is already feeling the major effect of the tariff battle between china and the USA going into recession this quarter.
Until the EU opens up its markets to the world it will wither, but then again if it did expose lots of its states- sorry countries to the outside many would be destroyed by their low productivity levels.
The EU is dammed if it does and dammed if it doesn't
That's why we are leaving
Until - the federal takeover of each national identity is complete there will never be an EU model worth being part of.
Federal takeover will never be accepted by Germany- because Germany doesnt want to be absorbed, it just wants to sell its goods cheaply to other (states)- sorry countries
Germany is refusing to swallow the additional payments of the UK leaving.
The EU project is dying from within systematically by a rigid system run by a cash swallowing behemoth of an organisation called the EU
The EU market globally is shrinking year on year due to its rigid anti competitive structure against outside countries. Its also at the whim to the two power economic power houses China and USA. USA has a president currently who is rebalancing the global trade as he sees the USA being disadvantaged the EU tariff system. If Trump gets re elected he will turn his full attention on the EU to crush the EUs tariffs . Germany is already feeling the major effect of the tariff battle between china and the USA going into recession this quarter.
Until the EU opens up its markets to the world it will wither, but then again if it did expose lots of its states- sorry countries to the outside many would be destroyed by their low productivity levels.
The EU is dammed if it does and dammed if it doesn't
That's why we are leaving
Last edited by andy97; 21 September 2019 at 04:32 AM.
21 September 2019, 09:17 AM
#5358
Single market that enforces regularity and standards between each state- no longer described as countries. The free single market which as decimated economies of the southern (states) sorry countries whilst benefiting the stronger northern powerful eg Germany France. Further compounded by free movement- draining the decimated economic countries of youth so vitally needed to train and rebuild their own country.
Until - the federal takeover of each national identity is complete there will never be an EU model worth being part of.
Federal takeover will never be accepted by Germany- because Germany doesnt want to be absorbed, it just wants to sell its goods cheaply to other (states)- sorry countries
Germany is refusing to swallow the additional payments of the UK leaving.
The EU project is dying from within systematically by a rigid system run by a cash swallowing behemoth of an organisation called the EU
The EU market globally is shrinking year on year due to its rigid anti competitive structure against outside countries. Its also at the whim to the two power economic power houses China and USA. USA has a president currently who is rebalancing the global trade as he sees the USA being disadvantaged the EU tariff system. If Trump gets re elected he will turn his full attention on the EU to crush the EUs tariffs . Germany is already feeling the major effect of the tariff battle between china and the USA going into recession this quarter.
Until the EU opens up its markets to the world it will wither, but then again if it did expose lots of its states- sorry countries to the outside many would be destroyed by their low productivity levels.
The EU is dammed if it does and dammed if it doesn't
That's why we are leaving
Until - the federal takeover of each national identity is complete there will never be an EU model worth being part of.
Federal takeover will never be accepted by Germany- because Germany doesnt want to be absorbed, it just wants to sell its goods cheaply to other (states)- sorry countries
Germany is refusing to swallow the additional payments of the UK leaving.
The EU project is dying from within systematically by a rigid system run by a cash swallowing behemoth of an organisation called the EU
The EU market globally is shrinking year on year due to its rigid anti competitive structure against outside countries. Its also at the whim to the two power economic power houses China and USA. USA has a president currently who is rebalancing the global trade as he sees the USA being disadvantaged the EU tariff system. If Trump gets re elected he will turn his full attention on the EU to crush the EUs tariffs . Germany is already feeling the major effect of the tariff battle between china and the USA going into recession this quarter.
Until the EU opens up its markets to the world it will wither, but then again if it did expose lots of its states- sorry countries to the outside many would be destroyed by their low productivity levels.
The EU is dammed if it does and dammed if it doesn't
That's why we are leaving
21 September 2019, 08:54 PM
#5360
Single market that enforces regularity and standards between each state- no longer described as countries. The free single market which as decimated economies of the southern (states) sorry countries whilst benefiting the stronger northern powerful eg Germany France. Further compounded by free movement- draining the decimated economic countries of youth so vitally needed to train and rebuild their own country.
Until - the federal takeover of each national identity is complete there will never be an EU model worth being part of.
Federal takeover will never be accepted by Germany- because Germany doesnt want to be absorbed, it just wants to sell its goods cheaply to other (states)- sorry countries
Germany is refusing to swallow the additional payments of the UK leaving.
The EU project is dying from within systematically by a rigid system run by a cash swallowing behemoth of an organisation called the EU
The EU market globally is shrinking year on year due to its rigid anti competitive structure against outside countries. Its also at the whim to the two power economic power houses China and USA. USA has a president currently who is rebalancing the global trade as he sees the USA being disadvantaged the EU tariff system. If Trump gets re elected he will turn his full attention on the EU to crush the EUs tariffs . Germany is already feeling the major effect of the tariff battle between china and the USA going into recession this quarter.
Until the EU opens up its markets to the world it will wither, but then again if it did expose lots of its states- sorry countries to the outside many would be destroyed by their low productivity levels.
The EU is dammed if it does and dammed if it doesn't
That's why we are leaving
Until - the federal takeover of each national identity is complete there will never be an EU model worth being part of.
Federal takeover will never be accepted by Germany- because Germany doesnt want to be absorbed, it just wants to sell its goods cheaply to other (states)- sorry countries
Germany is refusing to swallow the additional payments of the UK leaving.
The EU project is dying from within systematically by a rigid system run by a cash swallowing behemoth of an organisation called the EU
The EU market globally is shrinking year on year due to its rigid anti competitive structure against outside countries. Its also at the whim to the two power economic power houses China and USA. USA has a president currently who is rebalancing the global trade as he sees the USA being disadvantaged the EU tariff system. If Trump gets re elected he will turn his full attention on the EU to crush the EUs tariffs . Germany is already feeling the major effect of the tariff battle between china and the USA going into recession this quarter.
Until the EU opens up its markets to the world it will wither, but then again if it did expose lots of its states- sorry countries to the outside many would be destroyed by their low productivity levels.
The EU is dammed if it does and dammed if it doesn't
That's why we are leaving
Pity they didn't put that on the side of a bus. Might have provoked some meaningful discussion instead of vacuous soundbites.
24 September 2019, 12:58 PM
#5369
Scooby Regular
If parliment is recalled then he could now kick it out again without legal challenge, so i doubt it will get recalled.
24 September 2019, 01:00 PM
#5370
Scooby Regular
only way he was gonna go was in a GE, and since the wackos over at labour wouldn't called one then things will just carry on