Classic Strut Brace Questions
30 June 2006, 08:30 AM
#1
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Classic Strut Brace Questions
When (if) I get around to getting some new shocks for my MY99 WRX is there any reason not to install a strut brace at the same time?
I've been thinking of one for some time but did not want to change my suspension settings (Powerstation bump steer plus settings for "moderate" use) as they have been fine apart from the dreaded understeer in tight situations which brings me back to the strut brace!
Do strut braces need to be adjustable or are the top mounts in a fixed position with geometry adjustment carried out below?
Are they all similar in their ability to do a good job or are there good and bad ones?
Can anyone recommend a good one which does not cost the earth?
I've been thinking of one for some time but did not want to change my suspension settings (Powerstation bump steer plus settings for "moderate" use) as they have been fine apart from the dreaded understeer in tight situations which brings me back to the strut brace!
Do strut braces need to be adjustable or are the top mounts in a fixed position with geometry adjustment carried out below?
Are they all similar in their ability to do a good job or are there good and bad ones?
Can anyone recommend a good one which does not cost the earth?
30 June 2006, 09:55 AM
#2
An Sti carbon one goes for about £100 2nd hand and is the best looking one imo.
Fitting one wont alter your geometry. Takes 5mins, you just unbolt the 12mm nuts on the turrets and slip it over.
It's unlikely you'll notice any difference in the handling after fitting it.
If other than what you say, the rest of your suspension is standard then the next step would be solid anti-roll bar droplinks and a stiffened rear anti-roll bar. This will help a lot!
If you have any money left after that
there is an anti-lift kit which will improve turn in and reduce understeer out of corners.
Dave
Fitting one wont alter your geometry. Takes 5mins, you just unbolt the 12mm nuts on the turrets and slip it over.
It's unlikely you'll notice any difference in the handling after fitting it.
If other than what you say, the rest of your suspension is standard then the next step would be solid anti-roll bar droplinks and a stiffened rear anti-roll bar. This will help a lot!
If you have any money left after that
there is an anti-lift kit which will improve turn in and reduce understeer out of corners.Dave
02 July 2006, 06:24 PM
#4
Then it's easy. Get the cheapest one you can fit you your car (like me) or spend the money elsewhere. solid droplinks are probably the best increase for money. After that a 22mm rear anti-roll bar.
02 July 2006, 10:41 PM
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Originally Posted by RB5_245
An Sti carbon one goes for about £100 2nd hand and is the best looking one imo.
Fitting one wont alter your geometry. Takes 5mins, you just unbolt the 12mm nuts on the turrets and slip it over.
It's unlikely you'll notice any difference in the handling after fitting it.
If other than what you say, the rest of your suspension is standard then the next step would be solid anti-roll bar droplinks and a stiffened rear anti-roll bar. This will help a lot!
If you have any money left after that there is an anti-lift kit which will improve turn in and reduce understeer out of corners.
Dave
Fitting one wont alter your geometry. Takes 5mins, you just unbolt the 12mm nuts on the turrets and slip it over.
It's unlikely you'll notice any difference in the handling after fitting it.
If other than what you say, the rest of your suspension is standard then the next step would be solid anti-roll bar droplinks and a stiffened rear anti-roll bar. This will help a lot!
If you have any money left after that
there is an anti-lift kit which will improve turn in and reduce understeer out of corners.Dave
Thanks,Tim
02 July 2006, 11:54 PM
#7
depends on what you want to do with the arbs but, drop links then rear 22mm arb then alk. if your going to do both arbs then d,links alk then rear 24mm arb front 22mm.
Bumpsteer removal and camber bolts to add a little more -ve camber help. However if your handling is really poor are you still on 15" wheels? your springs and/or dampers are probably shot. despite scoobynet propoganda the impreza is a very well handling car to start with.
Dave
Bumpsteer removal and camber bolts to add a little more -ve camber help. However if your handling is really poor are you still on 15" wheels? your springs and/or dampers are probably shot. despite scoobynet propoganda the impreza is a very well handling car to start with.
Dave
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03 July 2006, 12:36 PM
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solid rear droplinks, 22mm adjustable rear ARB, anti lift kit and geometry set up will reduce understeer considerably.
A front strut brace is likely to increase understeer as it stiffens the front of the car.
A front strut brace is likely to increase understeer as it stiffens the front of the car.
03 July 2006, 12:47 PM
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Copied from Whiteline website:
Chassis and strut bracing - how does it work?
There are many different types of chassis braces, the most common being strut tower braces on the front or rear. Not all cars use actual struts though the term "strut brace" is still used to describe a brace between shock towers. For example Honda Civic, S2000, Nissan Skyline and Ford Falcons are sometimes fitted with a front upper shock brace but it does not have as direct an impact as bracing actual strut towers.
The reason is that a MacPherson Strut integrates the wheels upper link point into the actual strut. Hence a significant proportion of wheel load is located by and dealt with the strut. Vertical loads from the wheel pass through the strut and spring up to the strut top and towers which leads to flex in the sheet metal around the strut tower and inner guard. In fact, we've measured up to 15mm of flex on some cars which translates to up to 1 deg of dynamic camber change. Some vehicles will benefit more than others with age being a factor. But, even the newest vehicles have some rigidity problems due to the method of construction. Many new cars have the complete firewall and dash assembly lowered through the windscreen aperture then glued in place. This may actually be more rigid in some directions as claimed by the car makers but we know that fitting a strut tower brace on these vehicles makes a very noticeable difference.
Though not as noticeable or effective, shock tower braces on the cars mentioned above will make a difference. However the actual equivalent load point is usually an upper control arm and its locating points on the inner guard. Bracing these points is the preferred option and is what we have done with EF Falcons and our KSB510 kit. It braces the upper inner control arm mounts to the x-member via the engine mount points. We know it works well because we bent some 10mm bolts on the first prototype we fitted after taking 3 corners!
Whiteline range of chassis braces includes lower control arm braces, extra heavy-duty swaybar mounts and things like rear subframe lock kits.
But, apart from all the technical guff, they look really good!
Here are some comments from customers describing what they felt.
Sent: Wednesday, 9 May 2001 1:16 PM
To: Whiteline
Subject: WRX front lower braces
Have you seen the show on channel ten called 'Rove'?
Rove has a segment called: 'What the.......!' This rang in my mind when I left your workshop and rounded the next few corners!
I was expecting for the front end to be 'more stiff', but not to the extent being exhibited. Turn in is sharper. Powering out (even though I have the anti-lift kit) evokes far less understeer, less front end lift and resultantly less front wheel spin.
The lower control arm brace (KSB700) has made the single biggest impact for my mind on the cars feel. FLAT is all I can say! Feels as flat as my Apexi N1 Type R/S coil-overs did. Bravo, job well done Whiteline team.
The following is from Michael South, current (2001) NSW WRX Club Class 3 champion.
……. After many runs, adjusting my suspension to get the most from the little grip we had from a cold track and no sun and I was 3rd in class driving harder than ever before and not at the pointy end it was time to fit the under body strut brace, fitted and ready I found it has much sharper response to fast steering inputs, and yes it was faster on the stop watch by 2-3 tenths, this might not sound so much but at the pointy end it was a huge gain……
Are your strut braces adjustable, and if so how do you adjust them?
A strut tower brace is just an additional chassis brace that can be fitted by the owner to further increase chassis rigidity, specifically between the strut towers. It is not designed to pre-load their mounting points, but rather to simply provide extra strength when needed like during fast cornering.
Yes, our strut braces are adjustable, however this is purely for better fitment and to compensate for vehicle manufacturing tolerances. Significant variation between individual vehicles exist from new with age affecting dimensions even further on some cars. Either way, always fit and tighten the strut tower brace with the vehicle parked on level ground standing at normal ride height.
Chassis and strut bracing - how does it work?
There are many different types of chassis braces, the most common being strut tower braces on the front or rear. Not all cars use actual struts though the term "strut brace" is still used to describe a brace between shock towers. For example Honda Civic, S2000, Nissan Skyline and Ford Falcons are sometimes fitted with a front upper shock brace but it does not have as direct an impact as bracing actual strut towers.
The reason is that a MacPherson Strut integrates the wheels upper link point into the actual strut. Hence a significant proportion of wheel load is located by and dealt with the strut. Vertical loads from the wheel pass through the strut and spring up to the strut top and towers which leads to flex in the sheet metal around the strut tower and inner guard. In fact, we've measured up to 15mm of flex on some cars which translates to up to 1 deg of dynamic camber change. Some vehicles will benefit more than others with age being a factor. But, even the newest vehicles have some rigidity problems due to the method of construction. Many new cars have the complete firewall and dash assembly lowered through the windscreen aperture then glued in place. This may actually be more rigid in some directions as claimed by the car makers but we know that fitting a strut tower brace on these vehicles makes a very noticeable difference.
Though not as noticeable or effective, shock tower braces on the cars mentioned above will make a difference. However the actual equivalent load point is usually an upper control arm and its locating points on the inner guard. Bracing these points is the preferred option and is what we have done with EF Falcons and our KSB510 kit. It braces the upper inner control arm mounts to the x-member via the engine mount points. We know it works well because we bent some 10mm bolts on the first prototype we fitted after taking 3 corners!
Whiteline range of chassis braces includes lower control arm braces, extra heavy-duty swaybar mounts and things like rear subframe lock kits.
But, apart from all the technical guff, they look really good!
Here are some comments from customers describing what they felt.
Sent: Wednesday, 9 May 2001 1:16 PM
To: Whiteline
Subject: WRX front lower braces
Have you seen the show on channel ten called 'Rove'?
Rove has a segment called: 'What the.......!' This rang in my mind when I left your workshop and rounded the next few corners!
I was expecting for the front end to be 'more stiff', but not to the extent being exhibited. Turn in is sharper. Powering out (even though I have the anti-lift kit) evokes far less understeer, less front end lift and resultantly less front wheel spin.
The lower control arm brace (KSB700) has made the single biggest impact for my mind on the cars feel. FLAT is all I can say! Feels as flat as my Apexi N1 Type R/S coil-overs did. Bravo, job well done Whiteline team.
The following is from Michael South, current (2001) NSW WRX Club Class 3 champion.
……. After many runs, adjusting my suspension to get the most from the little grip we had from a cold track and no sun and I was 3rd in class driving harder than ever before and not at the pointy end it was time to fit the under body strut brace, fitted and ready I found it has much sharper response to fast steering inputs, and yes it was faster on the stop watch by 2-3 tenths, this might not sound so much but at the pointy end it was a huge gain……
Are your strut braces adjustable, and if so how do you adjust them?
A strut tower brace is just an additional chassis brace that can be fitted by the owner to further increase chassis rigidity, specifically between the strut towers. It is not designed to pre-load their mounting points, but rather to simply provide extra strength when needed like during fast cornering.
Yes, our strut braces are adjustable, however this is purely for better fitment and to compensate for vehicle manufacturing tolerances. Significant variation between individual vehicles exist from new with age affecting dimensions even further on some cars. Either way, always fit and tighten the strut tower brace with the vehicle parked on level ground standing at normal ride height.
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