BOB.T

A mate of mine wanted some help on a project so I said I'd help out, being the nice knida guy that I am

To cut a long story short, my mate has a mate with a Lotus 340R / R340 thingy and wants us to fit a scooby engine to it!!! I turned up tonight thinking, we'll just rip the engine outta this scoob, it'll just be some knacker that's fooked.... it's only a mint as ya like RA!!

It brought a tear to my eye...for about a second, then I thought "what 'kin knightmare to work on"!!

Anyhoo, I have a couple of questions,

My mate drove the car, he says it drives really well but when it reaches 4000rpm it misfires, almost like hitting the rev limiter, he's certain it's an electrical / management problem, anyone got any theories...obviously the car is in bits now so we can't drive it for a while!

Secondly, the Lotus is rear engined so what we plan to do is run it in 2wd form, using what are now the front driveshafts as the rears, well only shafts actually!! Has anyone tried this before? Obviously the centre diff isn't gonna be right chuffed with having no prop and I can't see it being impressed if we just lock the rear part solid! Having said that, would the RA have a viscous centre diff? I still can't see it being that happy though!

I'd really apreciate your comments / help on this one and I'll try get some pics as the project develops

Cheers

Bob

PS the remains of the car have to go back so it's unlikely anything will be for sale but, I can ask...anything that makes the engine work is definately off the list for now though

johnfelstead

is it an STi RA or plain jane RA?

johnfelstead

Confusious says, fix problem before ripping its guts out.

quicksprint

Got to be a wind up...everyone knows that a Lotus is really a Proton in disguise.
Besides they fall to bits and can't handle the power of the R*ver k-series !!!!

BOB.T

Hi John

I guess it's just a plain Jane one, it doesn't have red inlets... no spoiler either, looks well odd!

Just thought, there's no STI badges on it either

BOB.T

yeah, the link between the all alloy chassis on the Lotus and Proton is uncanny

I swear to God this is a real project.

MTR

Bob,
One of the attendees on NM3 had a speedo cable melt on him,and the speedo stopped working.His engine went into limp home mode, and would not exceed 4000 rpm.
Rember reading similar posts about relevant sensor/s on the gearbox/speedo being required to function to allow full rev range capability.
If the engine can go past the 4K rough spot then presumably that isn't the cause in this case.
Worth a look perhaps.

Cheers MTR

BOB.T

Cheers Martin

As far as I'm aware, the speedo still works...the chap commented on it being very short geared for the speed he was doing. I'm sure that will be worth noting for the refit though, thanks

Oh, the engine check light is on.

johnfelstead

is it a phase 1 or phase 2 engine bob?

johnfelstead

oh, the AWD system on the Impreza is based on a 2wd gearbox, they used to sell FWD impreza's. My pal Jamie in the USA rallied a FWD 1.8 Impreza last year, so there will be a way to convert it to 2wd, even if that means getting a 2WD gearbox.

johnfelstead

do you plan on running the gearbox at the back or front of the engine?

P.S i think you are off your rocker doing this to a 340R

greasemonkey

Agreed with the off-rocker comment. This gonna be mare to implement.

Thinking about the design of the 'box, locking/bypassing the centre diff shouldn't in itself prove difficult. The supply shaft to the "front" diff runs inside the hollow gearbox output shaft, so can think of a number of way in which the two could be locked together, allowing the centre diff and drop gears/prop drive to be completely removed.

An unknown question though would be how long the transmission, and the "front" diff in particular would handle all the torque. Believe all the official FWD Imprezas were 1.6 or 1.8 normally aspirated, (unless Jamie knows better John?), so it's not like the 2WD transmission would ever have been designed to cope with a turbo engine's output.

[Edited by greasemonkey - 9/23/2003 11:39:42 PM]

BOB.T

Haven't a clue what phase it is, I should've mentioned it's an MY93 though!

Everything will be in the same orientation as it would be in a scoob except it will only drive the car's rear wheels. The 2wd box sounds like the best option to me It will have a new rear cradle deigned for it, the wheelbase will have to be longer aswell. It's gonna have a custom suspension set up too, I've seen previous jobs that my mate has done, I can't wait to see this one!

I agree it sounds like a completely bonkers project but the plot thickens! Basically the guy wrote the Lotus off, bought it back, had repair work started, realised it was gonna cost more than the price of a new one, then came up with this plan!!!

Actually no, it IS a bonkers project, I don't know how I keep getting involved!

RON

So, let me get this straight, this guy, owned a Lotus 340R, wrote it off, didn't have fully comp ins, (mad) started to repair it, (mad) then bought a scoob, (not so mad) and proceeded to trash that too, (mad) and he even took the scoob to bits when it had a problem, (mad) so when are the men in white coats coming for him?????????

BOB.T

Cheers Grease

I agree re the front diff, effectively it's gonna have it's work doubled, that said the car will be signifcantly lighter than a scoob, all up I can't see it topping 700KG, what's a scoob? Would you be interested in operating on the gearbox? I should say, I'm not leading this project and it's not for me to hire or fire folk but if you know the boxes.... we're at Keighley, near Bradford. Also, I couldn't say when the job would come up, if at all.

Another point, changing gear will be fun, what with the gear lever being a good few feet behind the driver now

My God, what have we started!!

johnfelstead

the FWD Imprezas were only NA, so i think you are asking a huge amount from it. You could weld the diff, that might give more strength, but the handling will be hopeless unless you are grass tracking.

You can weld the shaft and throw away the rear end of the gearbox/centre diff etc. It will work, but will it handle the torque? I supose its worth trying as the car only weighs half an impreza, so should spin the wheels and not transfer too much torque as long as you stay off grippy tyres.

Its a phase one engine you have. Are you retaining the engine wiring loom? as the signal wires for the MAF sensor for example are screened, if you run unscreen wires it will never run properly.

BOB.T

You're almost there RON

It belongs to my mates, mate, he's in south Africa. I forget now exactly what happened, it was either written off and he bought it back or it was a race school car that got crashed and he bought it off them...I dunno, it's all been going on for over a year now and I'm not directly involved, I'm external, after hours, additional workforce if you will

I agree, it is barking but it pays

ALi-B

iTrader: (1)

Hang on here, The gearbox itself i.e the gears have to cope with the same power and torque

The difference is the output drives and transfer bits that make it 4wd. So the only part(s) that should be of concern is the diff and the driveshafts.

Also bear in mind that this is now 2wd there is more give in terms of wheelspin so there should be less wind up and shock loads than 4wd (think of dumping clucth at 4000rpm....2wd loads of wheelspin, 4wd hardly any - that wheelspin is saving the gearbox a hell of a battering)

Might be worth checking if the RA has a LSD on the front diff


[Edited by ALi-B - 9/24/2003 12:08:35 AM]

owbow

where's the original engine going? will it be up for sale?

O.

Gary C

Why is he butchering a 340R!, much rarer than the RA !

The 340R came with the same VHPD engine as the Exige with 190bhp. Surely a Scooby engine would destroy the handling balance of this light weight car completly.

They maybe as ugly as f*** but to chop one to fit a scooby engine seems very strange.

Edited to correct my spelling, Doh !

[Edited by Gary C - 9/24/2003 6:06:50 PM]

Type R

I agree, what does the Scoob engine + gearbox weigh compared to the VHPD?

HONDA K20A might go and suit the 340R better, and this has been fitted to S1, S2, and Exige with great success.

S55DRJ

i beleive the cars wheelbase will have to be longer, as the shatfs will have to be that much further back, we looked at a similar project in a darrian, a 2wd gearbox will work, with a plated front diff, and gearkit modifications... but still MAD...drove a 340R the other day.. dont spoil it!!

BOB.T

Well, we spoken to a Subaru dealership today, they say you can remove the transfer case and run in 2wd so then it's just a case of blanking off any holes to stop oil pouring out! I think the diff might take a beating but as you guys point out, it'll most likely spin up than snap! I guess time will tell

The wheel base will be altered, at the moment there's a galvanised cradle attaching the engine and running gear to the alloy chassis, this is gonna be unbolted and wheeled to the skip / ebay! and then a new one made from scratch. The guy doing it does this kind of thing for a living, it's no bodge it DIY special.

I completly agree with what's been said with regards to it being a barmy project but at the end of the day, it's this guy's car to do with whatever he sees fit, if he wants a scoob engine and is prepared to pay, that's what he's gonna get! Personally I'd of cut my losses when the car was written off, he however has gone further in and has been left with two choices, spend over the odds and have a standard car or spend a bit more and have something unique! As far as handling goes, I have no worries about that whatsoever

Gary C

Ah, it is a damaged car. Oh well. Let us see some pics when its finished. It will be unique to say the least.

Was the original engine destroyed, I believe those engines cost a fortune (~£8k ?), im sure some elise drive would love it.

I take it you are not worried about the handling, as you won't be driving it ?

BOB.T

The engine is fine, I dunno what will happen to it Are they a bit whizzy, I thought they were just the Rover VVC thing with a big airbox, I've never really looked!

I'm not worried about the handling because that's what my mate does, design suspension gubbins

johnfelstead

There is a lot more to handling than suspension gubbins Bob.

Gary C

The VHPD engine does not have the VVC head and can give 190hp and rev to 8k.

A bare second hand engine sells at about 5K.

With 190hp, the elise sport190 hits 60 in 4.4s,100mph in 10.72secs and the 340R is lighter, think what it will do with 300hp

johnfelstead

wheelies with all that weight up back?