Blueblaster

BBC NEWS | Business | EU plans attack on car emissions

EmEm

Computer says Noooo!

Blueblaster

That ought to do it.

swifty.....!

iTrader: (4)

i like his name mr dumass i mean dimas

911

Just glimpsed through the article.
Why should 'we' loose to foreign imports? If they can do it then so must the rest!

All you need is a good cat in the down-pipe! @ £400.

If a Range Rover goes up by £1600 will anyone notice on a 50K car?

As scooby owners we could get greener and replace decats with sport cats.
This will soon be the way forward.
I spoke in depth with one well known tuner at the Autosport Show yesterday, and they now rarely map a car with a de-cat! Customers fit sport cats.
This also means the cost will come down soon.
No excuse, and I've just done it last week on my 407 bhp Sti v3.

The time has come.
Graham

tony95

surely the greener way to motor is not to buy a new car every 18 months.
most of the enviromental damage is done in the production of a new car,not just its consequent emissions.perhaps the removal of road tax on all cars over 10 years old is the way foward.

Blueblaster

LOL says the guy with an 11 year old car

Simes777

I'd like to see the green credentials of the people proposing this sort of stuff before I change my car - if the EU is going to impose this on us, they ought to be as green as The Hulk.

Blueblaster

Every time I lay into the idiots who buy massive 4x4s to take the kids to school I am frequently told what good value they are. I am told that most people do not buy them as they can't afford £50k, but they can afford to lease them. I reckon that if you had to pay £1600 road tax every year you would most definitely choose something different. The EU are usually about as useful as a cat flap in an elephant house, but on green issues they are just what the planet needs. No one knows who the faceless bureaucrats in Brussels are so they can do what they like. More green taxes please.

corradoboy

Global warming is a natural event and is nothing to do with man. We live on a planet which is in close proximity to a star (the Sun) which is inexorably warming, and therefore our planet will warm with it. The surface of our planet is 90% water, which absorbs the energy from our Sun constantly, feeding our climate with limitless energy in quantities so inconceivable in proportion to man-made sources. It has been proved time and time again that human transportation in all its forms contributed less than 0.075% to global greenhouse gas production with very nearly all of it coming from nature. Twentyseven Land Rovers produce less during a 12k mile average years use each than a single cow. What I do believe however is that the masses have been brainwashed by the politicians and media into believing the hype and thus justifying new means of taxation. It's all about money. Every single discussion on climate involves reaction including taxation.

The planet will continue to do its thing long after man has gone, and that will thankfully mean the lying, two faced, cheating, bull****ting ******* politicians will have gone too.

andythejock01wrx

Would that be a cow with excessive wind ?

willipdarling

Completely agree with corradoboy there!
Fair enough high emissions are not goin to help the matter but if you look back through time the climate has changed several times.
There werent any cars to produce emissions beford the ice age were there???
Also annoys me that the people that are always going on about it are usually the people in the 5 litre range rovers being driven to work!
I also love the cut off point in the taxation classes, you may aswell have a 7 litre engine at the amount of tax on the highest band, if there were more divisions higher up the scale then maybe people would think twice

corradoboy

There are some sensible people out there then

As you say, the ice-age happened with no input from us, the climate was hotter in the age of the dinosaurs without us, the highest incidence of atmospheric lead pollution found in polar ice cores dates to around the (supposed) time of Christ (so no engines then), and the dark ages were around 2 centuries where the northern hemisphere was shrowded in volcanic ash. Then just look at the geography of the planet. How the Hell did sedementary rock from the bottom of a sea end up 5 miles high in the Himalayas, the single continent of Pangea now makes the 7 we know today.

The Earth will do its thing, the Sun will do its thing, and humans will live or die at natures will. Politicians however will use any plausible excuse to wring every last penny out of a gullible public to fund their own agendas and ambitions, which usually means war, making them the biggest killers out there. Tax the politicians

Blueblaster

As the owner of a low polluting car I do love this subject and must apologise for my smug tone. Corradoboy, a very well written paragraph that was most unexpected from someone with such a chavy pseudonym. However, I fear that no number of well written words will stop the bureaucrats from having their way. Enjoy your cars while you can.

corradoboy

Never judge a book by its cover
On this I fear you a completely correct

DEEDEE

I know as well as everyone one here, its not about Green its about TAXES. Yes if Europe says do it then they will do it, But put us on a level playing field with the rest of the motoring taxes, European cars only have a MOT every 2 years, Ive just saved you all £50 plus work involved, Goverment just missed a fortune. So that wont happen Greedy Barstewards

Russ71

I read and heard in the news not so long ago that the higher the octane in fuel the less emissions the car pumps out, they on the news mentioned this when a new super fuel made out of whatever the hell it was, some kind of organic muck, so we that use super unleaded a higher octaine fuel should be praised with less tax, thats what I think anyway.

911

Green = Tax
Things non-green = mega tax and mega opportunity for those who do not answer to those who elected them.
A 4 x 4 in town is seen as non green so the tax will rocket, and the owners may not suffer, just pay more.

I found corrado's words very interesting and appreciate that Man may not be the greatest source of the Globe Warming, but why has it appreared to happen so fast, and why are the seasons less distinctive?

I am quite old, (54) so sorry for this BUT:

I can clearly remember a real snow/frost winter, a crisp blooming Spring and a deep lazy summer and a drifting windy and wet Autumn.
That was 30 or 20 or 15 years ago.
'Suddenly' it is different.

If the insane consumption of fossil fuels in all areas globally are speeding this change, then slowing things down is a good thing to do.

The Impreza is a meaningless contributor, the scale has to be enlarged to the USA and China in particular.

So:
Why is it all changing so quickly, or is it just a simple transient in a very long timescale? A mere blip on the landscape, but a huge way to twist the taxation machine for Gordon and his counterparts.

China opens a coal fired Power Station every day.

Graham

PCM

I blame the americans.

corradoboy

Actually, China opens a coal fired powerstation every 10 days. And if you think back to the 70's, when I was just a lad, the papers were harbingers of doom predicting the new ice-age that was coming. We had several severe winters on the trot and the sayers of doom jumped on their bandwagon, put two and two (percent in the pound) together and we were on the brink of climate disaster. In truth, if you study climates over several decades, and then relate that to centuries, the temperature ebbs and flows in regular rhythms, but the trend will always be upwards whilever our local star is on its course for becoming a red giant (then a white dwarf, before it finally implodes into its own black hole).

If we really want to tackle man-made emmisions, attacking the average man in the street will take decades to achieve any effect. Why are we not applying strict and severe import tax on goods from polluting nations such as China, India and America ? Why ? Because the economy would suffer to the tune off billions, whereas leaching ever more of the hard-earned from Joe Public's pocket keeps the economy ticking over nicely whilst maintaining good trade relations with our wealthy allies, neighbours and business partners, whom we don't want to upset under any circumstances.

Just before Xmas the BBC did an opening article on global warming, commenting on mankinds resposibilites to try and stem the effects, and how it is everyone's duty to make every concession, no matter how small. The 3rd article on the same edition was about the worlds largest container ship, and how amazing it was that it had docked in Britain on its 'round the world jaunt to drop cheap tatt across the globe to fill everyone's stockings. No mention was made about it coming from the one of the most polluting nations on Earth, or how much diesel it had consumed on its journey. If our government was truly concerned about green issues, it should have been turned away from our ports, or sunk without trace, but the VAT from all those new telly's and plastic garbage is too tempting, as are the deals to be made between our companies and theirs. So **** the real issues and tax the man in the street, the worst he'll do is vote for someone else in a few years time, and it doesn't matter a jot, 'cos whoever you vote for the government always win.

Martin2005

I just love certainty you show

911

I think Corrado's second para is spot-on.

The West's reliance on China for cheap goods was started by the USA.
Europe really got going about 6 years ago.
The Company i work for has 2 China factories and the uk workforce has diminished to 50% of what it was 6 years ago.

If a carbon tax was applied, the balance would change, be the UK is used to cheap everything, thats why we have a high standard of living.(in a materialistic way)

Wheather China builds a power station every day or 10 it will burn coal (low grade?) as it has a lot of it and the products of combustion will head our way, but via the USA land mass.
Some kind of justice there maybe.

I'm not sure any government anywhere can resolve this situation both economically and environmentally. Even collectively they can't!

jim litten

Graham, unfortunately with the the way the Carbon Trust have companies twitching they tend to take over 3rd world businesses as they can offset their carbon emissions to the 3rd world businesses, and so globally look "cleaner" than they really are, which is why a lot of UK companies are setting up in the east rather than local employment.

lunar tick

iTrader: (2)

True indeed - if we in the UK stopped ALL transport activity (cars, buses, trains, planes boats) immediately and permanently, the savings in carbon emissions would be completely wiped out by the growth in the Chinese economy in 11 and a half days

v5 man

iTrader: (4)

Corradoboy for Prime Minister

Martin2005

Thats not true, it's 11 months not days

Barmyclown

In response to 911`s comments about change happening to quickly. I can rememeber from the early 80's the snow every year etc. And miss the fact we don't get much now. But things in nature very rarely change in a linear fashion. So all you will see initially will be small changes , but as they add up the rate of change increases, this will happen until the system maxes out.

I`m not going to guess what happens then,. But the planet Earth is a system, there are many infuences, and many different processes happening on, in and around it at the same time , unless ALL these are taken into consideration you are just shooting in the dark. Enviromentalists only look at green house gasses to achieve their aims, thus missing out a big chunk of the rest of the system.

Does anyone think that the weakening of the earths magnetic field, possibly due to an impending field flip. Could be having an effect on our climate. It is weakening now , in some areas ( south atlantic ) it has already flipped. With a weaker magnetic field more radiation makes it to the surface, but the enviromentallists don`t mention this, because it is out of anyones control, nothing can be done about it.

Rant over

Jase

andythejock01wrx

I think Graham has it spot on here.

Not convinced we can bury our heads in the sand and deny that mankind is having a significant impact on the planet. On the other hand, it's clear that if we can't bring the US and China into a global agreement, then we really are pissing against the wind.

And it's certainly true that politicians take advantage of the argument when it comes to taxation !

corradoboy

The only policy I will support which will reduce the impact of mans activities on the planet is population reduction. There's too many of us, and exponentially more each day. We are overloading the eco-system which supports us, but to think that taxation to modify the individuals behaviour can solve the problems caused by 7 billion, and rising, fast, people is the biggest lie since the Bible. Manipulative opportunists have simply seized the chance to milk a gullible public with a half plausible excuse, backed completely by Blair's Bull$h!t Channel to ensure mass hysteria.

911

I was waiting for the population problem to appear!

I believe you are so correct! (also about the Bible too)

It IS the demands of the Billions, their demand for the rising standards, the consumer goods and the defence systems that feed the basic human instinct of growth at all costs.

The uk is traffic bound because so many use cars. Lots of cars due to lots of people capable of getting/using one.
If the population was 40 million and not 60 then we would see a practical change, less demand for fuel and less polutants.
Take that thought now to China.

I was there about 5 months back to the same 2 areas of my first visit in 1987. The change in about 20 years was utterly gob smacking.
Unless you see it for yourself it is very hard to describe. No wonder there is so much demand for goods and all things 'modern'. How they cope with this massive economic growth I don't know, but you do need them on your side and not as an enemy....so it is very hard to demand they come to the party on the environment when we want all those nice cheap (and good quality) products. A £3 pair of jeans, a £8 shirt, an Ipod and now a Honda Jazz.

The global human expansion must be the prime culprit in this (very interesting) debate.
No people = no consumption, lots of people = lots of problems!

How do you address the human bulk in time to ensure it can survive on what is left of the dwindling plant?

A War? Disease? Starvation? or all 3 in that order?

I doubt birth control and even age control can get it in check in time.

That is very depressing and I'm sorry to voice it.

Looking at human history my bet is a big war over oil and then water.
I think China has lots of both?

Maybe you should be a politician Corrado!

Graham.