Felix.

Yes, because their rule of ".....Such enquiries shall not be made as a matter of routine...." will go.

dpb

To be replaced with what?

Felix.

Random checks of people coming into the country would be a start

Sad Weevil

iTrader: (1)

Pretty poor reason for leaving. Why not make improvements to the system?

Felix.

This was just one reason - and it answers a point brought up by an earlier post.

Yes, by all means make improvements to the system, but it hasn't happened so far.

trails

iTrader: (41)

Is there any reason that can’t be implemented now?

Felix.

Ask the EU. I would have thought it should have been implemented when it started. But, for some reason they didn't - and i would suggest what ever the reasons were, are still stopping the EU from changing the policy.

trails

iTrader: (41)

Sorry, poorly explained; I meant why don’t WE just do that anyway...Unless there is something preventing us doing so from a legal perspective?

Just seems a common sense approach, one we could have justified many time over...

Felix.

Because the EU says we can't

dpb

is that the real reason

or is it lack of manpower ??

Felix.

The EU rule says we can not do it, doesn't matter how many people you have to do it.

trails

iTrader: (41)

Is there context for that rule...or is it just an arbitrary statement? Just trying to understand why you would prohibit it...

BMWhere?

The problem in the UK is we have no registration system. Under EU rules, we cannot have a separate rules for EU citizens than for our own citizens. So because UK citizens are not required to register their residence, then neither do EU citizens.The result is, we simply don't know if an EU citizen entering the country is here on holiday or living here. The only thing we have to know if an EU citizen is resident in the UK is if they apply for a national insurance number, but then there is no requirement to say if you leave. The UK is one of the only EU countries not to have a registration scheme and without it, it is very difficult to perform any checks on people moving to the UK (EU or otherwise).

The systems are all in place in the EU in order to perform background checks EU members where reasonable grounds exists and checks against our own records are allways possible. Really, as with most problems in the UK, the problem lies less with EU rules and regulations, but with the UKs own unwillingness to implement a decent immigration, registration and ID card system. Its amazing that after years of promises on cutting immigration, we still haven't implemented a points based immigration scheme for non-EU migrants. If we can't already control the non-EU migrants entering the UK, there is no chance of things improving when we leave the EU.

Once again, the Brexiteers are trying to sell a Unicorn on immigration.

Who are you going to blame once we've left the EU and nothing improves on immigration?

Blaming the EU for all our problems is simply populist propaganda. Until we are willing to admit that most of our problems are of our own doing and nothing to do with EU membership, then we realy have no hope!

Felix.

Other countries don't either. My son didn't have to register when he went to Spain and my daughter didn't have to when she went to France.

You can not do routine checks on people entering the UK because the EU won't allow it.

Sad Weevil

iTrader: (1)

We can, and do.

BMWhere?

My sister lives in Spain and you do have to register if you live for more than 3 months a year in Spain! If you don't register in Spain (and many Brits don't know they have to), you are breaking the law and risk being refused residence! Without registering in Spain you cannot claim any benefits including state health care (you can only get emergency treatment on an EHIC card) and you cannot legally work and pay taxes.

Spain doesn't stringently police the system, but that is their choice, but they have the system in place and if they wanted to crack down on illegal EU immigrants they can!

trails

iTrader: (41)

You have been called out on both statements...I expected more from 5-0

dpb

Respect my authoritah

wtf would you

Felix.

I can enter Spain for a 2 week holiday and not have to register - correct?

Felix.

What routine background checks do we do on a person entering the country for a 2 week holiday say from Poland?

trails

iTrader: (41)

No idea...but surely there would be a flag on their passport if the individual is a threat...and again how would leaving the EU change this?

BMWhere?

What routine background checks do we do on a person entering the country for a 2 week holiday, say from USA?

Do we need to leave the EU because we're worried about some Polish people coming for two weeks holiday?

Everyone has to go through passport control! Everyone has to have given their passport details in advance of flying (even EU members and UK citizens)! There is every opportunity to check and stop undesirables entering the UK as everyone has to pass though passport control. If there are reasonable grounds for suspicion of an EU citizen, then we can request info from their home country - ok, maybe not for everyone (routine checks), but if the need is there, it is possible! For people coming from non-EU countries, there is no such system in place for requesting intelligence from their home country! We are more likely to get valuable intelligence from Poland than we are from Russia for example. If we leave the EU, then we loose that possibility and gain nothing!

In the end, we are responsible for our own security and should only rely on our own intelligence services and police to determine if someone should be allowed in or not and that can be done before anyone boards a plane in their country of departure EU or not! We have a passport control and we have the right to refuse any EU member entry if we have grounds for doing so!

If we don't have the staff to perform the checks, then that is our problem and nothing to do with EU membership!

I really don't understand what you think will improve in our border security by leaving the EU? Any weaknesses in our system are of our own doing and not as a result of freedom of movement! If we were in the Schengen zone with no border checks, then I could maybe accept that people freely crossing the border with no controls could be a security issue, but we're not in Schengen and everyone is checked!

dpb

Were apparently Now due 600 more border control personnel.....presumably check all those dodgy yanks cashing in on shot to hell pound

dpb

These people are dead set on destroying the place , why?

https://www.theparliamentaryreview.c...francois-warns

dpb

138m on no deal publicity campaign ...

how many nhs operations is that ?

Felix.

Previous convictions or intelligence do not go on their passports as flags. This can only be found by running a PNC (or equivalent) check on them - which the EU will not allow you to do as routine or random checks on EU members.

Felix.

The point is that we have EU member state populations (eg Polish, Romanians etc) who can enter the country saying they are here to visit family for 2 weeks, then disappear. And unless there are glaring issues that have come to light, they go unnoticed because we can't do any kind of random checks when they enter. It has nothing to do with their passports - its the PNC (or equivalent) checks that can not be done. If there is reasonable suspicion then we can check anyone - i'm talking about random checks on people coming in that would would flag intelligence up on their or our systems.

Non EU countries we will be able to check - as the rule only applies to EU members. And all the countries outside the EU I have had dealings with are always happy to help when they can

dpb

So it's different for uk citizens going into other EU countries is it

The Trooper 1815

iTrader: (31)

One and a quarter Pogba's.

Felix.

It will be the same as the rule will still apply