Performance Diesels ????
22 July 2011, 05:36 PM
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Performance Diesels ????
A few of my mates have recently bought 'newish' diesels. One, who has a Honda Civic 2.2 says, 'fastest car I've ever owned', and another with a BMW 123d says, 'like s**t off a shovel'. I've never driven one but my big chance came today when my Sti went in for its first service. The dealer gave me a Saab 93 td150 as a courtesy car. Well, what a disappointment, all this low down torque supposedly giving excellent over-taking capability was nothing more than a gentle push in the back. If that's an example of a 'performance diesel' then you can keep 'em for me.
Last edited by paulbu; 22 July 2011 at 06:06 PM.
22 July 2011, 05:56 PM
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I agree mate, I hate diesels I was behind a guy yesterday in a tdi vauxhall vectra he was blasting off in and out of the traffic and his car kept putting out black smoke, he thought he was king of the road pah! I wish I was in my sti instead of the 1.2 polo I was driving, i'd of shown him, pesky diesels 
Last edited by wr pete; 22 July 2011 at 05:57 PM.
22 July 2011, 06:03 PM
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A mate of mine has a BMW 123d and I have to say it's a very nice car. More than quick enough for day to day driving with significant torque. Add to that comfortable interior, 40mpg and strong residuals and its a wise buy IMO however depends what you want, does it give the excitement of a turbo powered petrol engine? No. Will I be keeping my Scoob? Yes
22 July 2011, 06:33 PM
#4
I have the astra sri 1.9cdti 150 bhp. Its ok but not much fun. black smoke all the time when ya put foot down 
. A boring drive really compared to a petrol car.The only benefit is 55mpg which i why i suppose there popular. Not a patch on the sccob.
. A boring drive really compared to a petrol car.The only benefit is 55mpg which i why i suppose there popular. Not a patch on the sccob.
22 July 2011, 06:45 PM
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I knew someone would bring up the bmw 335d tell you what nearly had my sti once an Audi q7 4.0 tdi god dam it was fast I was in shock it was wet at the time and he caught me of guard but for a big 4x4 it was a beast, the guy had a big grin on his face so it could of been modified.
tell you what nearly had my sti once an Audi q7 4.0 tdi god dam it was fast I was in shock it was wet at the time and he caught me of guard but for a big 4x4 it was a beast, the guy had a big grin on his face so it could of been modified.
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22 July 2011, 06:52 PM
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a 335d remapped is epic on a different level imo
amazingly fast and pulls like a train as does the 135d
the big names bmw merc jag audi etc etc there engine all have big power but again if i had 50+ k to spend then i would expect a well defined fast diesel engine !!!!
amazingly fast and pulls like a train as does the 135d
the big names bmw merc jag audi etc etc there engine all have big power but again if i had 50+ k to spend then i would expect a well defined fast diesel engine !!!!
22 July 2011, 08:28 PM
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22 July 2011, 08:51 PM
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German diesels are fine and dandy ... but, for pure value for money pulling power - the Honda 2.2 Diesel is without equal.
Match it to a nice looking Civic 3 door and you've got something which delivers in all areas for a fraction of the silly money the Germans want!
OH, yes, it's fully loaded too ... within the price quoted ... no options wanted or needed.
And it pulls like a train .... overtaking performance is mind bending, stomach churning and shocking.
I was a Diesel hater until I discovered this gem of an engine/car combination .... throw in 55 mpg and 340 Nm of torque and you would be mad not to!!
No DPF either
Honda Civic Type S GT 2.2d .... the thinking mans performance car for the 2010's onwards.
Match it to a nice looking Civic 3 door and you've got something which delivers in all areas for a fraction of the silly money the Germans want!
OH, yes, it's fully loaded too ... within the price quoted ... no options wanted or needed.
And it pulls like a train .... overtaking performance is mind bending, stomach churning and shocking.
I was a Diesel hater until I discovered this gem of an engine/car combination .... throw in 55 mpg and 340 Nm of torque and you would be mad not to!!
No DPF either
Honda Civic Type S GT 2.2d .... the thinking mans performance car for the 2010's onwards.
Last edited by pslewis; 22 July 2011 at 08:52 PM.
22 July 2011, 08:59 PM
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A few of my mates have recently bought 'newish' diesels. One, who has a Honda Civic 2.2 says, 'fastest car I've ever owned', and another with a BMW 123d says, 'like s**t off a shovel'. I've never driven one but my big chance came today when my Sti went in for its first service. The dealer gave me a Saab 93 td150 as a courtesy car. Well, what a disappointment, all this low down torque supposedly giving excellent over-taking capability was nothing more than a gentle push in the back. If that's an example of a 'performance diesel' then you can keep 'em for me.
22 July 2011, 09:08 PM
#14
8.6 0-60 is hardly a performance car. A massive 3 seconds slower than your Turbo 2000. Add to that the dull drone of a basic 4 pot diesel with a tiny power band...No thanks.
Now a 6 cylinder Audi, BMW, Mercedes diesel or even a Volvo 5 pot is in a different league to a value branded Honda
Your 55mpg soon diminishes when you try to keep up with anything remotely performance orientated.
Performance diesels come from premier brands. Honda, sadly, don't fall into that category.
Now a 6 cylinder Audi, BMW, Mercedes diesel or even a Volvo 5 pot is in a different league to a value branded Honda
Your 55mpg soon diminishes when you try to keep up with anything remotely performance orientated.
Performance diesels come from premier brands. Honda, sadly, don't fall into that category.
22 July 2011, 09:15 PM
#15
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8.6 0-60 is hardly a performance car. A massive 3 seconds slower than your Turbo 2000. Add to that the dull drone of a basic 4 pot diesel with a tiny power band...No thanks.
Now a 6 cylinder Audi, BMW, Mercedes diesel or even a Volvo 5 pot is in a different league to a value branded Honda
Your 55mpg soon diminishes when you try to keep up with anything remotely performance orientated.
Performance diesels come from premier brands. Honda, sadly, don't fall into that category.
Now a 6 cylinder Audi, BMW, Mercedes diesel or even a Volvo 5 pot is in a different league to a value branded Honda
Your 55mpg soon diminishes when you try to keep up with anything remotely performance orientated.
Performance diesels come from premier brands. Honda, sadly, don't fall into that category.
Badge snobbery costs money and gets you nowhere ...
22 July 2011, 09:35 PM
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For what its worth, the BMW diesels are in different league to your obsolete and non-saleable soot chucker, and you know it.
Thats what really annoys you isn't it? You thought you were getting a bargain, when in actual fact the dealer saw you coming and thought "I can shift one of these old engines onto this guy before we're not allowed to sell them anymore"
22 July 2011, 09:38 PM
#19
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The BMW diesels are only in a different league if you are looking at the silly prices asked (and paid by the badge snobs).
In the other departments the Honda is simply better value by any measure .... performs as well, better equiped, look better, better interior.
In the other departments the Honda is simply better value by any measure .... performs as well, better equiped, look better, better interior.
Last edited by pslewis; 22 July 2011 at 09:39 PM.
22 July 2011, 09:44 PM
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The term 'performance' when applied to a car is about the rate at which the vehicle is able to increase its velocity be it 0-60, 30-70, 60-80 or whatever.
Power to weight, in other words BHP per ton is the prime factor and in this respect, the BMW 535d which is just about the fastest production diesel around, is about the equivalent of a 250 bhp Impreza. Diesels may have their share of low down torque, but what they do lack is good old BHP. Bearing in mind that I am used to driving a car with around 180 bhp more than the diesel that was loaned to me today, it is little wonder that I found it a bit tame.
Power to weight, in other words BHP per ton is the prime factor and in this respect, the BMW 535d which is just about the fastest production diesel around, is about the equivalent of a 250 bhp Impreza. Diesels may have their share of low down torque, but what they do lack is good old BHP. Bearing in mind that I am used to driving a car with around 180 bhp more than the diesel that was loaned to me today, it is little wonder that I found it a bit tame.
22 July 2011, 09:44 PM
#21
Performance diesels are the future
My wrxd has now reached 27k and is fantastic and is now averaging 47.8 mpg as it loosens up and has no real world performance difference to my classic turbo which I still drive
Only thing is they have seemed to have disappeared from the Subaru price lists
Think the exchange rate has not been favourable with my spec now well other 25k compared to some great VAG group cars and BMW etc
My wrxd has now reached 27k and is fantastic and is now averaging 47.8 mpg as it loosens up and has no real world performance difference to my classic turbo which I still drive
Only thing is they have seemed to have disappeared from the Subaru price lists
Think the exchange rate has not been favourable with my spec now well other 25k compared to some great VAG group cars and BMW etc
22 July 2011, 09:58 PM
#22
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We have a 57reg 330d and as standard it is pretty quick and the low down torque is so good for over taking etc, i am trying to convince the missus that we should get it mapped I would definitely consider getting a mapped 335D to replace the scoob if that day ever comes to move on.....
I would definitely consider getting a mapped 335D to replace the scoob if that day ever comes to move on.....
22 July 2011, 10:01 PM
#23
I did say it was the THINKING man's performance diesel ..... 0-60 times are for the uneducated in all honesty ..... it shows a complete lack of understanding of what is needed in the modern age, in the real world and at real world speeds.
Badge snobbery costs money and gets you nowhere ...
Badge snobbery costs money and gets you nowhere ...
Clearly you were unable to stretch to a far superior BMW 520D or the Impreza WRXD.
Not all of us are forced to shop in the bargain bucket world of motoring that is (diesel) Honda motoring.
Just because its the thing for you, does not make it the thing for everyone.
You are the last person I'd trust to talk about real world, you have told so many untruths on here over the years, you'd struggle to lie straight in bed, let alone on a forum .
You don't think, Pete, you dictate.
You remind me of my mother in law funnily enough. She lives alone and admits she's lonely too.
It's her way or no way.You show a remarkable resemblance.
22 July 2011, 10:10 PM
#25
What a surprise. Couldn't help yourself Lewis.
For what its worth, the BMW diesels are in different league to your obsolete and non-saleable soot chucker, and you know it.
Thats what really annoys you isn't it? You thought you were getting a bargain, when in actual fact the dealer saw you coming and thought "I can shift one of these old engines onto this guy before we're not allowed to sell them anymore"
For what its worth, the BMW diesels are in different league to your obsolete and non-saleable soot chucker, and you know it.
Thats what really annoys you isn't it? You thought you were getting a bargain, when in actual fact the dealer saw you coming and thought "I can shift one of these old engines onto this guy before we're not allowed to sell them anymore"
That will increase its residuals, no doubt
22 July 2011, 10:11 PM
#26
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I know I am outnumbered by badge snobs .... no bother at all - I know I drive the superior vehicle.
I will repeat what I said .... Honda Diesel - the THINKING mans choice ... whatever you say cannot change that fact.
I'm not dictating to anyone what to buy, simply offering deeply thought through, logical, sensible, accurate advice. I'm no fool, I do not waste my money, I do my homework ... my eyes are not clouded by 'Badges'.
But, I am older than most on here, I'm much wiser and I don't care what people think of my choices .... what someone can take from my words of wisdom is whatever they choose to.
The high desirability of the diesel model will secure a fine residual as they are as rare as hens teeth
Last edited by pslewis; 22 July 2011 at 10:12 PM.
22 July 2011, 10:17 PM
#27
Last edited by s70rjw; 22 July 2011 at 10:20 PM.
22 July 2011, 11:01 PM
#30
You're driving an inferior, out dated diesel from a budget brand.
When the facelifted Civic arrives later this year, it may have an engine which may rival premium brands. Your car never will. You must be so cross with yourself
When the facelifted Civic arrives later this year, it may have an engine which may rival premium brands. Your car never will. You must be so cross with yourself