Tidgy

wouldn't pay 50k for one of them either,,,,,,

perhaps its just an image thing, don't get me wrong i can appreciate what it is, 360bhp awd bullet, which being german should be solid as a rock. Its just what else does 50k get you

urban

iTrader: (1)

Yeah, but thats a manual transmission

XDevil666

Dont worry about it, you would need to tax the car 62 years for that gap to break even over the 20k price gap

Matteeboy

But it totally kills it as a company car.

XDevil666

Yeah but that's a different equation and a different market.

depends on the company and how they let you select your company car.

for me i basically got given a budget and told it had to be a certain tax bracket and i could go out and pick one to buy.

another company i worked for they had deals with certain manufactures and i could select from only certain models.

Prob the business type who wanted a AMG as a company car wouldn't select the A45 as that car anyway, prob go for the C or S class

the A45 is like the Porsche boxster, the entry level

Matteeboy

But an S class is a luxobarge; totally different market. I reckon the A45 is low enough on emissions to be a company car contender. I view it as stop end hatch, not an entry level AMG; it's faster than almost all of them too (our M135i "beats" almost every AMG and M car around the TG track; the A45 is quicker).

Ours is 178g/km (more than the Merc, less than our old 1.3 Jimny!) so just a bit high on BIK tax to be a sensible proposition. The i8 is ideal though...

XDevil666

doing a quick comparison on costs the

a45 would be £492.60 for a 3 year term,with a upfront fee of 2,960.46

the 135 comes in at £323.16 over 3 years with an upfront fee of £1,938.96

the subaru sti comes in at £411 with a upfront of £2,469.72


all based on 10,000 pa

Carnut

I do find it funny how we talk about which one is the most sensible or cheapest to run. I try to add a bit of balance and like to point out that they all have there ups and downs which can change for each person depending on circumstances.

If you want sensible buy a focus, all these cars can be considered a complete waste of time and it's just comes down to which one gives you the biggest smile.

If I was to pay 40k for a a45 amg but didn't like it then that would be a complete waste of money. If I bought a 135 for similar money and it made me very happy then in my eyes its worth it.

A item for sale is worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

Matteeboy

The trouble is, not only is the Subaru too costly to run these days, it's also below par on performance. The A45 is so much more money it's not really worth comparing but look at it compared to the BMW:


I know there's now a newer version but is it really that much better than the older one?

I just think Subaru have lost it - a real shame as they invented the "hyper-hatch/small car" for the masses. My wife learned to drive in a (new at the time) N reg Turbo Wagon and we've been very close to buying a Forester XT and a WR1 on the past - they just haven't quite ticked all the boxes.

XDevil666

i really really get what your trying to say, but i think its too completely different markets, there are ALOT of cars with the same performance

stuff like the subaru and Type R will always stand as tuner cars, both you and i know that the subaru can be easily modded for under a grand and be quicker than the 135

its more how you feel behind the wheel, and how you feel when you walk away from the car.

personally i think the 135 is a girly car and me personally if i was driving it and anyone was in front of me, i would want to get in front of them to show im driving a M car, but that's not to say that the person next to me would think different, as you said above some cars just don't tick your boxes, the 135 performance is a tick in my box without a doubt, its the look i don't personally like

its all down to preference like mobile phones and game consoles fair enough massive cost difference, but so many different types that near enough the same thing

Matteeboy

Only a true die hard M135i fan would call it a really good looking car (with angel eye xenons on at the right angle it can look okay) but then a lot of Subarus have been shockers too - the blob eye is horrific, the current hatch is pretty dire and all have a pretty low rent interior - it's durable and works well but people want a bit more. While the M135i is no looker on the outside, it's a lovely place to sit inside (especially with red leather!).

But looks have never been a deal breaker to me - subtlety has always been the priority; hence searching for months for an SE 335d rather than an M Sport. And why we went for grey in the current car - it's "hides" the wheels (exclusive to the car and light grey), the twin rear pipes and the M135i only wing mirrors. You need to be quite a spotter to notice it's not a 120d M Sport!

The antithesis is the mk2 Focus RS - yes it IS quick but nowhere near as fast as 300bhp should make it; yet it has huge tailpipes, wings, vents, all sorts. It shouts too loudly.

We use the car a lot for meetings - the idea is to have something fun but fairly under the radar. In a recent meeting with some very wealthy clients with very nice motors, almost all they talked about was our M135i; a car for "those in the know" according to them (one has a brand new E63 AMG among loads of other kit and they have Porsches and all sorts).

I also had a proper (ahem) "race" with a new V8 Vantage - the cars are almost exactly matched on performance and the driver gave me a friendly toot of the horn and flash of his lights as I turned off; the fact it can hold it's head (or windscreen) high in such company is quite incredible. Such "fun" driving is hard to find but it's epic when it happens.

XDevil666

Can i ask you a question, you hate the blob eye and i imagine every other since, so thats like maybe 10 years of hate

why are you on a Subaru forum?

brand new vantage, aint they like 420 bhp? dude i think the guy was just playing on the motorway and im pretty sure any car around the 300bhp mark would be able to play with 420 but thats just play, fair enough the 135 is like a hamster thats just taken some cat nip, but james bond drives it for a reason

urban

iTrader: (1)

Handling is supposed to be a big difference, but top end power remains unchanged.

Matteeboy

You've just made yourself look rather silly.

A Vantage is MUCH heavier; the power to weight ratios are actually very similar. And with weight comes less agility. The 0-60 is actually quicker for the BM too and the 0-100 is almost the same. If there was such a thing as torque to weight ratio too (there isn't) then the BM would thrash the AM.

Or do you think a 300bhp Volvo S60R is quicker than a much less powerful Caterham R500 too?

Sorry but you've rather blown your credibility with that post.

XDevil666

Dude seriously you are ****ing loopy, your trying to justify to me that the M135 is the best car in the world, next you will comparing to a Veyron

on another note for the price you spent on your girly wagon you could have gone and bought a GTR which pretty much doubles eveything your car has, but im guessing next week you will come back and say "oh i raced a GTR on the motorway and he flashed me as i drove off in to the sunlight"

the guy in the aston martin prob through you were a hot little blonde number lol

Matteeboy

Now look at this link:

http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/top_gear_track.html

Now look at number 81 - The M135i.

Now look at number 102 - An AM Vantage V12 - much quicker than the V8.

Same driver, same track, over 1.5s slower.

Now look at all the other cars the "girly" M135i beats.

Now look at yourself in a mirror and wipe away those tears of anguish.

I do not pretend it's the fastest car BUT it IS very quick as I've just shown you. A vid I posted also shows 4.4 to 60 and 10.3 to 100 - that's VERY quick for any car.

So yes, it IS faster than cars that are SLOWER than it. Like the Vantage.

XDevil666

I will let you in to a secret, I haven't watched one of the videos you posted, why you ask? Because I really don't care it's a girls car!!!!!

It wouldn't be something I would ever buy or even think about buying

And stop comparing top gears lap times

Matteeboy

***troll scoring panel***

[0] [1] [0] [0]

Littleted

And it's now SOLD so maybe one of you bought it.....

Carnut

Where's f1_fan, their comparing a Aston Martin to a 135 over here

I keep saying this but I will have another go.

The 135i in the vid against the sti was on a dry track and had I good driver behind the wheel. If it was Joe bloggs on a wet road the tables could be turned.

The 135i is probably the better car if you weigh up the pros and cons of each car but some people use a different yard stick to others. If you have a big family and live in a cold part of the country and it snows then the 135i is crap.

With regards to the new sti it will probably make up to 2 second short fall anyway and is a lot cheaper to buy.

And lastly, the subaru with the exception of tax isn't more expensive to run and you could argue that any loss can be redeemed in the re sale.

Matteeboy

It's worse on fuel, emissions and tax. It costs about the same (we paid £29.5k for our £35.5k RRP car), will depreciate more heavily (I reckon), servicing is much more frequent and more expensive, it won't be happy on 95RON (mine is) so 5p more per litre of petrol.

It hasn't snowed here for almost three years...

The person that bought that A45 must be SO thick; he could have bought a riced up Impreza for a tenth of that; what WAS he thinking?

Carnut

I've said that the 135i/Merc are technically the better car but all I am saying is that different people have different needs.

Iam not convinced that the sti is so much worse on fuel going of what Littleted has said his car is doing. The emissions are not as good but your not exactly driving a eco friendly car so its just the tax. I dont pay car tax so for me its a none issue but as I say, they all have there ups and downs.

And let's not forget, it might not be subaru that offers the power upgrade, its Mangoletsi but it still means that you can save 3k and have a faster more practical car than the 135i that has exclusively that BMW no longer has.

ups and downs.

Matteeboy

A £500 JB4 gets another 40bhp out of ours and you can go further, a Birds LSD, decat, all sorts. Pretty much all that have been on a dyno have been 340ish bhp too.


I'm sure an STI is £30k?
On any long we get 30mpg or more; 350 miles to Folkestone at 90ish much of the way; 34.9, utterly hooning it across France and Germany; 30mpg. Astonishing really and lucky because the tank is rather small!

How is an STI more practical? Surely it's saloon only and therefore has a silly boot?

Another unexpected low cost is insurance; it's really cheap!

XDevil666

Lmao oh dear anyone that buys either of the 3 cars for the price that's going for shouldn't worry about tax and fuel, if you do then you should have reaccessed if you can afford the car.

And since when has the subaru ever been a track focused car? Isn't it aimed towards the rally industry?

and speaking of top gear laptimes can you not remember clarkson saying he will never get back in one after it spun out on him the rain?

And finally if you think your car is fast and better than Aston martins, Lamborghini etc I think you better go apply for a job down at the local bmw dealership so you can tell them they will beat the supercars!

Absolute donkey you are

XDevil666

Not really unexpected, they would expect either a female driver or a very camp/gay male to be driving it

Matteeboy

So are the lap times not right? What part of the M135i being faster than some serious metal do you not understand? Yes it may not be as desirable but it's still FASTER than many cars costing 2-4 times more.

Oh and look, the STI is three seconds and 40 places behind...

An M135i is also not a track car at all; it's quite soft. But the M3 CSL is; oh look, it's slower. How about the C63 coupe? Oh look, it's slower. The RS4? Yep, slower.

The spin? Try a 1/4 mile on a waterlogged airfield in any car and see what happens at 120. That was just for TV.

Sore sore loser.

Carnut

O.k the BMW 135i is the best car in the world and is much much better in every single possible way to the sti or any other car. In fact I would go as far as saying it should be recognised by the Queen for its high level of outstanding quality.

Iam trying to be open minded and fair but you won't give a inch, if you can't except that theres ups and downs then I can go no further.

Matteeboy

Okay, what have I said that isn't correct?

I've always admired the Impreza having been amazed at the one I drove in the late 90s and others since. I like the "proper" 4wd, I like the build quality (2.5 litre engine excepted), I like the fact they don't all have stupid massive wheels and daft tyres but... They have been left behind, largely by boring stuff like emissions and by being too late to the diesel party.

It's a shame and the latest STI does seem to be a big step forward but as someone who is possibly their target market (enthusiast, £30k budget, etc), it was never a consideration.

But stuff like the 22B,WR1, RB5 and P1 will always be very special cars in my eyes.

XDevil666

It doesn't state if all those times were in the dry or wet or very wet

But yes you have the fastest car ever

You should start a website and let me know you have the 81st fastest car in the world based on the top gear lap, **** knows why bmw bother with the M3, 5,6 etc because they are all slower around the track

XDevil666

Lol get your self booked in to one of those white coat holiday camps

I could have sworn you said the subaru have been aweful since the blob eye, yet you quote the WR1 and that your a subaru enthusiast but never once considered anything since your classic wagon.....

Yup very dedicated indeed