TarmacSnortingMonsta

Back in November I sold my VW Golf to a guy from Cardiff, usual sale just this bloke decided to to let me know he was a drug dealer. A few days later I received a call from the guy to say the car had been stolen from his house with the keys and found crashed after being involved in a 5 vehicle collision. The Golf was found with £3000 cash and some heroin apparently. I was very sorry to hear about the whole incident and gutted to see pictures of the car written off. The guy asked me had I cancelled my insurance which I hadnt as I was picking up its replacement a week later and didnt feel the need. He told me he had not insured the car. He did ask me as I was still insured on it to make a claim for the theft and he would pay me a few thousand pounds. At the end of the day the car was no longer mine and really not my problem anymore nor something I wanted to get involved in so I wasnt going to doing anything like that so bluntly said no. Anyway everything went quiet for a few weeks until I get a letter from my insurance company (Churchill) to say that I had been involved in an accident and there were claims being made against myself. Its taken me since then until now to make it clear to Churchill that I sold the car and I was not the owner of the vehicle at the time after putting in a request for information form to the dvla and waiting for it to come back.
I spoke to them yesterday and they are now clear that I sold the car on the 7th of November and the accident was on the 12th or 15th. Anyway they are now saying that even though I was not the owner or the registered keeper at the time of the accident they are being made to pay out through my policy under the road traffic act and I am going to lose my 3 years no claims which I would be receiving at the end of this month and have a multiple vehicle claim on my policy. Churchill now tell me that when my insurance expires at the end of March that they are not willing to offer a renewal or be able to offer me insurance full stop. This is absolutely crazy! I have done nothing wrong and they can get away with punishing me for this? Does anyone know what I can do to fight this???
Thanks in advance if I dont respond straight away it's difficult for me to get on the computer just thought I'd get it on here as will be phoning the insurance again tomorrow. The only thing I can think to do at the moment is get in touch with the financial ombudsman if that could even help...

Ian

iTrader: (10)

i think the financial ombudsman would be best, or even trading standards to see where you stand

chocolate_o_brian

iTrader: (22)

+1. Thats a hellova situation to be tied up in, especially with a drug dealer.

Quasi Modo

You need some sort of legal advice, maybe one of these no win no fee companies?

If you weren't the owner and had nothing to do with the accidents thereafter i can't see how they see it as acceptable to hold you responsible for it. Usual Insurance company attitude of ANYONE pays BUT US!

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Did you not send off the V5 to DVLA for the new owner (all signed etc) as there is your proof of sale.

Tony

bish667

iTrader: (1)

Surely the car not being in your name at the time of the crash then that would make your insurance policy void on that car.
But I am not sure of what the road traffic act means.

As the above guys have already said speak to financial ombudsman.

Good luck mate.

MOTORS S GT

iTrader: (2)

I suspect thats one of the side effects of insurance companies sharing there details on a database, the other vehicles involved in this incident have claimed against the Golf, the insurers have the details of an active policy on the vehicle, regardless of who legally owns the Golf, and pounced on it.

It would probadly been a diffrent outcome had all the vehicles involved been with the same insurance co, then it would be sorry not covered as you sold it a few days earlier.

TarmacSnortingMonsta

Yes also got written confirmation separately from the DVLA showing the keepers details on the day of the accident and also the date I sold it. Its beyond me how they are making it stick

welsh scoob

iTrader: (4)

wot i dont understand is this.

insurance companies dont like payin out at the most of times. and if they pay out its as though they are saying u are to blame, except u wernt there, i would contact a solicitor or citizens advice, they are blamming you. its the buyers problem, not yours.

also if do as he asks, u are to blame then for not reporting stolen. and dont forget the fraud issue.

TarmacSnortingMonsta

Well thats exactly what I said to them if I'm not the registered keeper my insurance is void.. the person on the phone agreed :/

dantastic

The guy who bought the car from you had no insurance so was not insured to drive it, even if someone else or you owned it he would still have been an uninsured driver, unless of course it was insured any driver? and even then i think he would need your permission to drive on your insurance, so i don't see how you can be held liable for his accident, get yourself down the citizens advice bureau mate.

Tee-

iTrader: (3)

Did you inform the insurance company when you sold the car? if not they would just pay out becuase your spose to inform them of any chnages insurance companys are a joke.

TarmacSnortingMonsta

I think this is where I'm stuck, I didn't inform them the day I sold it.. tbh never have in all the years I've been driving because I've always replaced it that week or the following. Plus I wasn't aware that it was a requirement to do so.. Until now

Tee-

iTrader: (3)

lets hope you couldnt get to a phone and you wrote them a letter to confirm you sold it with your cover note

SunnySideUp

The car was insured - and innocent people have legitimate claims - that is against the 3rd Party element of the Policy.

If your Insurance refuses you further cover then you will find it hard to get cover anywhere as you must declare a refusal.

Midlife......

iTrader: (2)

Presumably it's on the ASKMID database (I think that's what it's called) which is why you have copped for it, however, you sold the car, have no legal title on it, are not the registered keeper so the insurance is void.

Shaun

Moley

iTrader: (9)

As far as i know (although i could be wrong) if you sell a car and the new owner doesn't insure it, the previous insurers (ie yours) are liable for any claims.

Wether or not they can step back your NCB or not, or wether it effects you i am not sure, but they (Churchill) are liable to pay out.

Silly rule IMO.

In theory you should always make sure whoever buys your car has insured it.

TarmacSnortingMonsta

Surely it wasn't insured though because even though I had a policy on it the policy stood as long as I am the registered keeper.. which I wasn't. This is what is puzzling me. I agree there are innocent people with legitimate claims but I am also innocent. IMO the person being pulled up in this should be the the guy who bought it from me.. who didn't insure it and was probably the driver given the way it was found and the dealer comment :/

ScoobyRalph

I think like it's been mentioned already, it's due to the policy still being 'live' on the car. If you sell a vehicle and still intend to stay with your current insurer you need to call on day of sale and advise them it's sold, they will then suspend your policy until you inform them of your replacement.

If they don't know and the policy continues to run I believe the third parties involved can legitimately make a claim against the policy. The who owns/who's driving aspect would be upto the police to sort out if they are making any sort of collision investigation.

Think CAB is worth a shot but got a feeling the insurance company may be in the right here.

Ralph

chocolate_o_brian

iTrader: (22)

Or swaps the insurance over to the new car straight away like I did on Sat. Thanks Moley, smooth transaction

TarmacSnortingMonsta

Ok thanks for all the replies so far people. I'm even more gutted because I was going to get myself another scooby on the new policy for the first time since a year ago. Not much chance of that anymore by the looks of it. Uninsured owners/drivers do my head in!

Moley

iTrader: (9)

Churchill would still be liable though, as they were the last insurers of the car

chocolate_o_brian

iTrader: (22)

Really

So if someone belted my 205, you guys would still be liable for it if it wasn't insured? Or is this when changing companies as I assume the O.P. hasn't.

Moley

iTrader: (9)

If the new owner doesn't insure it and has an accident your company are liable.

Crap isn't it!!!

rifleman

Get your new insurance now before this gets recorded.

chocolate_o_brian

iTrader: (22)

Erm, yeah! 'Cos I swapped cars on the same policy and it seems rife for abuse.

If some members on here (no names mentioned) have deliberately shown to insure the car only as a named driver, then this could be a massive problem.

It worries me that if you sell to a slightly dishonest person what could the consequences be. Obviously they would get fecked for not being insured as in the O.P.'s case, but it could easily ruin someone else NCB too.

Moley

iTrader: (9)

I am not exactly sure how it works, so not sure if it'd effect your NCB or not.

Will try to get some more info

chocolate_o_brian

iTrader: (22)

I may well give you a bell sometime this week, if only to chat about Scoobs and random crap again

TarmacSnortingMonsta

!!! UPDATE !!! This issue is still ongoing with my ncb still held since November 2009. Financial ombudsman is currently investigating, Churchill tell me the other insurers are taking me and them to court as the last insured and guess what?

I have just found my written off car which he did not insure FOR SALE ON EBAY!!!!

Arctic_Monkey

iTrader: (8)

Completely ***** what has happened mate, but basically becasue your insurance policy/ insurance company were the last insurers of the car before the accident they are still held responsible for third party liability under the road traffic act.

I do think you should have informed your insurance company the day you sold it, as technically you still have a valid insurance certificate in your possesion, stating you still own and insure the car, but obviously it's still completely unfair what has happened, and to be honest i think if the accident had happened 6 months down the line, and Churchill were still the last insurers of the car, the third party insurance companies would still be looking to Churchill for third party liability.

I actually work for Directline so will ask a few questions when I'm next in work and get back to you mate.