Speed camera vans.....
24 May 2012, 09:58 AM
#1
Speed camera vans.....
Grrr, just had a NIP through the post. 35 in a 30 zone. Fair dos I say, however look at the ****ty way they're catching us........
Taken from the FAQ sheet that came with the NIP
Q This is all about raising money
All fines received go back to the Treasury. The Partnership including the Police do not receive any money from the fines
Whilst the above maybe true they have targets to meet and would go someway to explaining the position of the camera van, slap bang on the change over from a NSL (60mph) road to a 30mph zone.
A google photo of the positioning in question
The arrow shows my direction of travel, the X is where the camera van was sited and the sign ringed is the 30mph sign after a 60mph NSL road
If thats not positioning the van to up the prosecutions then I don't know what is.............
Theres not even any residential buildings for at least another 1/2 a mile!
Now I remember quite clearly this day and I remember slowing down for this van and I suspect they may have clocked me before I entered the 30 zone and I will be asking for photographic evidence. If I have been clocked in the 30 zone (bear in mind I will have been slowing down at the time of being clocked) then I'll hold my hands up and admit I'm in the wrong and hope I get offered the speed awareness course instead of points!
I wouldn't mind so much if I was in my Impreza
but I was in my dead slow and stop 206 Derv!!
Typically the motorist is the easy target.
*rant over*
Taken from the FAQ sheet that came with the NIP
Q This is all about raising money
All fines received go back to the Treasury. The Partnership including the Police do not receive any money from the fines
Whilst the above maybe true they have targets to meet and would go someway to explaining the position of the camera van, slap bang on the change over from a NSL (60mph) road to a 30mph zone.
A google photo of the positioning in question
The arrow shows my direction of travel, the X is where the camera van was sited and the sign ringed is the 30mph sign after a 60mph NSL road
If thats not positioning the van to up the prosecutions then I don't know what is.............
Theres not even any residential buildings for at least another 1/2 a mile!
Now I remember quite clearly this day and I remember slowing down for this van and I suspect they may have clocked me before I entered the 30 zone and I will be asking for photographic evidence. If I have been clocked in the 30 zone (bear in mind I will have been slowing down at the time of being clocked) then I'll hold my hands up and admit I'm in the wrong and hope I get offered the speed awareness course instead of points!
I wouldn't mind so much if I was in my Impreza
but I was in my dead slow and stop 206 Derv!!Typically the motorist is the easy target.
*rant over*
24 May 2012, 10:11 AM
#2
They do this in colchester, There is a dual carriageway that finishes and enters a village so goes from 70-30mph and they always sit at the entrance to the village gun pointing up the dual carriageway.
Good luck but most of the time you just have to take the ticket.
Good luck but most of the time you just have to take the ticket.
24 May 2012, 10:20 AM
#3
Cheers.
It all depends on which way the camera was pointing. If its at the front of my car I was still in the 60 limit. If it was the rear of my car then it could be touch and go! Thats why I want a photograph before pleading guilty!
It all depends on which way the camera was pointing. If its at the front of my car I was still in the 60 limit. If it was the rear of my car then it could be touch and go! Thats why I want a photograph before pleading guilty!
24 May 2012, 01:18 PM
#5
Yeah I completely agree, however the sign is round a corner so its obscured until you're on top of it. Thats why they park the van there.
Bear in mind its a 60mph road with no prior warning of the impending 30 limit!
Poor signposting imo. This is the first you can see of it if your as high as the google camera. The reality is, at normal car height, its slightly further round the corner before you see it!. The place sign and the corner obscure it before that point. I've highlighted the sign in the pic.....
Bear in mind its a 60mph road with no prior warning of the impending 30 limit!
Poor signposting imo. This is the first you can see of it if your as high as the google camera. The reality is, at normal car height, its slightly further round the corner before you see it!. The place sign and the corner obscure it before that point. I've highlighted the sign in the pic.....
Last edited by BLU; 24 May 2012 at 01:19 PM.
24 May 2012, 01:34 PM
#7
Take whatever they offer you.
They WILL chase you to the ends of the earth for it, and if it goes to court, you get MORE points, a BIGGER fine plus costs and a "victim surcharge" against you
Trust me, I tried it, Pepipo too.
Magistrates just ignored everything I said and went ahead.
They WILL chase you to the ends of the earth for it, and if it goes to court, you get MORE points, a BIGGER fine plus costs and a "victim surcharge" against you
Trust me, I tried it, Pepipo too.
Magistrates just ignored everything I said and went ahead.
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24 May 2012, 01:47 PM
#8
Take whatever they offer you.
They WILL chase you to the ends of the earth for it, and if it goes to court, you get MORE points, a BIGGER fine plus costs and a "victim surcharge" against you
Trust me, I tried it, Pepipo too.
Magistrates just ignored everything I said and went ahead.
They WILL chase you to the ends of the earth for it, and if it goes to court, you get MORE points, a BIGGER fine plus costs and a "victim surcharge" against you
Trust me, I tried it, Pepipo too.
Magistrates just ignored everything I said and went ahead.
I have no problem accepting it if I was doing that speed, however I don't think I was. I am convinced they got me on the way in which is still NSL, I'm gonna fight it just on principle.........
24 May 2012, 03:15 PM
#10
Ask for photographic proof, who was operating the gun, serial number, calibration certificate etc.
Also, worth checking legislation and good practice for signage. Don't they usually have signs warning you prior to entering a 30mph zone from a national speed limit?
Motorists are any easy cash cow, but only because the vast majority don't challenge any fines. If even half the people fined were to challenge it the system would fall apart.
Best of luck with it.
Also, worth checking legislation and good practice for signage. Don't they usually have signs warning you prior to entering a 30mph zone from a national speed limit?
Motorists are any easy cash cow, but only because the vast majority don't challenge any fines. If even half the people fined were to challenge it the system would fall apart.
Best of luck with it.
24 May 2012, 03:49 PM
#14
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BLU – where is this?
I see you are in North Wales, me too, there was an article in the last month or so in one of the local papers where a woman was sent a speeding fine from the “North Wales partnership” after passing the fixed camera in Towyn.
She knew she want speeding and asked for the photographic proof. When the partnership looked into the evidence second time round it turned out to be a van going in the opposite direction that set the camera off!!
I know anyone can have a lapse of concentration, but it does seem odd in your case that you remember passing the van, slowing down, then entering the 30 and still got nabbed!
Best of luck with it
I see you are in North Wales, me too, there was an article in the last month or so in one of the local papers where a woman was sent a speeding fine from the “North Wales partnership” after passing the fixed camera in Towyn.
She knew she want speeding and asked for the photographic proof. When the partnership looked into the evidence second time round it turned out to be a van going in the opposite direction that set the camera off!!
I know anyone can have a lapse of concentration, but it does seem odd in your case that you remember passing the van, slowing down, then entering the 30 and still got nabbed!
Best of luck with it
24 May 2012, 04:13 PM
#15
I remember it quite well, I was tempted to warn motorists coming the other way but I didn't
I'm still convinced they got me on the NSL part. Only a photo will clarify it though.....
24 May 2012, 04:39 PM
#16
24 May 2012, 05:10 PM
#20
All I can say is: best of luck.
I've seen people win, on here and Pepipoo, but not as many as challenge it.
BOB's assertion that "if even half the people who are caught, challenge it, the system would fall apart", amuses me.
I wish.
I challenged it and got done for an EXTRA £40 in fines, £150 costs, (and that was GOING to be £300!!!), and if it had been now, I would have had to pay the £15 "victim surcharge too".
AND I got FOUR points instead of three
So, all in all, THEY had an extra £190 out of me for ten minutes in court!.
Easy money? You bet.
Challenge it IF you can, by all means, but unless your case is ROCK SOLID and I mean GRANITE solid, prepare to be reamed. They don't like people challenging, and make you pay for it.
In my case, I could have proved in court that ONE of the people called against me told a lie on his statement. I asked for HIM to be called. The prosecution witnesses all turned up. My guy didn't.
And when I complained, the mags said, "Hard luck!"
So I paid for THEIR three witnesses when mine didn't turn up.
And their is no appeal unless you go to crown court, and if you do, I hope you have lots of cash to waste.
Yep, easy targets, motorists.
I've seen people win, on here and Pepipoo, but not as many as challenge it.
BOB's assertion that "if even half the people who are caught, challenge it, the system would fall apart", amuses me.
I wish.
I challenged it and got done for an EXTRA £40 in fines, £150 costs, (and that was GOING to be £300!!!), and if it had been now, I would have had to pay the £15 "victim surcharge too".
AND I got FOUR points instead of three
So, all in all, THEY had an extra £190 out of me for ten minutes in court!.
Easy money? You bet.
Challenge it IF you can, by all means, but unless your case is ROCK SOLID and I mean GRANITE solid, prepare to be reamed. They don't like people challenging, and make you pay for it.
In my case, I could have proved in court that ONE of the people called against me told a lie on his statement. I asked for HIM to be called. The prosecution witnesses all turned up. My guy didn't.
And when I complained, the mags said, "Hard luck!"
So I paid for THEIR three witnesses when mine didn't turn up.
And their is no appeal unless you go to crown court, and if you do, I hope you have lots of cash to waste.
Yep, easy targets, motorists.
24 May 2012, 05:14 PM
#21
Nonsense.
They send you the pic. Youi either own up, or shop someone else.
If you DON'T it's a £1000 fine.
Unless you can PROVE you don't know who was driving. And how DO you prove it? VERY difficult, unless LOADS of folk can drive the car, and even then, you are SUPPOSED, BY LAW, to keep a record
Let's face it, the UK government wanted this law so much, they got the ECHR to give a WEIRD verdict when EVERYONE said they COULDN'T POSSIBLY win.
They did.
24 May 2012, 05:21 PM
#22
They also pull out the highway code out and say crap like when you see street lighting u should assume u are nearing a residential area or a junction. The signage my not even play a part in your appeal. Definatly ask the question though , i just got off with a parking ticket after appealing , they didnt have pics for evidence !
24 May 2012, 05:23 PM
#23
^^^^^ This^^^^^
Nonsense.
They send you the pic. Youi either own up, or shop someone else.
If you DON'T it's a £1000 fine.
Unless you can PROVE you don't know who was driving. And how DO you prove it? VERY difficult, unless LOADS of folk can drive the car, and even then, you are SUPPOSED, BY LAW, to keep a record
Let's face it, the UK government wanted this law so much, they got the ECHR to give a WEIRD verdict when EVERYONE said they COULDN'T POSSIBLY win.
They did.
Nonsense.
They send you the pic. Youi either own up, or shop someone else.
If you DON'T it's a £1000 fine.
Unless you can PROVE you don't know who was driving. And how DO you prove it? VERY difficult, unless LOADS of folk can drive the car, and even then, you are SUPPOSED, BY LAW, to keep a record
Let's face it, the UK government wanted this law so much, they got the ECHR to give a WEIRD verdict when EVERYONE said they COULDN'T POSSIBLY win.
They did.
24 May 2012, 05:27 PM
#25
They also pull out the highway code out and say crap like when you see street lighting u should assume u are nearing a residential area or a junction. The signage my not even play a part in your appeal. Definatly ask the question though , i just got off with a parking ticket after appealing , they didnt have pics for evidence !
The law for road signs is crystal clear;
In my case the minimum clear visibility distance for terminal sign (other than entering a side road) going from 60mph to 30mph is 115m.
The minimum clear visibility distance indicated should be provided for both terminal signs
So I think I may have quite a strong case........
Last edited by BLU; 24 May 2012 at 05:30 PM.
24 May 2012, 05:31 PM
#27
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if i remember, you can buy info from ebay for a pound.
A clear camera sign must be 60 or 100 metres before the camera, not just on the camera van. the van must be clearly seen at all times. Also the camera must have been calibrated for use for that day. There are loads of ways out of it, but as mentioned above, is it worth it?
A clear camera sign must be 60 or 100 metres before the camera, not just on the camera van. the van must be clearly seen at all times. Also the camera must have been calibrated for use for that day. There are loads of ways out of it, but as mentioned above, is it worth it?
24 May 2012, 05:32 PM
#28
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My advice is to take it on the chin,I was done for doing 49 in a 40 and was offered a speed awareness course which i attended and cost £90,but no points added to my licence.Put it down to experience and be ready for them next time.
24 May 2012, 05:35 PM
#29
Why? I genuinely don't think I was speeding, and if I was it was for literally 10 yards into the 30 zone as I was off throttle completely........ the underhand positioning of the van makes me want to fight my corner even more
Plus if the signs are wrong it'll give em a chance to put them right!
Plus if the signs are wrong it'll give em a chance to put them right!
24 May 2012, 05:40 PM
#30
^^^^^ This^^^^^
Nonsense.
They send you the pic. Youi either own up, or shop someone else.
If you DON'T it's a £1000 fine.
Unless you can PROVE you don't know who was driving. And how DO you prove it? VERY difficult, unless LOADS of folk can drive the car, and even then, you are SUPPOSED, BY LAW, to keep a record
Let's face it, the UK government wanted this law so much, they got the ECHR to give a WEIRD verdict when EVERYONE said they COULDN'T POSSIBLY win.
They did.
Nonsense.
They send you the pic. Youi either own up, or shop someone else.
If you DON'T it's a £1000 fine.
Unless you can PROVE you don't know who was driving. And how DO you prove it? VERY difficult, unless LOADS of folk can drive the car, and even then, you are SUPPOSED, BY LAW, to keep a record
Let's face it, the UK government wanted this law so much, they got the ECHR to give a WEIRD verdict when EVERYONE said they COULDN'T POSSIBLY win.
They did.
If the driver was sharing the driving with his partner and can't remember who was driving as he says, then that in my experience can be enough for them to drop it.
Last edited by Aztec Performance Ltd; 24 May 2012 at 05:47 PM.