AgentO

i`ve recently bought a MY98 Terzo

Problem been that due to the cost of keeping a F.S.S.H.( and having to pay out a grand in 3 weeks time for insurance) i would like to start servicing the car myself( and besides, i know i can do a better job of it )

Thing been, i`ve read alot about the piston slap problems with MY 98`s , and obviousley i won`t be covered if i do away with the warranty

At the minute, the engine is *slightly* more noisey when cold than when it is hot ( which i would expect due to tolerences etc.) ...question been, is there an average mileage that the problem will manifest itself in , or can it happen at any mileage?

a.t.m. it`s got 30k on the clock, its now due a major service which is going to cost £420 from a dealership.Can i reasonably drop the F.S.S.H. on the basis that if i was going to have a problem, then it would have already occured??

Your thoughts please Gentlemen ...oh, and i notice that alot of you get your cars serviced by non-Subaru approved garages anyway, so surely you guys are`nt covered?

Mike Owen

I assume that the service has something "non standard" in it? (like new brake pads)... because I've only paid around £240 for the 30k service on my previous two Scoobs. Though my local dealer is out in the country and I suppose the labour rates will be cheaper than a city centre dealer. But even so, sounds like a lot of money to me.

Enjoy your car whatever....

GCollier

Unless you plan to keep the car for a very long time, I think that dropping the FSSH will be a false economy. Imprezas are difficult enough to sell as it is, if you drop the history, I think you'd have to virtually give the thing away.

Gary.

AgentO

The £420 was quoted by my local dealership in York, over the phone for a basic 30k service.....another place that lost their fanchise 6 mths ago quoted £340.

oh, i forgot to mention that i can get my book stamped by a m8, so asfar as whoever is concerned the car will have a F.S.H. ....just not a Subaru one

i plan on keeping the car for at least 3 years, which will make it 6 yrs old when i sell it anyway, and lets face it, most cars of that age do not have a F.S.H. ( which mine will have )

.....so its not the selling point that worries me, just this problem with the warranty :/



[This message has been edited by AgentO (edited 12 November 2000).]

Dave T-S

Just be so kind as to post the reg no here will you so none of us buy a car with a bent service history when you sell it.....

AgentO

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>a bent service history <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

i don`t want to get into a slagging match here, but i know two guys who work in Dearlerships, and i also know of the tricks that go on.

Suffice to say that my car will be run on only Silkolene oils, using genuine filters, and thats why like said, i can do a better job, given also the fact that i am an enthusiast who knows what he`s doing, not just a £8 an hour mechanic who`s rushing the job `cause the foremans on his back!

Like i say, i know what go`s on in the trade, and beleive me, that F.S.H. that you hold so precious, may not be quite upto what you expect it to be.( as much as i hate to say it)

oh, and as an example, i beleive that engine oil should be changed <I>at least</I> every 4k, not every 7.5k like you would be getting with <I>your</I> F.S.H.




[This message has been edited by AgentO (edited 12 November 2000).]

Kevin2000

Ye alot of the american subaru sites say it should be done every 3 to 4k.

Dave T-S

Well the service history will be honest on our two cars i.e. FSSH will be exactly that not a stamp that IMPLIES it.

logiclee

I paid slightly over the odds for my MY96 Series McRae, not only did it have FSSH but every invoice for all work done to it during its 50k miles.

Nearly all dealers keep computer records of Service History so can be a good way of double checking.

I am competent to service the car myself but I don't have the experience to be able to look out for common problems that a dealer/specialist would. I also want it to be worth something when I sell it.

Anyone got the Number for Roger Clark Motorsport?

Lee

RB170

AgentO

If you intend to sell the car at some time then like it or not your gonna need the FSH unless you sell to a tyre kicker who doesn't give a sh*t.

I'm sure you could do a much better job, I'm also sure that most of us could get our scoobys serviced just as good if not better somewhere else but are you willing to take the risk of losing you warranty and your FSH.

Mike

Dave T-S

Logiclee - exactly - thank you.

- and AgentO - conscience is in there somewhere as well.
As long as you advertise your car when you sell it as "full set of Subaru Dealer stamps but serviced by myself" then all will be clear to everybody eh??

Perhaps if you can't afford to run it properly you should get a Fiesta diesel. I don't personally care what you do but I and others could buy a car like this in good faith thinking it had a full Subaru dealer history (although I think you will find it will stick out like a sore thumb when the time comes and you will regret it when nobody wants to touch it with a bargepole).

[This message has been edited by Dave T-S (edited 12 November 2000).]

SimonM

AgentO,

Good choice of car!!

I agree, that you probably could do a better job servicing your car than you dealer, you may have a problem, however, when you come to sell. I personally would not buy any performance car without a full manufacturers SH, never mind something a specialised as an Impreza, and I suspect many other people are the same.

I guess it depends on how long you are going to keep the car... If you are keeping it for the next few years and 70K miles then it is not as important as if you were selling in 10K miles.

Just my two pence worth

SimonM

AgentO

well,well ,well .....i do seem to have opened up a can of worms here!

..or could it be that i`ve just set up paranoir in all you second hand car buyers minds!

Dave certainly seem`s to be taking things to heart, you`d best just hope that you never buy a car from me huh??

seriousley though, i`m almost geekish in the way that i look after my cars and motorcycles....everything is logged in a book for each vehicle....even the most mundane things such as putting air in the tyres.Beleive me,i know how to look after cars, and i don`t like throwing money away either.

But surely this is getting away from the topic( all be it my own fault , i know ).

Some advice would have been nice on whether or not i was about to suffer from piston slap, but i think that most of the peeps who have answered have done so purely because i wound them up with my earlier comments, ahh well, live and learn i spose :/

DEEDEE

S/H means nothing my car is looked after by an excellent Subaru mechanic for a fraction of the price at regular intervals so am I wrong to get the book stamped. What does the stamp prove youve paid through the nose for the same job.

Nightmare

AgentO

If you service the car yourself, your warranty will be void. If you henceforth get piston slap, you'll have to pay. I dont think you can predict that it wont happen (though I guess 30,000 trouble free miles make it <I>likely</I> to be safer) but its your choice.

Have to agree with Dave though... whilst I agree that servicing is massively overpriced (and I REALLY know ) it is for your peace of mind (if it fallas apart a week later the garage is at least to some extent liable) and the following buyers....who will have no idea whether you genuinely can do a better job or just think that you can (if you see what I mean). I dont thinkits very fair for you to potentially cone someone in future - but its your call.

Gary - yes, they do have the things you mentioned, but they also have 'booked time' for all jobs. A trained mechanic can fit at least 4 'hour' jobs into an hour. A friend of mine who is without doubt 'the best Saab mechanic in the whole world ever' can strip and rebuild an entire engine in about 3 1/2 hours..rather than the 16 that would be charged for it....I dont blame Agent0 or Mulder at all for what they think - cos they're right!

cheers
Night

Nightmare

AgentO

If you service the car yourself, your warranty will be void. If you henceforth get piston slap, you'll have to pay. I dont think you can predict that it wont happen (though I guess 30,000 trouble free miles make it <I>likely</I> to be safer) but its your choice.

Have to agree with Dave though... whilst I agree that servicing is massively overpriced (and I REALLY know ) it is for your peace of mind (if it fallas apart a week later the garage is at least to some extent liable) and the following buyers....who will have no idea whether you genuinely can do a better job or just think that you can (if you see what I mean). I dont thinkits very fair for you to potentially cone someone in future - but its your call.

Gary - yes, they do have the things you mentioned, but they also have 'booked time' for all jobs. A trained mechanic can fit at least 4 'hour' jobs into an hour. A friend of mine who is without doubt 'the best Saab mechanic in the whole world ever' can strip and rebuild an entire engine in about 3 1/2 hours..rather than the 16 that would be charged for it....I dont blame Agent0 or Mulder at all for what they think - cos they're right!

cheers
Night

Dave T-S

AgentO
You just don't get it, do you??
Give your local trading standards office a call, tell them what you propose to do, and post the verbatim answer on this board to enlighten us all......

LanCat

Seems like you already answered your question AgentO.

You believe you can do a job as well as a dealer and that is probably the case however you are missing the point of a FSH.

The point for a future buyer is that the vehicle has been serviced by trained personnel to an agreed standard. Whether you'd do it better or worse isn't relevant to the bext owner. Getting you mate to stamp it for you is clearly fraudulent as he didn't do the service.

By all means service it yourself... keep your fingers crossed about your warranty... and don't be a dishonest about the history when you sell it...

You'll probably feel smug about saving £200 if nothing goes bang! but maybe a bit dumb if it does

Mulder

The whole dealership servicing thing is a crock 'o' ****e. Grossly expensive. I phone up a Nissan dealership to get my 200sx serviced, for an oil/filter change, and airfilter and "fluids" check that wanted 160-70odd quid. I did it for £20. Their excuse for the outrageuos pricing was "yeah but you get your servicing stamp" WOW! Not. Pathetic.

GCollier

With the cost of depreciation and insurance, I really can't see why people get so distraught at services costing several hundred pounds, especially given the level of performance you're getting. Try taking an F355 for its big cambelt service if you want to moan.

Agent0 - I hope your mate can also knock up a set of bills and invoices too.

Deedee - If S/H means "nothing", then why do you get the book stamped? As Lancat says, the stamp should signify a recognised level of service by a trained subaru technician.

Mulder - It may have escaped your notice, but dealerships have overheads (buying expensive equipment, buildings, staff etc) and have to turn a profit. And don't forget that you have a choice whether to use them or not. If after all things considered (level of service, future residuals etc) you continue to use them, then you must have decided that you're getting value for money. If not, then service it yourself, buy a cheaper car, but stop whinging either way, because it's your CHOICE.

Gary.

Mulder

OI! Don't get so stroppy. I still reckon they charge faaaar to much for what they offer. Prehaps if they were more competively priced more people for have FSH cars.

sunilp

I get my oil and filter changed every 3 months, regardless of mileage (prob around 3k/3months)

Secondly, i had a VW Golf Gti that was 10yrs old when i sold it and it had FSH, first main dealer (by previous owner) then respected speacialist.

Thirdly, the fact that you say what oils and TLC you give it are only your word, anyone can borrow receipts or whatever. Hope you have luck selling it, i wouldnt touch it with Daves!

banshi

Dave, looks like we have found someone else to wind you up, suggest your next performance "mod" is a blood pressure monitor, particulasrly as Sunil's arrived

In principal I agree with you and Lee, but it's the usual case of buyer beware. There's something about used cars that brings out the wide boy in people. I know a guy who normally you could trust with your Grans' jewellery but he ran his Gti for 12 months with the speedo disconnected to drop the mileage. No one will pick that up, but fake dealer stamps are another thing.

DD/Agent O, if you were unfortunate enough to have me consider buying a car from you I think you'd be on your way to litigation. Not by Trading Standards, unless you were operating a business, but by me and the dealer whose stamps you had fraudulently used. My minimum expectation would be to attach your "mates" to the end of a dole queue.

I also purchased a Terzo and although I bought it from a dealer, I checked with IM, the supplying dealer and met the previous owner. Paranoid, me? You bet! IMO only an idiot would part with 20K without checking. So I don't have a problem with conmen, ONLY THE PRATS THAT LET EM OPERATE.

BOT
But my answer to your reasonably posed question is: Scoobs generally have a good reputation unless abused, Otis I did say generally. If hammered and stomped around tracks difficulties may be more frequently encountered of course. I've driven one with over 100K on the clock - full supplying dealer history - other than the steerin wheel cover threatening to disintegrate no problems. Drove one with 52K, just a bag of hairy sh8e!

If you have a good one and treat it right you could probably forget the warranty. But forget concern about residuals, check the costs. The 30,000 service is expensive and should have been taken into account within the purchase price, intermediates are only about a ton. This works out to just a few more pence per mile to maintain your warranty to 60,000 miles or beyond if you top it up.

All servicing is disproporionately expensive, Sunil will give you chapter and verse on the reasons, by comparion Subaru is quite cheap...by a TVR or Lotus, then watch the effect on your bank balance & you don't even get the reliability.

P.S. A monkey could be trained to change oils and filters (and maybe even me) the skill is in recognising the cause of a rattle before it becomes a bang.

AgentO

Well you`ll all be pleased to know that its booked in at my local dealership for the 30k service ....£420 down the swanny but at least i`ll have peice of mind incase owt else goes wrong

......not too sure what i`m gonna do come March though when the warranty runs out

keep an eye out ( esp, you Dave )

Mr.Cookie

Sunil you sure it would reach

Dave

Simon
Ps i do agree with dave though if it says full service history it should have exactly that

JoeyDeacon

Mungo,

I assume this large dealer is a certain dealer in Surrey who also sells Subarus and Saabs??

If so then I am not surprised as their Service Department is completely incompetent (Yes I do speak from personal experience).

banshi

Agent O

You can buy a top up package to extend the warranty for a further year or two.

Check the archive or have a word with the dealer when you drop the car off. Just like any other paid for warranty, it's money down the drain unless you need to claim on it. Of course you will then be tied into dealer servicing, which I think is where we came in.

Cheers

Nightmare

one other thing.....
did you actually shop around for the service? cos Im pretty sure I paid nowhere near that for my 30K, and Im sure someone else mentioned there's was a lot cheaper too???

N

Mungo

I know of two people running Lotuses (Loti?)with "service histories" stamped by a large dealer who won't have any record of the work on their computer system. The work is done by a Lotus mechanic using Lotus tools, for cash on a Sunday. I wouldn't feel a problem with the standard of the actual work done (to the service book schedule), but I'd assume that the warranty is utterly worthless.

GCollier

Mungo,

Those Lotus guys obviously don't value their jobs. With any prestige car, I'd always phone garages, past owners etc to verify the cars history. I did this with a porsche 944 I used to own a few years back - spent a couple of days playing "PI" thoroughly checking out the past history. It only takes one potential purchaser of one of their "FLSH" vehicles to do this, and they'd probably be facing the sack and possible prosecution (along with the owners).

Gary.