richie001

iTrader: (3)

I know this has been asked before but what are the main differences(how they handle against each other and engine spec etc) between the two apart from the dccd and abs which i know about(one has one and doesn't have the other).The reason i ask is that i'm thinking about selling my uk turbo 2000 and i've seen a p1 my00 for sale which is in my budget but i also like the type r which i have noticed are i a little bit cheaper for the same year also i have also thought about pushing my budget a little bit(£2500) and getting a my03 jdm.Thanks for your help i'm a two minds

R4LLY

iTrader: (1)

The P1 started life as a STI 5 Type R. It underwent a few Prodrive modifications to make it friendlier for the UK. The Type R has only one main advantage which is the DCCD. Power wise and acceleration is identical in standard form. The P1 seems a bit more exclusive, however the Type R is just a bit more "fun" to drive with the DCCD.

The newage JDM's are very nice also, however it will not feel as "raw" as the P1/Type R. In standard form the P1/Type R will also be faster, however the newage is more reliable and power can be extracted relatively easily from the twin scroll setup.

T5NYW

iTrader: (4)

R4lly your more or less spot on with your post

Unfortunately the above statement is an Urban myth, alledgley started by Dealer Salesmen

Mike Wood did explain see quote below

Tony

Dill_typeR

I like both P1's and type R's, I've never driven a P1 so can't compare differences.
0-60 type R is slightly quicker, motorway cruising type R will be revving higher at same speed.

Not sure about the P1 ECU but certain year cars (as in my 97 type R) couldn't be remapped and so any major engine mods would need a new ECU (not sure how these 'new' chips will affect this tho?)

Multijfj

Go for an My03 JDM STi, its worth it, and they are faster

typerchris

iTrader: (1)

didnt you mean heavier. type r all day long much more of a drivers car however if you want a relaxing drive the newage will be a little smoother but who wants a impreza to be smoother they a rally car you buy it for agility and power

slagmagnet69

P1 ALL DAY LONG.

Scoobymart

Iv'e got a type r wrc v/limited v6 no394/1000.These cars are very rare if u can get 1 their great fun 2 drive. Both cars in question are good but i prefer the type r's.+ I dont think u get water spray on a p1?

gaz-cole

thought the p1 had the dccd, scoobymart, thought the p1 also had the ic water spray?

T-gro

Not true at all.

The Type R has significantly shorter gears, which aid acceleration.

Performance car took a V4 type r to 60 in 4.3 secs and 100 in 11.9, compared to Evo's 4.9 and 13.3 for the P1

Dark Blue Mark

Lot of mis info on this thread

Apart from Tony.

All MY99 onward ECu's can be remapped using Ecutek.

The P1 does not have an adjustable diff (DCCD)

Value for money wise there is only one winner in a Type R vs a P1.

MB

Tasberley

type r such a better car but p1 more exclusive

hoskib

iTrader: (1)

P1 better on uk roads, type r better on the track

depends what you're gonna use it for

Slowboy Racing

You also need to bear in mind what year type r you are comparing this to,there are significant changes from v3-v6. It is well documented that the early cars had wilder cam set ups giving them certain advantages. The p1 was not fitted with the dccd center diff as it has a viscous center diff in place. It also has no water spay for the intercooler and has abs where the type r did not. It should also be noted that the gearing is different, the type r having shorter ratios. So the p1 will have a higher top speed and be a more drivable day to day car. As said above 99 on can be remaped using ecutec prior to that it would be a case of aftermarket ecu..

TonyBurns

iTrader: (3)

Id go with the JDM 2003 model

True, though the "raw" can be changed to "refined" in most cases.

Ah, listening to classic owners again dont go p2w ratio, it doesnt work with a different gearbox
The later twin scroll STi's are more than a match for their older counterparts (both post similar 0-100 times, in gear is probably better in the new age and top end better in the new age) They are not slower if anything they are slightly quicker, though due to "refinement" they dont feel it (better power delivery, ie more linear).

The rest is personal preference, but you want the best, go for the newage one

Tony

scoobynutta555

What you're best doing is searching for the comparisons between all three cars and picking the one that best suits your circumstances, then taking it for a test drive.

What you'll get on threads like this is loads of opinions and IMHO's about what is the best car based on in the main biased owners of each model, and very little cross referencing by people who have owned all three cars (if any).

People quoting performance stats for one car and comparing it to another car in a different magazine?

Unless you're a confident driver and know how to use the dccd properly (unlike many owners I may add );never use motorways or want something more than a track car-weekend car then leave the typeR. The typeR is too raw for an everyday car for the average driver. Things like the water spray (pratically useless and basically a posing pub brag) and dccd the P1 may have not, but for me was the better car to live with, and the faster one. Most of my driving was commuting on motorways, never did any track stuff. You'll get 50+ more miles from a tank and you'll be able to go over 80 mph without planning your trip around Shell garages in a P1.

Looks wise the P1 is the better looking out of all 3, and the more exclusive unless you're comparing to niche typeRs like RA's, V limited etc. Insurance should be cheaper too due to it being a UK model. Can't really comment too much on the 03 as I've never had one (I hate new shapes), but I've owned both a P1 and a typeR. At the end of the day all three cars have their pros and cons, just wade through the misinformation, test drive each and come to your own conclusion based on what you want from a car.

T-gro

I take it you're referring to me?

well.....

As Performance Car was the only UK magazine to figure an r, and the testers were the same guys (Barker and Meaden) that test for Evo, I felt the comparison was valid

Of course, I am sure you'll have a MUCH better idea of how to give some useful feedback to a much asked question, though I am sure it would be far less scientific, and much more biased to what you prefer.

Of course, I could be barking up the wrong tree, and you could actually be arguing that a lighter car with a diff set up that provides better traction and has shorter gears WON'T be quicker than a P1?

Oh, please let that be the case

scoobynutta555

Yes if you're the person that compares stats for one car in one magazine against another car in a different magazine. What you fail to realise in your pub 'Statto' status is that a) magazine figures are generally unreliable and oft never repeated by normal drivers, and b) figures for the same car can vary a lot in different magazines even if the testers are allegedly the same.

To give you an example, Performance Car managed 5.03 0-60 for a standard uk Impreza yet in other magazines it was 5.7 and Subaru itself claimed, what, 6.4? Who do you believe? May well have been the same testers, but was it the same conditions, was it even a track or on a sticky santa pod type surface, was it dry or damp for both cars, did one have a full tank and the other nearly empty, what tyre pressures were they running at? No you don't know, all you know is what someone has posted in one line of a magazine to satisify some saddo who's happy to bandy car stats around but less happy to give an informed review of both cars in question.

I don't know about you, but I don't have many opportunities, even desires to rag my car 0-60 in an everyday situation. What I do know is that the P1 was very easy to drive to its limits on A and B roads in all weathers, unlike the typeR where you have to be switched on much more as it will bite you severely if you don't know what you're doing. Granted you may be quicker than a P1 or even an 03, but one thing is for sure you'll have to be a much better driver to acheive this. There's much more to fast road driving than 0-60 times.

I'm not biased towards any model of Impreza, it's just I've had the experience of 5 different types of classic Imprezas over 9 years. Therefore, I think I'm qualified in what my opinions are. I'm not sitting with my trousers around my ankles rote learning car stats to impress some oik propping a bar somewhere.

T-gro

Aah..... Pedantry

You, see, unfortunately for your little argument, Performance Car and Evo (and others) DO have largely reproducable, or at least replicable, results because they adhere to various conventions.

Those two, for example, always test with a passenger and half a tank of fuel. I would expect you to know that, as the famous Performance car test at Santa Pod was to show what would happen if you DIDN'T take a scientific approach. The whole idea was to show the real world relevance of their approach to performance testing.

Of course, you probably don't even want to consider the fact that magazines would actually WANT their tests to have any relevance, or allow any kind of inference to be gleaned form any comparison, but I can assure you they do.

What I can tell YOU, from my 8 years of Subaru ownership, three cars and probably another half dozen or so variants driven is that, basically, the magazines get it right.

The Prodrive UK cars are a little faster than the UK ones, the p1 is a little faster again, and the Type r is a little faster again.

The fact that the figures back this up really shouldn't annoy you so much. If you like, you can quote other figures which make the P1 quicker.

I'll tell you something though, if everytime you want to establish a performance benchmark, you INSIST on absolute equivalency or otherwise mock and denigrate any attempt to help and enlighten, any contribution you will make to a discussion will not be tremendously useful. No more useful than, say voodoo or dowsing anyway.

On the other hand, what I did, which was to question the mistaken belief of a member, and back it up with some figures, taken by people who were actually attemting to resolve the matter at issue.

Perfect? No. Better than your approach? Yes.

T5NYW

iTrader: (4)

The out the Box P1 is a Very Capable Car on UK roads and Track the best UK Subaru Brought out (Ok there were 15 ish 22BUK's) but the RB320
beats it in nearly all departments bar looks...... maybe

Something also to bear in mind when quoting Specs onl Jap Classics there is always the different to the Norm not as Clear Cut as you may think

V5/V6 Type R's where made to be made into Rally Cars. but when Joe Public started buying them aswell optional extra's or Choices became available IIRC

1) some have ABS but then no DCCD
2) Some have Longer gearing
3) Some don't have Roof Vents
4) some have A/C some don't
5) Not all Type R's have a Quick Rack like the RA

The R stands Retina and RA Race altered

P1

1) Not a Type R converted
2) No DCCD
3) wasn't Remapped by Prodrive
4) Heavier than a Type R

Tony

fatmanscooby

Mine has the longer 5th Gear and is fine on Motor Ways. Try these Sites....
P1 Web Owners Club :: Warning, may contain nuts!
www.tye-r-ra.co.uk
For Owners experiences.

scoobynutta555

Of your cars was any of them day to day ownership P1? I had one for 4 years, a typeR for a year and a 22b for 6 months among other Imprezas. I have noted you have a cool grey sti typeR, I had an sti5tyeR in the same colour (incidently one of the reasons I binned the car was for it's awful colour )

I think you're missing the point and getting very **** over car mag stats, with a zeal verging on the obsessional trait of a trainspotter. This isn't a game of Top Trumps where one car can go .3 of a second to 60 quicker than the other, allegedly, "therefore I win".

Yes magazines are a good source of information and are a guide not a bible to be leafed through with religious head nodding.

The best comparison you can do is to own both for a period of time and draw your own conclusions. Perfect? Nearly. Better than the approach of a seasoned Top Trump player? Yes.


And FWIW Tony there were 16 Uk 22bs of which I was lucky enough to own 1 for a while.

DazW

iTrader: (1)

Not that different ...Evo Magazine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

They still preferred the P1 mind

1168

type r for me ,just as good but cheaper.just not quite as exclusive

New_scooby_04

iTrader: (4)

I'm with you on magazine figures mate, but in this instance, believe them, not Subaru!!

Subaru UK told a bare-faced lie about the Impreza's 0-60. Most likely to keep it in the Group 17 insurance bracket!! Every single performance test that I'm aware of put the Impreza comfortably under 6 secs. Now, the relevance of 0-60 in everyday driving and the brutal technique required to extract the best times etc.. is another matter, but, like it or not, it is a performance benchmark and the insurance companies do take note. For example, the Bugeye Impreza is slower than the classic, but Subaru weren't about to like like they'd taken a step back, so they quoted it's real 0-60 time of 5.9 seconds. Gues what happened to the insurance: group 19!

T-gro

One of the reasons I bought that particular car was BECAUSE of the colour

But no, I have never owned a P1. Primarily because after driving the cars, the r was far closer to what I was looking for.

But, without hammering the point to death, a Type r WILL accelerate quicker than a P1, however you wish to benchmark it. I just don't understand why providing supporting evidence for the help of people who won't have the chance to establish that through their own experience irates you so much.

A guy claimed they had identical performance, they don't. You know that, I know that. What's wrong with providing figures that back up what we all know to be true?

fatmanscooby

Simply because Prodrive dabbled with it and that makes it "The Best". Some people are so Blinkered. Value for Money its the Type R.

Scutch

Evo magazine placed the P1 in 17th for best car of all time. No other Impreza in the top 50. That wasnt the work of the magazine writers either, that was the public who voted.

I honestly dont know what the problem is with this argument though. They are both fantastic cars and joy will be received from either. The DCCD thing is, fair enough, a trick toy. But do you really need it other than to boast every single time that the Type R has it? Nah. Mine has a P1 badge on the back. Beat that, you Type R scallywags.
Also, why are the newage versions coming into the fray? When did the original poster mention anything other than a P1 or Type R? He might have done in all honesty, but I wasnt really paying attention as I got caught up in the P1 v everything else while it gets slated yet again, even though in countless reviews and magazines its been praised time and time again. The standard 0-60 time for the P1 is roughly 4.66s. The Type R I believe does it 1/10th of a second quicker. Crikey, there's no catching that thing then once its pulled on you
It really is bizarre the amount of arguing that goes on regarding two very special and absolutely stunning examples from the Impreza stable. I've drove mine nigh on every day since I bought her in July 2005. I've had no problems at all and have just had it modified and the Apexi mapped so now it might be even quicker to 0-60mph than a stock Type R, and have more power to weight than the Type 25. Not actually that concerned, as in all honesty, I dont go out and look for these cars to try and race with and prove how superior my P1 is to them, especially not when you consider how evenly matched they are to start with. Ahh, but one of them has DCCD. Damn... beaten by the toys

P1 is a UK car, its better for a normal, every day driver who doesnt live on a track, it looks better, is suited to the UK roads better and can come with a warranty for those 'engine moments'
The Type R has more toys, is marginally but hardly noticably quicker, goes better around a track, can be set up suspension wise to cope with the UK roads like the P1 and probably most importantly, its cheaper.

Horses for courses, both stunning cars in their own way. Just seems to me like the P1 takes a battering on here when put in the same category as other All Conquering Imprezas. Pah, rubbish.

fatmanscooby

That made me smile well put

Scutch

Well, sheeeeesh kebab. I bought my P1 because, in all honestly, I didnt know about the Type R. It was a UK car and I thought I'd be in good stead regarding warranty and servicing/insurance. If I had the choice again, I'd go for the P1 because I love it, I'm used to it and I think its one of the best cars around. Supercar performance for hot hatch price. Thats not knocking the Type R, as once upon a time I'd have laughed at the thought of one. I understand now that they are, at least, on an equal with the P1 in many departments. In some areas they are better, others not so good, and vice versa. There are pro's and cons for both cars. I dont particularly prefer the look of the Type R over the P1, yours aside, as I've always said. I think its to do with the lip spoiler and lines of the P1. I think its the best looking Impreza ever made, 22B included. I prefer the fuss of the front end over the vacant look. In my opinion.
My choice would be the P1 for obvious reasons, but you will not be disappointed with a Type R, either, as many owners on here will tell you. Both very similar, fantastic cars, and a whole generation better than all that Spec C rubbish thats being thrown around at the moment (rumour has it that was a joke...)