Help STI7 Brake Fade/Failure
30 June 2002, 05:12 PM
#1
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When i brake hard into a corner with my foot on the pedal, if i go over a bump the brakes seem to fade off and not work, meaning i have to re-aply my foot to the break pedal as soon as possible, to avoid the oncoming bush! Can anyone tell me if this is normal and just something i have to get used too, or is there a problem with the brakes. The brakes in question are the standard brembos the sti7 comes with. I find this quite dangerous sometimes and want to know if its just me! As i said when barking and go over a bump they just seem to fade away, difficult to describe but can soome one tell me if its normal, Thankyou
30 June 2002, 05:58 PM
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Had the same problem on my MY01 and now also on my STi7, still the same also after upgrading the brakes. I think it's something you have to get used to.
simon
simon
30 June 2002, 06:06 PM
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Brake earlier 
No honestly, id see about changing your brake fluid to start with then going for the pads, as standard the cars have very good brakes and these small changes may get the response you need
Tony
No honestly, id see about changing your brake fluid to start with then going for the pads, as standard the cars have very good brakes and these small changes may get the response you need
Tony
30 June 2002, 07:50 PM
#7
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Never had this on either of our STi7's, but then I normally only brake in a straight line, not into a corner.
If it is happening into a corner, it may well be pad knock off, where the lateral movement of the wheel is forcing the pistons back into the calipers.
As said, the ABS can act funny sometimes. There is one particular junction I come up to every day, where the last 30 yards coming to a standstill is on a bend, plus the surface is uneven, and this nearly always kicks in the ABS. Cadence braking stops it.
BTW, did I mention ABS is crap?
[Edited by Dave T-S - 6/30/2002 7:53:58 PM]
If it is happening into a corner, it may well be pad knock off, where the lateral movement of the wheel is forcing the pistons back into the calipers.
As said, the ABS can act funny sometimes. There is one particular junction I come up to every day, where the last 30 yards coming to a standstill is on a bend, plus the surface is uneven, and this nearly always kicks in the ABS. Cadence braking stops it.
BTW, did I mention ABS is crap?
[Edited by Dave T-S - 6/30/2002 7:53:58 PM]
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30 June 2002, 10:58 PM
#8
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ABS is pants in a lot of situations. In Cambridge on Kings Hedges Rd travelling East, when you get to the CRC traffic lights the road surface is really worn. Braking here for the lights or to slow for the 30mph zone is very scary as ABS on both my nissan and the scoob have a paddy. Obviously you adjust your braking to do it earlier but if it happened on a road corner it could easily catch you out.
01 July 2002, 03:43 PM
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I can hear the pads clonking on my STi7 when rolling slowly forwards/backwards.
My old ScoobySport Brembos did the same too, is this related to pad knock off ?
Kinda sounds like the pads are rattling around.
My old ScoobySport Brembos did the same too, is this related to pad knock off ?
Kinda sounds like the pads are rattling around.
01 July 2002, 06:06 PM
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Big Goon
There has to be a bit of lateral room around the pads to allow for them to expand when hot. When you roll backwards and forwards this is the pads moving in this gap. Its completely normal.
Pad knock off is down to play in the wheel bearings.
The STi7 Brembos don't have any anti-knock off features and can suffer badly. Pad knock off occurs when you go through a series of bends after braking and when you next apply, the peddle travel is massive. You can get over it by pumping the brakes but it does more for your belief in god than it does for your confidence in the car.
There has to be a bit of lateral room around the pads to allow for them to expand when hot. When you roll backwards and forwards this is the pads moving in this gap. Its completely normal.
Pad knock off is down to play in the wheel bearings.
The STi7 Brembos don't have any anti-knock off features and can suffer badly. Pad knock off occurs when you go through a series of bends after braking and when you next apply, the peddle travel is massive. You can get over it by pumping the brakes but it does more for your belief in god than it does for your confidence in the car.
01 July 2002, 06:13 PM
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Thanks for the explanation, I suppose its easy to mistake brake fade for knock off then ?
Strange how such a well known manufacturer should have such a poor side effect when driven hard.
Strange how such a well known manufacturer should have such a poor side effect when driven hard.
How bad is pad knock off with the Brembo's then? Is it worth swaping for AP 6 pots?
02 July 2002, 08:58 AM
#14
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Keeping this in perspective, two STi7's, combined mileage 6500, daily route is rural 60 limit roads where no straight is longer than 100 yards and poorly surfaced bumpy roads, route driven hard - no pad knock off.......
03 July 2002, 03:45 PM
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Being a muppet and being able to put up with the warning light on!!! i pulled the ABS fuse.. I understand this may invalidate your warranty, but hey who likes ABS anyway, real drivers dont need it
i pulled the ABS fuse.. I understand this may invalidate your warranty, but hey who likes ABS anyway, real drivers dont need it
03 July 2002, 06:06 PM
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Dave
If you brake for every bend, you won't get any problems. The roads out your way are very "brake, turn, squirt" so maybe that's why you are OK so far. Also your cars have low mileage and the bearings will still tight. Its only when the brakes and hubs are hot and you go through an S bend or a series of bends that its at its worst. More weight, more grip, same tiny hub bearings.
Putting it in perspective, its a known problem. Ask your mate what his were like at Bedford.
Matt
I know that AP and KADs have anti knock off design, I think Alcons may do too. I drove a set of development KADs, pre A.K.O. technology and the problem was the similar, but not as bad, due to the alloy bell protecting the hub. All production KADs have the new design features.
No Brembo caliper that I know of has these features as Brembo are used to them being used on cars with much better hub design than the Subaru ones. eg Porsche, Ferrari etc. Its not really a problem with a 305mm disc, but a 330mm puts a lot more movement onto the pads.
It has nothing to do with bulkhead brackets either
If you brake for every bend, you won't get any problems. The roads out your way are very "brake, turn, squirt" so maybe that's why you are OK so far. Also your cars have low mileage and the bearings will still tight. Its only when the brakes and hubs are hot and you go through an S bend or a series of bends that its at its worst. More weight, more grip, same tiny hub bearings.
Putting it in perspective, its a known problem. Ask your mate what his were like at Bedford.
Matt
I know that AP and KADs have anti knock off design, I think Alcons may do too. I drove a set of development KADs, pre A.K.O. technology and the problem was the similar, but not as bad, due to the alloy bell protecting the hub. All production KADs have the new design features.
No Brembo caliper that I know of has these features as Brembo are used to them being used on cars with much better hub design than the Subaru ones. eg Porsche, Ferrari etc. Its not really a problem with a 305mm disc, but a 330mm puts a lot more movement onto the pads.
It has nothing to do with bulkhead brackets either
04 July 2002, 08:04 AM
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Pete.
I know, I was just answering the mans question 
I was going to say that I've never noticed pad knock off, at Bedford or anywhere else but then you went and said that AP's have anti-knock off design which would explain it because I was running AP's on my last Scoob.
Every time I decide to stick with the OE brakes on the STi 7, another reason pops up to get some more AP's
Matt
P.S. Got the STi last night so have a vested interest now....
It has nothing to do with bulkhead brackets either
I was going to say that I've never noticed pad knock off, at Bedford or anywhere else but then you went and said that AP's have anti-knock off design which would explain it because I was running AP's on my last Scoob.
Every time I decide to stick with the OE brakes on the STi 7, another reason pops up to get some more AP's
Matt
P.S. Got the STi last night so have a vested interest now....
04 July 2002, 08:45 AM
#22
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Matt
I know you know, the comment was Tony, who seems a bit lost on what does what in the brakes dept
I think this will be a hot topic in the future, once the cars have a few more miles on them and especially when people start using them on track.
I know you know, the comment was Tony, who seems a bit lost on what does what in the brakes dept
I think this will be a hot topic in the future, once the cars have a few more miles on them and especially when people start using them on track.
04 July 2002, 09:07 AM
#23
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Pete
We'll see what happens in the future with ours....as you say, it's mainly point and squirt roads in our area, and I don't brake in bends. BTW, who's "my mate" then?
We'll see what happens in the future with ours....as you say, it's mainly point and squirt roads in our area, and I don't brake in bends. BTW, who's "my mate" then?
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