JTaylor

Hello fellas.

Running Cusco Zero 2Rs at the moment on the RA. Absolutely perfect at Castle Coombe but too uncompromising (for me) on less then perfect tarmac. I do a lot of driving on and around Dartmoor and need a more compliant shock/spring combo.

So, decided to go for ASTs. The question is what spring rate would you suggest and does the damper adjustment allow for a suitably stiff track set-up?

Cheers

J

911

In my experience:

AST's on a classic Impreza: road /track =50/40 N/mm fr/rr rates.
Dampers set at 7 fr and 5 Rr from soft.

Track/road = 60/50 N/mm
Damping set at 11 Fr/8 Rr

Road onlt: 40/30.
No idea of damping settings.

Actually been there/done that
Graham

JTaylor

I partially wrote this with you in mind Graham, but wasn't expecting an instant answer .

So, 60/50 N/mm will be a reasonable road and track compromise (I won't be swapping springs).

Would the 11fr/8rr be a compromise damper setting or could you/would you suggest a setting for track and a setting for road? I appreciate it's a personal thing Graham but starting point are always helpful.

Fuzz

As Graham says for a compliant road setup then 40 front 30 rear with dampers at 5 front 4 rear sound about right. If you feel it's soft, it's not a big job go come back and set it up with the next step up.
Personal preference is hard to judge, if you say you've "got to think of the family" then err on the softer setup, things change when you mention going to Nurburgring though

Andy

911

60.50 is a good solid compromise biased to the track.
The dampers are nearly max'ed out on 60.50, but so good is the engineering, the damping is still very effectice (remember there are 12 positions to play with).

As you know, I am in a very fortunate position with the AST's, but they really are good.

Off to marshal at an Autotest today, then Germany till Wed so no responses till then.

Graham.

JTaylor

Thanks Graham and Fuzz.

Fuzz (or Graham when you return). Why not 50/40 spring rate and increase/decrease damper settings accordingly for road or track?

Cheers

J

Fuzz

No reason why you cant at all.

Andy

JTaylor

Can you point me in the direction of anyone with 50/40 Fuzz? It seems like the right compromise but it'd be good to get some feedback.

Powerstation

Just spoken to Curtis who recommends
40/30 for road
50/40 for track and road (with a road bias)
60/50 for track and road (with a track bias)
Going to try 80/70 for pure track car (ie mine. )

Andy

JTaylor

Nice one. 60/50 then

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

Hmmm, 40/30 hopeless at the Ring (although it is a step improvement over OE), not tried 50/40 yet there but have tried it at Bedford Autodrome recently; worked quite well with A032's but you must get the height right. Don't be tempted to go too low as it then all goes wrong IMO. Still a little too much roll for me so I'll need to look at a front a/r and the last hole on the 22mm adj.a/r on the rear. Tried low and high settings as well.

As for the road compliance, well 40/30 was OK but can be 'jiggly' on some UK surfaces. 50/40 is still 'jiggly' but at a different frequency. Young children won't like it. I find it OK. 40/30 just about coped with bumpy B roads while 50/40 is verging on losing composure so my advice is not to go higher if B roading it.

F

JTaylor

50/40 springs with Rear arb on 3rd setting for track then? Any advance.

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

It's good enough to murder all the RS chaps on track.

F

911

50/40 as you say is a nice rate.
If it suits then stick to it!
Graham

Carlos13

I have 50/40 and 22mm bar on middle hole I'm happy with it but would poss like a bit more movement at rear. Should I change to the next hole out?

Still quite a lot of roll at the front on standard bar, should I uprate, if so, what diameter?

In August the advice was to go 50/40 for track biased work. When did this advice change? I was never offered 60/50...

S.P.Developments

All part of the feed back from the AST/POWERSATION sales team, running 60/50 on mine with 22mm ARB on the front and 22mm ARB/ADJUSTABLE on the rear set at #3 (stiffest) this setup is no way in use daily/family friendly be warned..

John

Floyd

iTrader: (9)

Carlos, I was offered 60/40 ala Leda B spec but I thought it would not be suitable without revavling to match. I feel that the standard valvling is on the limit with 50/40. Go 22mm adjust at the front; I am.

F

ex-webby

For anybody that is interested I am about to do a fair bit of testing (as regards to spring rates etc) for the Newage, using the competition 3 way, remote resevoir struts...... but has already been pointed out, while a common package will suit most, it is down to personal preference.

Regards,
Shaun.

S.P.Developments

Will be interested in yours and 911(Grahams) findings, should give a good reflection of what to expect..

John

DuncanG

Only if you're also going for the 3-way. Just because the AST 1-way adjustables have an adjuster doesn't mean that they are 'fully' adjustable. The 3-way will allow charateristics to be dialed-up that could only be achieved in the 1-way by revalving. That will allow a wider selection of springs and a better adaptability to terrain.

Jay m A

iTrader: (2)

I'd just like to point out the different cars these advised rates are going on.

The difference in weight between a classic RA and a newage STi is at least 250kg, if more. So whats good for a newage on the road could be too stiff for a classic IYSWIM

My classic STI RA originally had 50/40 when purchased as a track setup, which IMO was too much for the 90% road / 10% track I do, so I now have 40/30 on with 22mm front adjustable ARB and 24 mm rear adjustable ARB.

On road the ARBs are softest front and middle rear, with 6 clicks upfront and 3 clicks rear.
Track stiffest ARB settings and 11 clicks front, 8 rear. I'm happy, but ideally for track I've got the 50 springs in the garage should the daily commute change

911

Jay makes a very valid point above.

My hill climb/road car had 50/40 to start with. Classic Sti v3 with 'New Age' 'road' springs, so stiffer due to lighter V3 weight.
The 50/40 is a very nice road rate IF you like a sports ride.

60/50 went on as an experiment (remember I am the AST trial car) to see what happened in MY situation.

I went faster on the track (the main aim) and more carefully on the road! (not bothered)

Pick and chose carefully, but it is not too big a trip to change the springs?

Graham

JTaylor

Quality advice in this thread - thanks chaps.

The RAs weighing in at 1230kg at the moment so I'm hoping 50/40 springs, suitable damper rates and chopping the rear ARB between 2nd and 3rd setting will be a nice compromise. As Graham says, it's going to be a case of suck it and see and it's only a couple of hours to PS from Plymouth should I want harder or softer springs. A mate has ramps which is helpful.

Frankly, I'm so used to the Cuscos now that anything more compliant will be fine. It's not so much about ride comfort (I use the GFs Fiesta for day to day stuff), it's more about the RA remaining composed on rough tarmac. My UK car was much more fun to hussle across Dartmoor but wollowy on track and the RAs the exact opposite.

My only concern is that going half way will leave the RA being a jack of all trades and master of none. Too compromised perhaps.

Oh for a Ferrari-esque steering wheel with prefered settings at the flick of a switch.

novarally

Graham as you know I have the AST on my car with 50/40 and I was wondering do the 60/50 give better road holding again.I know the ride will be stiffer but I dont mind that I just want even better road holding

JTaylor

On a classic?

novarally

Yes 1994 wrx

JTaylor

What's your assessment of 50/40s then? I appreciate you want to go stiffer, but how did you find these overall? Chassis spec would help.

Thanks NR

911

Towards the end of last season's hill climbing I ran 60/50 on my Sti v3, and went faster on a hill climb (very like a tarmac stage, but shorter).
Bounding down a b raod with pedal-to-the-metal gives quite a fight of traction and wheel lift (not forgetting the uprated roll bars).

I actually like this kind of ride (407 bhp) and all on road legal slicks.
On a hill climb there is nothing loose about the chassis, just pure grip for about 90% of the time.

When tweeking things this far you really have to be sure what you want from the car, and what you are willing to give up!

I wish I could take you all for a ride on 60/50's on a decent a/b raod surface in this car, the composure would surprise you.
Reading about it is very good, but the experience is everything.

Experiment!

Graham


Note no understeer anywhere, it is fresh rain on the hill climb and was very slippy.
60/50 springs.
http://www.dropshots.com/day.php?use...2&ctime=123828
http://www.dropshots.com/daymainfram...0030102&cimg=3

Carlos13

Graham I notice a complete lack of roll on those vids. Mine is ok at the back, still rolling at the front. Which ARBs do you have and on which holes?

911

Yes: No roll oversteer, no understeer. It is a great chassis!

The car has whiteline 22 mm bars front and rear with the rear on middle hole no matter what the spring rates are/have been.

Note both bars are 22mm.
Many say this is not needed, but Whiteline themselves told me to do it 3 years ago, and look at the results!

Those wet runs got me 1st in Class on raceday, the whole objective of the car.
I should add that the chassis is modified in many other ways, and the parts all seem to work well together, inc tyres and their pressures.

Graham.