darkblueturbo

while I'm totally happy with the alarm that comes as standard on my 2000 UK Turbo, I like a couple of things my friend can do with his clifford concept fitted celica.

1. Start and stop the engine remotely! (i LOVE this!)
2. turbo timer (haven't got one yet)

Can I have a clifford concept fitted to enable me to do this, while keeping the factory fitted alarm, or do I have to replace the whole thing?

darms

iTrader: (5)

Mate get rid of the standard MY00 Alarm. Its easy to get pass.

Protect your pride a joy.

Get a Clifford (but make sure its fitted by someone who knows what they are doing, there's a lot of cowboys out there)

Fatman

Remember that if you do get the remote start then the alarm will no longer qualify for Thatcham Cat-1 status.

darkblueturbo

guess i won't go for the remote start then if I lose my cat 1. Don't need the insurance to go up anymore!

cheers guys

Fatman

Yeah - a shame that. I was looking forward to doing exactly the same thing (Concept + remote start). I spoke to Thatcham about this and they're adamant that adding either the anti-hijacking or remote start features would null the Cat-1 status.

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

So your saying adding black jax nulls the cat1 rating? how can this be as it is bloody excellent! just had a demo of it this lunch time, with a view to buying!

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

The only reason that the anti hijack probably doesnt make cat 1 status is that they havnt tested it
Its an excellent bit of kit otherwise

Tony

darkblueturbo

if Thatcham don't like the auto-start, presumably cos the engine's running with no one in the car, does having a Turbo Timer fitted also kill your Thatcham cat 1 approved??

Fatman

Yes - any additional equipment on the Concept would null the Cat-1 status. You're right, Tony, they've not tested it and it looks like they won't either. Perhaps the best way to explain would be some cut'n'paste action from my mails to/from Thatcham...

Mail 1
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"...
Dear Mr...

For you information any "add-on" sensor that has the ability to change the state of the immobiliser or cause an alarm condition ie:- remote start, anti-hijack, glass break etc would require testing. However the likes of remote start and jacking would not meet the British Insurance Industry's Criteria for vehicle security and if added to an approved system would invalidate it's a approval.
I hope this clarifies this issue.
Regards

(name removed)
Project Engineer - Vehicle Electronics
..."

Mail 2
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"...
Dear Mr...

As my previous e-mail Thatcham's view is that such additional features can jeopardise the security and safety of a vehicle. The anti-hijacking and remote start do fall within these safety concerns and for that reason Thatcham would not test them. The products haven't failed in any way there is no criteria to which they are tested.
Regards
(name removed)
..."


Turbo timers might also fall foul of some local authority rules about vehicles running engines whilst unattended, but... eh!

I guess it makes sense to stick with a Cat-1 system. However, some Insurance firms don't care. I use Bell, and all they want to know is whether the car has an alarm or not. They don't even care what alarm/immobiliser it is. Others are far more demanding. Anyway, hope this helps clear things up for y'all.

ZAZ

Doesn't the Concept 500 come with Blackjax as part of it?! If so it's not an add-on so the alarm will still be approved!

If Blackjax is added as a stand alone system it is not related to the approved alarm you already have fitted isn't an add-on so once again shouldn't be a problem! Am I right?!

Fatman

Yes, this page http://www.clifford.co.uk/html/system_selector.html does suggest it's fitted to the Concept 500 as standard. To be honest, I don't know, m8! Suggest you ask the Thatcham people: sales@thatcham.org.

darkblueturbo

the concept 500 is thatcham cat 1, according to their website.

I can't see why thatcham would NOT approve an alarm with something like blackjax added onto it as it's EXTRA securty. The can't driv off in your car if they hi-jack it, right!! So one less car theft to pay out for the insurance.

Turbo timers and auto-start: I can see why they won't approve as if someone gets past the alarm they don't have to worry about starting the engine and bypassing immobilisers.

I guess I'll just have to turn the key to start and sit still for a couple of minutes at the end of the day