mot failure
04 January 2007, 08:16 PM
#1
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mot failure
put car into garage for mot and i could not believe it when i got i back, They had failed it on a split pin missing and one anti roll bar bush worn. think they were after a bit of work
04 January 2007, 08:27 PM
#4
Originally Posted by 95blackWRX
put car into garage for mot and i could not believe it when i got i back, They had failed it on a split pin missing and one anti roll bar bush worn. think they were after a bit of work
Get a second opinion and if they've lied report them to VOSA.
04 January 2007, 08:37 PM
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Split pins, cream jobs they are, a couple of them every year and you're a rich man! I should imagine the garage owner is booking his summer break off your back as I type! 
05 February 2007, 12:26 AM
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no but will charge u 80 quid for 2 hours labour for a two min job some money on a slow day this is the reason i hate going to mechanics they are all a bunch of cowboys
05 February 2007, 01:26 AM
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well unless you told them to fix any failures so that it passes, you'll know the exact problems so that you can go away and sort them without them charging you stupid prices for fitting a split pin.
Sort it and go back. If the pin was missing and the bush was worn, you can't moan. If the problems are fake, you got a good case for complaint/ free re-test.
Sort it and go back. If the pin was missing and the bush was worn, you can't moan. If the problems are fake, you got a good case for complaint/ free re-test.
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05 February 2007, 09:17 AM
#8
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I would say that they did a very good MOT to be honest ... a split pin missing and worn anti-roll bushes could put your life at risk!
I'm with the garage on this one ... give then a break.
However, I do think that garages use MOTs to generate work and most of it not strictly needed ........ take your car in when you are wearing oily overhauls, say you have checked it over and all is fine, wait and watch, it will pass unless they find something genuine!
Last year I saw the Mechanic changing over the numberplate bulb, I stopped him and asked how much it would be, he said £8!!
I popped next door and bought 2 bulbs in a pack for 85p and fitted them myself while they waited!! 
Cheeky, thieving scumbags!
Women haven't a friggin chance in hell of getting away with just the MOT Fee - I always take the wifes car in myself.
I'm with the garage on this one ... give then a break.
However, I do think that garages use MOTs to generate work and most of it not strictly needed ........ take your car in when you are wearing oily overhauls, say you have checked it over and all is fine, wait and watch, it will pass unless they find something genuine!
Last year I saw the Mechanic changing over the numberplate bulb, I stopped him and asked how much it would be, he said £8!!
I popped next door and bought 2 bulbs in a pack for 85p and fitted them myself while they waited!! Cheeky, thieving scumbags!Women haven't a friggin chance in hell of getting away with just the MOT Fee - I always take the wifes car in myself.
05 February 2007, 09:41 AM
#9
Are you able to do the work yourself?. My local MOT station spotted when the mrs had her brake pads changed they had twisted the hoses. He offered me tools and the car park to take the wheel off, twist the calipers back round then he passed it.
There's funny MOT laws that seem to change all the time, he wouldn't let me leave the premises as it would then fail, but would lend me tools etc to take work away from himself.
There's funny MOT laws that seem to change all the time, he wouldn't let me leave the premises as it would then fail, but would lend me tools etc to take work away from himself.
05 February 2007, 10:20 AM
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8 quid for a bulb change is excessive but i've seen up to 20 quid!!!
As for the failure then yeah its good if the problems are genuine, i bet a lot of places wouldn't have spotted that. However my uncle (who runs an mot garage) hinted to me that the DVLA "expects" to see a number of failures. Much the same as driving tests have to have a certain number of failures as we've heard before...
As for the failure then yeah its good if the problems are genuine, i bet a lot of places wouldn't have spotted that. However my uncle (who runs an mot garage) hinted to me that the DVLA "expects" to see a number of failures. Much the same as driving tests have to have a certain number of failures as we've heard before...
05 February 2007, 01:05 PM
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DVLA don't 'expect' any percentage of failure and as a point of fact have tightened up on MOT test stations to make them MOT to the book.
It is now actually more likely that you pass rather than fail as more of the failure modes are advisory rather than fail. Older MOT testers would have failed a lot more cars than they do now. - NOTE THIS WHEN BUYING A SECOND HAND CAR!! - make sure you see all of the MOT paperwork (or check online) for the advisory sheet.
It never ceases to **** me off when i see the annual 'MOT tests joke/harsh/money making comments. You drive around in mostly 300Bhp cars weighing 1.3 tonnes and capable of 3 figures speeds without breaking into a sweat. The one and only deep inspection FOR YOU OWN SAFETY and that of others has you running around like headless chickens penny pinching. Unless you spend every other weekend checking ALL of your car over, not just polishing then grow up. Even regular normal services would not alway pick up (or be looking) for MOT failure items. Ask the site members who use their cars in motorsport events - i bet their personal check and test regime is far better than the normal road user as they are well aware how much their life depends on it.
You should see some of the heaps of dangerous ****e i have had on the ramps over time and listen to the excuses. Women with family cars seem to be the worst - sob stories about the cost but no thinking about the safety of their own children.
Most garages are not charities so yes you will get charged for minor work. Most of them are also human so if you don't take the **** then they may offer to help you, help yourselves.
Top tip - get a service and MOT together, tends to work out far cheaper in the long run
2nd top tip - check your car before you go for a test. Do all the lights work? windscreen wipers, water bottle water. All the things that you should check before you drive anyway. You would never belive the number of time i had to fail cars for no washer bottle water or blocked jets - its not exactly rocket science to do yourself is it?
It is now actually more likely that you pass rather than fail as more of the failure modes are advisory rather than fail. Older MOT testers would have failed a lot more cars than they do now. - NOTE THIS WHEN BUYING A SECOND HAND CAR!! - make sure you see all of the MOT paperwork (or check online) for the advisory sheet.
It never ceases to **** me off when i see the annual 'MOT tests joke/harsh/money making comments. You drive around in mostly 300Bhp cars weighing 1.3 tonnes and capable of 3 figures speeds without breaking into a sweat. The one and only deep inspection FOR YOU OWN SAFETY and that of others has you running around like headless chickens penny pinching. Unless you spend every other weekend checking ALL of your car over, not just polishing then grow up. Even regular normal services would not alway pick up (or be looking) for MOT failure items. Ask the site members who use their cars in motorsport events - i bet their personal check and test regime is far better than the normal road user as they are well aware how much their life depends on it.
You should see some of the heaps of dangerous ****e i have had on the ramps over time and listen to the excuses. Women with family cars seem to be the worst - sob stories about the cost but no thinking about the safety of their own children.
Most garages are not charities so yes you will get charged for minor work. Most of them are also human so if you don't take the **** then they may offer to help you, help yourselves.
Top tip - get a service and MOT together, tends to work out far cheaper in the long run
2nd top tip - check your car before you go for a test. Do all the lights work? windscreen wipers, water bottle water. All the things that you should check before you drive anyway. You would never belive the number of time i had to fail cars for no washer bottle water or blocked jets - its not exactly rocket science to do yourself is it?
Last edited by amahrap; 05 February 2007 at 01:11 PM. Reason: cos i felt like it - ok
05 February 2007, 01:25 PM
#12
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I agree with your point about people complaining about the cost .... then they go and waste ££££££££££££££££'s on such dubious things such as re-maps and CockLinks!!
05 February 2007, 01:35 PM
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Failure
6.1 Windscreens/Drivers View of the road
3. The windscreen washers do not provide enough liquid to clear the windscreen in conjunction with the wiper(s)
I press the button - no water washes the screen, therefore failure.
yes - the lack of a pint of tap water is a failure, as an inspector it is not my job to investigate the cause just to report the findings. The regulations state that you have to test as you find so strictly this is indeed a failure - the clue is in the title MOT Inspector. You would have to fail in the first instance just in case of a surprise VOSA inspection, but most decent testers would fill the bottle and then retest/pass if working.
You are also not allowed to remove items to check them, hence why decats (as long as the pass emissions tests - which some can do) are not MOT failures. I.e. - how do i know that the can in the exhaust is a silencer or a cat just by looking at the outside.
6.1 Windscreens/Drivers View of the road
3. The windscreen washers do not provide enough liquid to clear the windscreen in conjunction with the wiper(s)
I press the button - no water washes the screen, therefore failure.
yes - the lack of a pint of tap water is a failure, as an inspector it is not my job to investigate the cause just to report the findings. The regulations state that you have to test as you find so strictly this is indeed a failure - the clue is in the title MOT Inspector. You would have to fail in the first instance just in case of a surprise VOSA inspection, but most decent testers would fill the bottle and then retest/pass if working.
You are also not allowed to remove items to check them, hence why decats (as long as the pass emissions tests - which some can do) are not MOT failures. I.e. - how do i know that the can in the exhaust is a silencer or a cat just by looking at the outside.
Last edited by amahrap; 05 February 2007 at 01:42 PM. Reason: MOT test maual data added
05 February 2007, 01:39 PM
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Come on mate, 8 quid to change a bulb, you have to admit that is a rip...?
ANyhow, we're not saying you are ripping people off, by the sounds of it you are running a good mot service. What we're saying that a number of MOT garages are/have ripped people off in the past. Cant remember the official figure but i heard on the radio not so long back that the average labour charge for garages was up to £150 per hour in some parts, ****, thats probably more than brain surgeons make.
Another example, i took my scoob to the local "stealer" for a quote on drivers rocker gasket change. I was told "in excess of 300 pounds plus parts as we'll have to drop the engine out. I'm not a mechanic by any means but i can probably do most things if i try. So I went and bought the parts (28 quid) and did it myself in 2 hours without taking the engine out....
These are just examples, there are nice garages and plenty of nice helpful mechanics (i know loads), but as with anything there are @rseholes that are just out to make as much money off people as they can and just dont care.
In response to you comment about DVLA not expecting a certain number of failures, i was just relaying what i was told... dont shoot the messenger as it were, thats why i said who told me...!!!
ANyhow, we're not saying you are ripping people off, by the sounds of it you are running a good mot service. What we're saying that a number of MOT garages are/have ripped people off in the past. Cant remember the official figure but i heard on the radio not so long back that the average labour charge for garages was up to £150 per hour in some parts, ****, thats probably more than brain surgeons make.
Another example, i took my scoob to the local "stealer" for a quote on drivers rocker gasket change. I was told "in excess of 300 pounds plus parts as we'll have to drop the engine out. I'm not a mechanic by any means but i can probably do most things if i try. So I went and bought the parts (28 quid) and did it myself in 2 hours without taking the engine out....
These are just examples, there are nice garages and plenty of nice helpful mechanics (i know loads), but as with anything there are @rseholes that are just out to make as much money off people as they can and just dont care.
In response to you comment about DVLA not expecting a certain number of failures, i was just relaying what i was told... dont shoot the messenger as it were, thats why i said who told me...!!!
05 February 2007, 01:45 PM
#15
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Failure
6.1 Windscreens/Drivers View of the road
3. The windscreen washers do not provide enough liquid to clear the windscreen in conjunction with the wiper(s)
I press the button - no water washes the screen, therefore failure.
yes - the lack of a pint of tap water is a failure, as an inspector it is not my job to investigate the cause just to report the findings. The regulations state that you have to test as you find so strictly this is indeed a failure - the clue is in the title MOT Inspector. You would have to fail in the first instance just in case of a surprise VOSA inspection, but most decent testers would fill the bottle and then retest/pass if working.
You are also not allowed to remove items to check them, hence why decats (as long as the pass emissions tests - which some can do) are not MOT failures. I.e. - how do i know that the can in the exhaust is a silencer or a cat just by looking at the outside.
6.1 Windscreens/Drivers View of the road
3. The windscreen washers do not provide enough liquid to clear the windscreen in conjunction with the wiper(s)
I press the button - no water washes the screen, therefore failure.
yes - the lack of a pint of tap water is a failure, as an inspector it is not my job to investigate the cause just to report the findings. The regulations state that you have to test as you find so strictly this is indeed a failure - the clue is in the title MOT Inspector. You would have to fail in the first instance just in case of a surprise VOSA inspection, but most decent testers would fill the bottle and then retest/pass if working.
You are also not allowed to remove items to check them, hence why decats (as long as the pass emissions tests - which some can do) are not MOT failures. I.e. - how do i know that the can in the exhaust is a silencer or a cat just by looking at the outside.
05 February 2007, 01:51 PM
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I admit that £8 bulb seems a bit high but........
If i raise the paperwork (which assuming an MOT failure i would have too) then VAT and a proportion of hourly rate must be charged. Therefore at a reasonable £35-£40 per hour the cost of the bulb + ten mins labour does work out around £8 ish
The problem with labour rates in garages is all the extra overheads that the customer appreciate/require. Car loan, Coffee, waiting room, magazines for waiting room, MOT test equipment, training, consumables, enviromental charges etc....etc. These costs come out of your pocket, worth remebering next time you jump up and down to demand a loan car!
The running cost overheads of even a small garage are a real eye opener. Modern diagnotic equipment (a must if you want to stay in business) is staggeringly expensive.
If i raise the paperwork (which assuming an MOT failure i would have too) then VAT and a proportion of hourly rate must be charged. Therefore at a reasonable £35-£40 per hour the cost of the bulb + ten mins labour does work out around £8 ish
The problem with labour rates in garages is all the extra overheads that the customer appreciate/require. Car loan, Coffee, waiting room, magazines for waiting room, MOT test equipment, training, consumables, enviromental charges etc....etc. These costs come out of your pocket, worth remebering next time you jump up and down to demand a loan car!
The running cost overheads of even a small garage are a real eye opener. Modern diagnotic equipment (a must if you want to stay in business) is staggeringly expensive.
05 February 2007, 01:59 PM
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Station Garage in Emsworth
I help set up the business and worked there part time. I am an aircraft engineer by trade so i only see the world in black and white - aircraft don't have laybys to pull into at 20'000ft so things are either right or wrong. I'm now a butt shining Civil Servant in Smoke but still work when i can - my mate is far too honest to run the garage on his own, he gets depressed and upset when people treat him like he is ripping them off. So much so that he is thinking of closing and doing something else which would be a shame as honest mechanics are hard to find........There are some out there that can be trusted
If you suspect an iffy MOT then complain - the test station is duty bound to help you with the complaint proceedure - if they don't help then report them.
Most inspectors will also show you the problem if you bother to ask them as well if you suspect something dogey
I help set up the business and worked there part time. I am an aircraft engineer by trade so i only see the world in black and white - aircraft don't have laybys to pull into at 20'000ft so things are either right or wrong. I'm now a butt shining Civil Servant in Smoke but still work when i can - my mate is far too honest to run the garage on his own, he gets depressed and upset when people treat him like he is ripping them off. So much so that he is thinking of closing and doing something else which would be a shame as honest mechanics are hard to find........There are some out there that can be trusted
If you suspect an iffy MOT then complain - the test station is duty bound to help you with the complaint proceedure - if they don't help then report them.
Most inspectors will also show you the problem if you bother to ask them as well if you suspect something dogey
05 February 2007, 02:00 PM
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I totally agree about the overheads, some of the prices for the gear are unbeleiveable, but as you just said, your charge 30-40 quid an hour, which sounds about what i'd expect to pay, 150 is silly money.
When you consider what i said before about the gaskets, if they didnt drop my engine and did it the way i did, and probably quicker as they work on scoobs all day. That equates to 150 quid an hour...
I wish all garages were like yours sound like, decent labour charges and thorough work, but sadly it isnt that way. And i live too far away to visit yours!!!
When you consider what i said before about the gaskets, if they didnt drop my engine and did it the way i did, and probably quicker as they work on scoobs all day. That equates to 150 quid an hour...
I wish all garages were like yours sound like, decent labour charges and thorough work, but sadly it isnt that way. And i live too far away to visit yours!!!
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