ricardo

I keep seeing news that 'gas-guzzling 4x4s' should be banned. The Sunday Times had a piece on how Edinburgh wants to use tolls to keep '4x4s' out of the city, and in Autocar it talks about how Paris wants to ban them, plus talk of a proposed huge tax hike on them in France. Some politicians want 'to see 4x4s banned from the school run'. Quite exactly how isn't explained...

So - what's a 4x4 then ? I can see that a Scoob might qualify literally, after it does guzzle gas and it does have 4 driven wheels. But a 4x4 - I wouldn't say so. BMW X5 yes, likewise Cayenne, various Land Rovers, and so on.

A Forester ? Probably. Forester STi ? Maybe.
Fiat Panda 4x4 ? Well, it says it is, but is it the sort they are on about ?
Evo ? Hmmm, maybe too low, and certainly not agricultural.

Are only tall ones 4x4s ? (Or at least have tall wobbly tyres ?). Maybe only ones that have a spare wheel on the back door ? Or special low ratio gearboxes ? Or driven by people with green wellies ? Vehicles whose primary purpose is to drive off-road, or those which are simply marketed as such ?

So, given the extraordinary stupidity normally exhibited by the powers that be, is there a risk that the Impreza will be classified as a 4x4, making our ownership even more expensive than it is already ?

16vmarc

Dont be silly

Scooby23

iTrader: (1)

PMSL

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Hmmm, I never gave that scenario any thought, should be fun if this legislation ever comes to the surface

The term "4x4" is given to a vehicle that has 4 wheels that are all driven, so a 2wd car is a 4x2, a 6wheel, 3 axle truck with 2 driven axles is a 6x4. You get the idea.

So, a scooby IS a 4x4.

Now the report refers to off roaders. I think these journo's need to research what they are blabbing about before typing it into a report

Daft thing is you can get 2wd (4x2 ) "off-roaders", well, soft roaders such as base model Suzuki Vitaras. So what applies to them?

TBH if the powers that be had common sense, they'd just put huge taxes onto fuel guzzling vehicles, which would include offroaders, most 4x4s or whatever. Oh hang on, a scooby is a gas guzzler. Oh dear!

Dazza01

i knew i should have payed more attention in the maths class

Graz

Mine guzzles gas as well

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

although 4x4 is 16

I've never seen an sixteen wheeled off-roader that's not in the military

Abdabz

Good question is this ricardo - what about quad bikes too?

It could never work ( 4x4 ban that is) - cant wait to see the white paper...
P

Senior_AP

They refer to what is known as a "4x4". A scoob is a 4wd but not a 4x4

They mean Jeep Cherokee, Range Rover etc. The ones that do 12mpg whilst taking the little ****s to school.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

It is a 4x4 by technical definition though...it has 4 wheels which are all driven....4 by 4.

austen_wrx

They already do it, its called fuel tax!

WR1 Bro

I've got a Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4.7 V8. Fitted with a rather nice induction kit and it is about 280 BHP (approx). That averages 16.5 miles per gallon with a mixture of very heavy right foot and slightly heavy right foot. With a constant heavy foot you are looking at 14miles per gallon. If you are calm with it and extremely boring then you can get it to return 22miles per gallon. Surely that is reasonable????

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Reasonable by scooby standards

Dracoro

The cloudy area is still there with the likes of the Audi Allroad and Forester. Would these be classed as off roaders or 4wd estates? What about that volvo thingy?

Brendan Hughes

In Portugal cars seem to be classified, I think for tax reasons (there was a tax break for industrial use 4x4s a year or two ago, and suddenly the world and his wife needed one for work). Forester is listed as a jeep, can't remember about the Allroad.

I'm also against people using a sodding great Land Cruiser as a Chelsea tractor, on "green" grounds, but I have trouble explaining why. Many big-engined saloons also do sub-20mpg, and their weight is creeping up to 1.8 tonnes or over in some cases. The only factor left is the damage these things do to other people in an accident, apparently, and the fact that they roll over easier, apparently.

ricardo

I guess my point was that IF the authorities feel the need to classify vehicles in this way then given their usual track record the criteria for that classification are unlikely to be very sophisticated (ie. stupid), so there may be some unexpected classifications as a result.

In reality I suspect it is the usual shrill hysteria, whipped up by the press. Isn't a Gallardo a 4x4, I can't see that falling over very easily either...

Dracoro

So it looks as some areas will be made a no go area for all big 4x4's, all subarus, all audi quattros, vw r32, 4motion, seat/skoda 4wd, lambo mercialago, TT's, new Bentley GT continental, Sierra cossies, skylines, pulsars/sunny gtrs. gosh, this list is growing.

speedking

A more interesting classification problem arises with vehicles like the Honda CRV which are 2WD unless the front wheels lose traction when it becomes a 4WD Presumably these would be allowed on dry days, but not on a frosty morning

Unenforceable.

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Or what about old series Land Rovers, and Fronteras and such?...they are normally 2 wheel drive, until you manually engage 4wd.

SC008Y_MAD

iTrader: (5)

No. I think that what they are talking about are the Land Rovers, Range Rovers, Lexus 4x4 thingy. Honda Rav 4, Toyota Amazon Land Crusier etc... not Scoobys or evo's they are like normal road car, but with AWD systems andalso inc Audi's Quattros - RS4, RS6 etc... these are normal road car that have AWD to give better grip in all weathers That wel know, but the big off roader as mentioned above ( Land Rovers, Range Rovers, Lexus 4x4 thingy. Honda Rav 4, Toyota Amazon Land Crusier ) take up too much road space pollute the atmosphere too much more so that a normal car and aslo i think it might be that the prople that drive them ( women) don't fully not how to drive the properbly...thats not to say the women drivers are bad it just that some women don't know how to handle big cars. (ill think ill leave that topic alone for new, just in case i 'step on someones toes')

So to sum up i think it will not affect Scoobys, (not sure on the forester), Evos, Audi, thet are in a different catergory.

fuz

what about the spare wheel

messiah

Unenforcable.

I agree the amount of 4x4's on the road chesses me off as I always like to be able to see a couple of cars in front if i'm in a line of traffic - but you can't deny people choice on something like that.

Brendan Hughes

"Honda Rav 4"

Have trouble banning those

I've a 2.0 diesel Rav4, it weighs the same and gives the same economy (thereabouts) as a BMW530d. I bought it as a family MPV rather than a "jeep". I've been a thousand kilometres across Mongolian steppe in a Land Rover and a Jeep Cherokee, I know what jeeps are really for and they aren't for nipping to the shops. It straddles the line as to what I think is acceptable for a vehicle in my situation (not commuting, I do that by train).

Height is another argument. But this then catches many new MPVs.

Maybe they'll work out a scoring system based on height, weight, fuel consumption, crash risk to other cars or pedestrians, etc etc etc. And remember, 4x4 is perfectly acceptable for those who suffer regular snowfall in winter, say.

ricardo

http://news.scotsman.com/features.cfm?id=664882004

Highlights:
A 4x4 allows a driver to use all four wheels at the same time, giving better grip, especially on rough or slippery ground, so are particularly designed for rough terrain.


Hmmm... watch out Scoobs ! Using all four wheels at the same time is a big no-no !

Iain Young

My dads 3.0 TD Isuzu Trooper is more economical than my scoob (and his previous Rover 418 diesel) and I can park it in a smaller space than my brothers MG ZT, yet they want to ban them because they are too big and thirsty!! Plus, if you're going to ban cars because you cant see past them on the road, then you ought to ban all the MPVs, scoobs with pimp tints, vans, lorries etc because you can't see past them either.

If you can't see past the car in front, then yer driving too close anyway so it shouldn't be a problem if people are driving sensibly....

NotoriousREV

I don't see why the Government or anybody else should decide what I drive on a daily basis and as enthiusiasts we should all be concerned that this bill doesn't see the light of day as once they've hammered 4x4's they'll be after pointless sportscars and the like, after all you can only do 70mph legally anyway.

If they do ban 4x4's I'm buying an Alvis Stalwart, it's 6x6 and fuel consumption measured in GPM

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

If it ever does get enforced - I'm buying a DUKW and drive to work on the river!

P.Cole

if u look on the back window of ur car we actualy drive AWD cars it dont say how many wheels is drive just All of em