Gangsta Smurf

Has anybody else had issues with these destroying the standard Brembo STi discs.

Fitted the red-stuff ceramic pads two months back. Had no issues to start with but now and noticing that these are burning and scoring my discs when applied heavily.

Can anyone give advice to this as they've munched up two sets of front discs within two months.

Many thanks.

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

Stop using crappy pads. Problem solved

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

oh. and check to see whether the pistons are moving freely and not sticking

Buckrogers

We have sold many sets of DP31210C (100+), no one has ever reported an issue of this nature. (I am not implying anything by this, mearly stating facts.)
How many miles per disc set?
Pads fitted to new discs or part worn?
Road or / and track use?
Vibrations?
Calipers ok?

Buck

Buckrogers

Bob

Please refrain from talking out of your ****!

For your information:
Last w/e of July, I was at the Nurburgring, after not taking any of your advice regarding Yellowstuff, my car was fitted with the latest compound 1793 front and rear.

I suffered no fade what so ever.
I did 39 laps that w/e.
I estimate my best lap time to be around 9 minutes.
On circuit, there are at least 3 points where I was stopping hard from 120 / 130mph+, again no fade.
Approx wear is about 2 to 2.5mm.
Ring miles approx 530.
There and back 900.

Did you ever speak to EBC Technical?
Or are you just going to make continual slanderous posts regarding their products?

Buck

PS Sorry Gangsta for the thread hi-jack.

Gangsta Smurf

No need to apologise Buck.

Sounds like I might have a prob with my pistons sticking then. Best go get them checked out.

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

Buck,

Come on. We all know that EBC are just fancy budget products.

I havent got the time to mess around helping EBC with R&D which should have been done before it made it onto my car. I just drive cautiously now knowing to watch out after the 2nd/3rd high speed stop.

Now if you or EBC tell me its impossible for the compound to fade then I will take your word for it and put it down to the fluid, but if I flush the already fresh and uprated fluid for some new fluid following yours or EBCs advise I will be looking to have the wasted money refunded. If you're right then I retract anything I may have said about the yellow compound.

Its my fault really as I should have learnt from my 1st experience from the brand (EBC Ceramics).

I'm sure you'll understand its nothing personal. I just cant sit back and watch people waste money on products which I deeply believe to be of very poor quality.

Bob

Buckrogers

What did I tell you to refrain from doing?


I am not asking you to help with their R&D. I am suggesting you help yourself by phoning their technical support with the aim of resolving YOUR problem.

I am not telling you anything, but PHONE their technical support with the aim of resolving your problem. How many times do I have to suggest this? You said you was going to do this.

The same Ceramic pad that John Felstead gave a glowing report on and still recommends to others. JF being a well respected SN user / driver.
The same Yellowstuff which I used at Nurburgring, probably the most dangerous track in the world. I have no issues with recommending Yellowstuff for track use.

Thousands of others seem to disagree.

Buck

mgcvk

I had brand new ebc discs and red stuff pads fitted on 23rd May '05. The pads are already finished. Is this worth taking up with ebc??

ozzy

Yes.

1. Either the pad material is made of chocolate (as Bob has suggested in the past),
2. There are "manufacturing issues"
3. There's a mechanical problem with your setup such as sticking pistons, pads are binding in the calipers, ...
4. You've done loads of trackdays since you fitted the discs & pads or have generally ragged the t!ts off the car since fitting.

The pads need to be looked at to see if all 4 (assuming it's just the front) have worn evenly. If they have, then that rules out a lot of mechanical problems unless you're unlucky and have problems with all the pistons in your calipers.

Stefan

mgcvk

No trackdays, just general use, including some enthusiastic backroad driving about once week though nothing out of the ordinary for an impreza. The car is on the motorway a lot at unbusy times so not constantly braking all day.

I had braided hoses fitted at same time as pads and disks on 23rd May. Work was carried out at API and brakes checked. The pads are worn completely evenly on both sides of car. I know grooved and pitted disks will reduce lifespan of the pads, but I think three months is taking the pee.

APIDavid

iTrader: (4)

Let us have a look at that for you, it doesn't seem to be right that it has worn away so quickly. I use Red Stuff ceramic in my own cars and have no problems with it working hard and not fading.

I would expect to upgrade to Yellow for the 'ring though, as I do think under those circumstances red would not be up to it. Yellow'd fix it, no problem.

David APi Impreza / APi Engines
www.apiengines.com

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

You can 'tell' all you like, but are more likely to be ignored with that attitude

How can I possibly be helped by ringing the tech support? Are the brake fairies going to magically appear and do the work?

You dont have enough confidence to put the fade down to the fluid yet you are happy to recommend the pad for track use?

If I was confident with a product I sold I would just say, "its most certainly not the product and if you get the fluid changed I am 100% confident that it will resolve the situation"


Well there is certainly some issue with the EBC Red Ceramics. Either John had a different compound to many others or the report wasnt long term enough.
Do you want me to collate all the problem posts regarding EBC products?


Regards,

Bob

Gangsta Smurf

First set of discs had done 22k from new before they warped. So with this set I am not too concerned about how they went because the car has been driven hard and done three track days before the red stuff pads were put on. They discs lasted another 2000 miles with the redstuff ceramic pads.

The new set I put on had done virtually no miles. I ran them all in for 500miles and then they warped again. So this is why I'm asking the question about the pads. I am not implying they are rubbish pads because before the frist set of discs went I thought they were amazing! However am merely enquiring into whether anybody else has had a problem.

I can see that nobody else seems to be so I am led into thinking the standard discs are not good enough for these pads so will prob buy the EBC ones from your website now!

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

OE discs are fine.

Could be that the uneven pads resulted in the new discs warping.


Bob

Gangsta Smurf

That makes sense I guess. Cheers for the ideas Bob ... will prob just replace discs and pads again and start afresh from new everything.

mgcvk

As my red stuffs are nearly knackered and I don't want to currently spend lots of money, will a set of standard issue pads be OK with the EBC discs?

Buckrogers

This was "tongue in cheek", however, you are in my opinion, making potentially slanderous and libel comments regarding EBC products. Proceed as you will.

Why say you are going to phone them and then do not?
Why make a joke of this?
As with all things in life that you purchase, you have a problem go back to your supplier. They don't fix it take the problem to the manufacturer. Logical common sense really.



I WILL STATE AGAIN, I cannot advise you anymore on YOUR problem, I suggested that you contact EBC technical support. I have helped you and others to the best of my ability, people that have not even purchased from us. I am sorry if my knowledge does not meet your requirements.

I bow to your superior knowledge.

I merely state facts. I have used Yellowstuff on a high performance car at the Nurburgring. If I did not have confidence in them I would not have used them. If they failed on that track I might not be here now.




Perhaps you did not read the full report?
http://bbs.scoobynet.co.uk/showthrea...&page=16&pp=20 half way down. To highlight your "long term issue", JF did 6500 miles. Pads started at 12.5 mm and after 6500 miles were between 8mm and 9mm. The Ceramic compound has NOT changed since its release.

Collate all you want, perhaps don't and spend the time saved talking to EBC.
I have had enough, my head hurts.

Buckrogers

Should be fine. Just have a look and feel (when cold!) of the current discs. If the discs feel almost flat and appear "clean" no black markings, then no problems. If you can feel that there are ridges or bumps (difficult to describe!) in the disc, then the pad will take some time before it takes shape to the disc. Any signs of black markings should be cleaned off with some emery paper and a small amount of petrol as a lubricant.

Regards

Buck

Buckrogers

Standard Subaru discs will be of a high quality, just expensive. Standard EBC discs are also of a high quality but cheaper.
It does sound like the Ceramics have taken the shape / contours of the first set of discs and then after fitting new discs have caused problems as the pad was not a flat surface for the new discs.

It is recommended to fit new pads to new discs, never old pads to new discs because of these issues.

Regards

Buck

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

You seem to have sidestepped the questions somewhat.

Not much faith in the product?



Bob

Buckrogers

NURBURGRING, TRACK DRIVING, 500 MILES, 39 LAPS. You are right Bob, no faith.

Can you not read?

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

I'll say it again.....

"You dont have enough confidence to put the fade down to the fluid yet you are happy to recommend the pad for track use?

If I was confident with a product I sold I would just say, "its most certainly not the product and if you get the fluid changed I am 100% confident that it will resolve the situation"

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

Its my understanding that you sent a link to EBC technical back in June to help resolve the matter.

Havent heard anything?

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

Buck: Spoke to EBC tech. After a bit of chin scratching they reckon it may well be the rears causing fade and suggest using Yellow'R's on the rear too.

Now do I fork so more money out on EBC products in the hope that it resolves the matter? Or is throwing good money after bad?

Oh, and they could almost gaurantee it (about as good as no gaurantee).

Buckrogers

Can you not read?
"I WILL STATE AGAIN, I cannot advise you anymore on YOUR problem, I suggested that you contact EBC technical support. I have helped you and others to the best of my ability, people that have not even purchased from us. I am sorry if my knowledge does not meet your requirements."

If you cannot grasp this, there is no point in me replying to anything further.

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

Buck: Spoke to EBC tech. After a bit of chin scratching they reckon it may well be the rears causing fade and suggest using Yellow'R's on the rear too.

Now do I fork so more money out on EBC products in the hope that it resolves the matter? Or is throwing good money after bad?

Oh, and they could almost gaurantee it (about as good as no gaurantee).

Buckrogers

PRAISE THE LORD!!!!!!

Did it hurt?!

I just spoke to them, he seems "certain" that this should resolve your fade issue. Brake balance, possibly overheating rears, affecting ABS etc.

Up to you if you want to spend the money balancing the compounds that you have, in an ideal world you should always have F / R same compound, which ever make.

I have no issues recommending Yellowstuff for track use as I have physically used them myself. F / R Yellow 1793 compound. You may remember Nurburgring, etc, etc

Regards

Buck

Aztec Performance Ltd

iTrader: (234)

I never considered the rears being a problem as I didnt get any fade on the Ceramics and Pagids used in the past. The rears have always remained the same.

What may have changed is useage. Braking from 140/150mph down to 5/10mph and immediately accelerating to 140-150mph and back down again etc. This is where I am experiencing fade on my 3rd stop.

Not sure if I am convinced enough by what I've been told and the EBC brand. This may sort the problem, but there are no gaurantees. This may well resolve issues I have with the product (and possibly the EBC brand).

Alternatively I could bin the EBCs and buy some proven products such as the Pagids or Ferrodos all round which I know will work.

Bob

Buckrogers

So what are you going to do?

Effectivley you have had two front sets for the price of one, a set of rear yellow's is around £40.

Are you going to give them a chance or bin them and continue to slag them off?!

Buck

PS In relation to proven products, nothing is certain in life, expect death and the tax man!