EVO vs IMPREZA
11 July 2000, 04:54 PM
#1
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Anyone have any experience with going head to head with EVO's ? That is apart from what is already published in magazines ... do UK Imprezas with Intake and Exhaust mods have any chance against say an EVO6 ? If not what needs to be done ???
11 July 2000, 05:00 PM
#2
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I thought we had done away with these vs threads.
Do the maths, EVO6 280BHP bucket loads of torque, UK impreza with breathing mods, 230'ish BHP about 230 lb/ft of torque, ie no chance. An STi is a different matter though.
Do the maths, EVO6 280BHP bucket loads of torque, UK impreza with breathing mods, 230'ish BHP about 230 lb/ft of torque, ie no chance. An STi is a different matter though.
11 July 2000, 05:20 PM
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These questions are irrelevant anyway. If the driver you come up against is far more talented than you, he will beat you. For the doubting Thomases amongst you, here is a quote from this weeks Motoring News for you:
"Colin McRae has confirmed that he will be driving his own Ford Escort on the McRae stages in August.........."
"Last time he contested a Scottish Championship rally in an Escort he was the outright winner, beating four wheel drive opposition in his uncles RS2000....."
I know McRae is a special case, but I think it proves a point, as the championship regulars will be no slouches!
So, don't be too concerned whether this is better, or that is better, just enjoy the car you have chosen.
Geezer
[This message has been edited by Geezer (edited 11-07-2000).]
"Colin McRae has confirmed that he will be driving his own Ford Escort on the McRae stages in August.........."
"Last time he contested a Scottish Championship rally in an Escort he was the outright winner, beating four wheel drive opposition in his uncles RS2000....."
I know McRae is a special case, but I think it proves a point, as the championship regulars will be no slouches!
So, don't be too concerned whether this is better, or that is better, just enjoy the car you have chosen.
Geezer
[This message has been edited by Geezer (edited 11-07-2000).]
11 July 2000, 07:29 PM
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until 2 months ago i owned a 99my uk scooby i have replaced it with an evo 6 and i can honestly say the scooby doesn't stand a chance as long as iv'e a hole in my a$rse,now before some clever dick starts wearing his/her keyboard out saying why i'm wrong just don't...you can't allow for driver difference because iv'e driven both and i know!!!!!!!as for what to do to your scoob ,sell it 
[This message has been edited by S600BYY (edited 11-07-2000).]
[This message has been edited by S600BYY (edited 11-07-2000).]
[This message has been edited by S600BYY (edited 11-07-2000).]
[This message has been edited by S600BYY (edited 11-07-2000).]
11 July 2000, 08:53 PM
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Sorry, I disagree.
A UK car with breathing mods is perfectly capable of staying with an EVO VI, at least on track.
The EVO drivers in question were all wearing racing overalls and boots too, so they must be good drivers!
Stef.
A UK car with breathing mods is perfectly capable of staying with an EVO VI, at least on track.
The EVO drivers in question were all wearing racing overalls and boots too, so they must be good drivers!
Stef.
11 July 2000, 09:08 PM
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so on that note if i put on a man utd shirt and shorts does that qualify to play at old trafford? if you have owned both above cars then i will listen to your arguement however if your comments are based on watching someone else drive a car or even a test drive you have no idea what an evo is capable of ,now i'm not saying a scoob is a bad car because the only reason i sold mine was yo beat the resale value drop which will occour when the new model is launched,i will revert back to a scoob once said car is launshed...(if i like it)[This message has been edited by S600BYY (edited 11-07-2000).]
[This message has been edited by S600BYY (edited 15-07-2000).]
11 July 2000, 09:15 PM
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S600BYY
The only reason you sold a Scooby was because of fears of depreciation. Why buy an EVO then. Ralliart cars that are 6 months old with a few extras are being sold for 25K. ex Ian Foster and my dealer. Thats about 7K in six months hardly a model of solid resale values.
Jonathan
EVO eating P1.
[This message has been edited by Jonathan (edited 11-07-2000).]
The only reason you sold a Scooby was because of fears of depreciation. Why buy an EVO then. Ralliart cars that are 6 months old with a few extras are being sold for 25K. ex Ian Foster and my dealer. Thats about 7K in six months hardly a model of solid resale values.
Jonathan
EVO eating P1.
[This message has been edited by Jonathan (edited 11-07-2000).]
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11 July 2000, 09:24 PM
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Just to add another element to this "my ***** is bigger than yours" discussion...
I just read in the German "Auto Motor und Sport" about a probable street version Focus Cosworth 4x4 with (they said) 310 PS !! I thought this might just be a typo but they also said 0 - 100 k would be < 5 secs.
I think both the Jappies had better watch out.
I guess it won't be cheap (the Escort Cosworth wasn't) - especially if they use something like the same X-trac gearbox they have on the WRC.
It will almost certainly tempt me - having driven RS Escort since 1983
I just read in the German "Auto Motor und Sport" about a probable street version Focus Cosworth 4x4 with (they said) 310 PS !! I thought this might just be a typo but they also said 0 - 100 k would be < 5 secs.
I think both the Jappies had better watch out.
I guess it won't be cheap (the Escort Cosworth wasn't) - especially if they use something like the same X-trac gearbox they have on the WRC.
It will almost certainly tempt me - having driven RS Escort since 1983
11 July 2000, 09:30 PM
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evo eating p1 ;kiss my 4r$3 my scoob i got new at a cost of 21000 as a part x i got 19000 for it now i only paid 21000 for the evo if however i had kept my scoob until launch of new model i would be able to kiss goodbye to much more than £2000 i can't however take credit for this shrewd move that honour must go to my best mate at a scoob dealer
11 July 2000, 09:31 PM
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SCOOBYY.
You see those smilies.....
Anyhow, my point was that out of all the EVO's I've ever seen on a track (quite a few), none have been able to leave my UK car.
I'm sure at least one of the drivers was as 'enthusiastic' as me, so I think it's a fair comparison.
Where's Andrew Bolton when you need him?
Swiss Steve.
Scoobs are capable of 0-100km/h in less than 5 secs with only 240ps!
Stef.
You see those smilies.....
Anyhow, my point was that out of all the EVO's I've ever seen on a track (quite a few), none have been able to leave my UK car.
I'm sure at least one of the drivers was as 'enthusiastic' as me, so I think it's a fair comparison.
Where's Andrew Bolton when you need him?
Swiss Steve.
Scoobs are capable of 0-100km/h in less than 5 secs with only 240ps!
Stef.
11 July 2000, 09:43 PM
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i know i contribute to these "DEBATES"but isn't the evo vs scoob story getting a bit like the chicken and egg saga?they are both storming motors,,,enough said,enjoy
[This message has been edited by S600BYY (edited 11-07-2000).]
[This message has been edited by S600BYY (edited 11-07-2000).]
11 July 2000, 10:22 PM
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I have both a 98uk scoob with ppp and an evo6.The evo is certainly quicker than the scoob but not by a massive amount, Where the evo really scores is in the handling and braking departments the car feels much more focussed. I did consider a sti instead of the evo and although it felt as quick as the evo i preferred the handling of the evo. One way the scoob beats the evo is in sound, both cars have full systems minus cats scoobsport on the scoob and mongoose on the evo. I was going to get rid of the scoob when the evo arrived but i never seemed to get around to it, so now i have the best of both worlds.Happy but broke. Andy
11 July 2000, 10:26 PM
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My UK MY97 with exhuast and breathing mods, had two different runnings with a friends EVO 6. In the dry, the EVO kept pulling away. In the wet different story, I kept pulling away from him. He was not a happy boy.
Goes to show that the weather has an awful lot to do with things.
Dan
Goes to show that the weather has an awful lot to do with things.
Dan
12 July 2000, 12:05 AM
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Stef
You're a lovely man, and have far more track experience than myself, but...
Sorry mate, an EVO6 will trounce a UK scooby with breathing mods (assuming the same tyres).
As I have said before. It's all about the driver.
Like Ian Cook said, its a simple question of maths and common sense.
I still prefer the scooby for fun, but you need to be realistic. There is NO way you can draw conclusions from even 200 fun / track days.
But you're still lovely
Regards
Simon
You're a lovely man, and have far more track experience than myself, but...
Sorry mate, an EVO6 will trounce a UK scooby with breathing mods (assuming the same tyres).
As I have said before. It's all about the driver.
Like Ian Cook said, its a simple question of maths and common sense.
I still prefer the scooby for fun, but you need to be realistic. There is NO way you can draw conclusions from even 200 fun / track days.
But you're still lovely
Regards
Simon
12 July 2000, 12:33 AM
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On a lighter note, Zoe's Mitsi and my Scooby are just about to have pups, crack open the champagne! light up the fat lady!
BTW Scooby and Mitsi are Guinea Pigs, no kidding, If you tickle scoobys back he does a bang on impression of a boxer engine burble - cool chap!
Any suggestions for the names for the pups?
Howie
Scooby ******** Mitsi ;-)
[This message has been edited by Howie (edited 12-07-2000).]
BTW Scooby and Mitsi are Guinea Pigs, no kidding, If you tickle scoobys back he does a bang on impression of a boxer engine burble - cool chap!
Any suggestions for the names for the pups?
Howie
Scooby ******** Mitsi ;-)
[This message has been edited by Howie (edited 12-07-2000).]
12 July 2000, 12:40 AM
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Mark/S600BY
Glad your enjoying your Evo, they are the nuts and so are Scoobs. Stef, put R Burns behind the wheel of a 306 GTI and he'll probable be as quick as you in your Scoob, mind you your Leather Cod Piece is worth 30 BHP (I know your probable getting bored of it now but for God sake man drive by a window of a shop and look at your car
).
Mark/S600BY wheres my ST2 paint ya bandit.
Glad your enjoying your Evo, they are the nuts and so are Scoobs. Stef, put R Burns behind the wheel of a 306 GTI and he'll probable be as quick as you in your Scoob, mind you your Leather Cod Piece is worth 30 BHP (I know your probable getting bored of it now but for God sake man drive by a window of a shop and look at your car
).Mark/S600BY wheres my ST2 paint ya bandit.
12 July 2000, 01:03 AM
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I really wonder where a lot of these "Impreza vs Car X" threads are coming from. The only thing that a lot of the people who intitiate or reply to these threads seem interested in, is who can win some hypothetical (or not) road-race along an A/B road, or be quickest on the track.
If the objective is _really_ to get from A-B as quickly as possible, then why not take the motorway, a train, or fly? Can anyone seriously tell me that in 99.99% of driving on the road, the limiting factor of which of these vehicles is quickest is _really_ the car, and not the skill (or in a lot of cases) insanity of the driver?
AND IN ANY CASE WHO CARES? Isn't the way in which all these threads judge which is the "better" car just totally missing the point? Aren't people on this BBS meant to be be enthusiats, interested in the finer points of driving such as weighting and feedback from controls, how the car "feels" on the road, how adjustable it is? All this seems to have been sacrificed on the infantile "my car's faster than your car" alter of 0-60mph and, 0-100mph times, and on being 0.1s quicker around a particular track.
Personnally I'm beginning to think that in today's increasingly speed-controlled world, and for the vast majority of British roads, something like a Lotus Elise or Porsche 968 Club Sport may be the "better" car for me to buy next, rather than an Sti/Evo. I may get home 10 minutes later than the impreza, but could well have a bigger smile on my face?
Gary.
If the objective is _really_ to get from A-B as quickly as possible, then why not take the motorway, a train, or fly? Can anyone seriously tell me that in 99.99% of driving on the road, the limiting factor of which of these vehicles is quickest is _really_ the car, and not the skill (or in a lot of cases) insanity of the driver?
AND IN ANY CASE WHO CARES? Isn't the way in which all these threads judge which is the "better" car just totally missing the point? Aren't people on this BBS meant to be be enthusiats, interested in the finer points of driving such as weighting and feedback from controls, how the car "feels" on the road, how adjustable it is? All this seems to have been sacrificed on the infantile "my car's faster than your car" alter of 0-60mph and, 0-100mph times, and on being 0.1s quicker around a particular track.
Personnally I'm beginning to think that in today's increasingly speed-controlled world, and for the vast majority of British roads, something like a Lotus Elise or Porsche 968 Club Sport may be the "better" car for me to buy next, rather than an Sti/Evo. I may get home 10 minutes later than the impreza, but could well have a bigger smile on my face?
Gary.
12 July 2000, 10:17 AM
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Why compare a 220bhp £20k car available in the UK with a 280bhp £30k one that has to be imported? 
At least compare the Evo6 to the STi, that's a bit more meaningful.
If I had a bit more money (& mechanical sense) I'd buy a less powerful road car and have a second non-road-legal car for track days. Oh, and a trailer to cart the thing around. And a garage. And a race suit. And a helmet.
At least compare the Evo6 to the STi, that's a bit more meaningful.If I had a bit more money (& mechanical sense) I'd buy a less powerful road car and have a second non-road-legal car for track days. Oh, and a trailer to cart the thing around. And a garage. And a race suit. And a helmet.
12 July 2000, 01:17 PM
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How many people have actually raced, and I mean foot to the floor, flat-out, on-the-limit, ignoring all speed limits, against an EVO VI on the road to discover which is the fastest?
Hopefully the answer is nobody. And thus should end this silly thread (and all other VS threads...)
Hopefully the answer is nobody. And thus should end this silly thread (and all other VS threads...)
12 July 2000, 05:14 PM
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Guys..........
I can only assume that the general consensus of opinion is against "better than " posts because there might be other cars (God forbid) that are better.
Everybody wants to own the best car hence the arguments. Natural I'd say.
Having owned two UK modified Scoobs and an EVO VI the point is that the EVO feels the faster car by some margin. I can't comment about an STi.
Understeer is the bane of any sports car, and the fact remains that the EVO understeers considerably less than the Scoob, UK Sti or otherwise. Add in the AYC which turns understeer into oversteer by simple throttle application, and hence you have a more capable and fun car to drive.
I'm afraid its as simple as that. I am naturally bound to say its the quicker as a consequence. But I have no proof.
Modified Scoobs can naturally improve and beat the EVO as a consequence in some areas, but I still feel the EVO is the more balanced all round performance car, and without needing modification.
Steve
I can only assume that the general consensus of opinion is against "better than " posts because there might be other cars (God forbid) that are better.
Everybody wants to own the best car hence the arguments. Natural I'd say.
Having owned two UK modified Scoobs and an EVO VI the point is that the EVO feels the faster car by some margin. I can't comment about an STi.
Understeer is the bane of any sports car, and the fact remains that the EVO understeers considerably less than the Scoob, UK Sti or otherwise. Add in the AYC which turns understeer into oversteer by simple throttle application, and hence you have a more capable and fun car to drive.
I'm afraid its as simple as that. I am naturally bound to say its the quicker as a consequence. But I have no proof.
Modified Scoobs can naturally improve and beat the EVO as a consequence in some areas, but I still feel the EVO is the more balanced all round performance car, and without needing modification.
Steve
12 July 2000, 05:19 PM
#26
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Hi Stef. I'm here, lurking
I've responded to so many of these Evo vs Scooby articles that I don't usually bother.
I had an MY98 Terzo with filter & exhaust. Unfortunately never took it on the track. I now have an Evo 6 with filter/exhaust/suspension. Which I've done 4 trackdays in. If I drove my old car back to back, I'm pretty sure that my Donington 1:30 Evo lap would be around 2 or 3s slower in the Scoob. Merely cos I can pretty much do what I like in the Evo and it never bites (well, not yet, anyway). I've had to manoever around spinning Scoobs that have spun in front of me going no quicker (ok, could have done something silly, but there we are).
The Evo just inspires more confidence. Same story on the road. The AYC just gives you more ultimate cornering speed before it starts to give way.
However, as many people have pointed out, the difference is minimal.
Flat out, the long straight at Donington I can eat about 1-2 car lengths out a UK Scoob, and nothing out an STI (on those rare occasions when I've exited the previous corner at the same speed )
I'm not saying its a better car - the Scoob <B>is</B> probably more involving, but round a track, with similar drivers, the Evo will definitely beat a UK Scoob and probably beat an STI, but neither by much. And on the road the same.
And Jon, which particular Evo has your P1 eaten? I don't recall seeing you on the track in it?
I've responded to so many of these Evo vs Scooby articles that I don't usually bother.
I had an MY98 Terzo with filter & exhaust. Unfortunately never took it on the track. I now have an Evo 6 with filter/exhaust/suspension. Which I've done 4 trackdays in. If I drove my old car back to back, I'm pretty sure that my Donington 1:30 Evo lap would be around 2 or 3s slower in the Scoob. Merely cos I can pretty much do what I like in the Evo and it never bites (well, not yet, anyway). I've had to manoever around spinning Scoobs that have spun in front of me going no quicker (ok, could have done something silly, but there we are).
The Evo just inspires more confidence. Same story on the road. The AYC just gives you more ultimate cornering speed before it starts to give way.
However, as many people have pointed out, the difference is minimal.
Flat out, the long straight at Donington I can eat about 1-2 car lengths out a UK Scoob, and nothing out an STI (on those rare occasions when I've exited the previous corner at the same speed
)I'm not saying its a better car - the Scoob <B>is</B> probably more involving, but round a track, with similar drivers, the Evo will definitely beat a UK Scoob and probably beat an STI, but neither by much. And on the road the same.
And Jon, which particular Evo has your P1 eaten? I don't recall seeing you on the track in it?
12 July 2000, 05:22 PM
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Steve,
Ther reason people are against thses arguments are that they serve no purpose whatsoever. As people have said, alot depends on the driver. Public highways are not the place for ***** out comparison driving to see which car performs in a particular area better than any other.
You buy a car for reasons <B> you </B> choose, so enjoy your car, and stop slating other peoples. You wouldn't like it if someone said "my wifes better than yours because........", because you chose her (assuming you are married, of course), so you think she's pretty good.
Geezer
Ther reason people are against thses arguments are that they serve no purpose whatsoever. As people have said, alot depends on the driver. Public highways are not the place for ***** out comparison driving to see which car performs in a particular area better than any other.
You buy a car for reasons <B> you </B> choose, so enjoy your car, and stop slating other peoples. You wouldn't like it if someone said "my wifes better than yours because........", because you chose her (assuming you are married, of course), so you think she's pretty good.
Geezer
12 July 2000, 05:26 PM
#28
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Boltona.
Need to make sure I'm at Donington next time you are. Could do with some competition, relatively speaking Have come up against a load of EVO 5,s but not 6s.
Don't know how many car lengths I take out of a UK car - waddya reckon Stef?
Need to make sure I'm at Donington next time you are. Could do with some competition, relatively speaking
Have come up against a load of EVO 5,s but not 6s. Don't know how many car lengths I take out of a UK car - waddya reckon Stef?
12 July 2000, 05:31 PM
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Reminds me of an old saying we used to say amongst ourselves. A friend was convinced his 911 was faster than my 1.2 corsa merit. We used to say:
"Its not the car, its the driver"
I agree with Marc (S600BYY) 100% and unless you have driven both, you dont know ****
"Its not the car, its the driver"
I agree with Marc (S600BYY) 100% and unless you have driven both, you dont know ****