SDB

The Lotus and Scooby are chalk and cheese.

I can't help you with the everyday usage, but the driving experience is so different to the scoob.

When you sit in one, you feel like a racing driver, the small steering wheel and bare alluminium everywhere (mmmmm ) just makes you feel like the car has one purpose.

They are not as quick as a scooby in a straight line and will not cope with the bumps quite as well, but put them on a smoothish twisty road and the elise stands a good chance of whooping scooby but.

The corner like very few cars on the planet, the famed Lotus handling (of which I am a HUGE fan) is ever present.

But..

It IS a Lotus.

If it is an everyday car, I personally think I would get bored of the lower straight line power. But you could never get bored of the top-off summer country road effect.

And they look the muts.

I am soon to be running an 'Inside Information' section on

david

Guys,

For some time now I've been considering buying a rag top, and for me, the only one that holds any interest is the Lotus Elise. I'd probably go for a second hand one (99S and newer, not sure whch model though) but I would like to hear your views on the comparison of an Elise to an Sti V which I drive.

The things I'm most interested in are everyday usage and the relative performance (gains losses) to a version V.

Cheers

Dave

chuckster

David,
I have a mate with an Elise and he raves about it. However it has been involved in 2 accidents :
1 - Supermarket car park, car backed into him, time for repairs - 6 weeks.
2 - Vectra runs into back of him at junction, time for repair - over 2 months.
Neither accident very big but highlights the fact that Lotus is a small company and lead times for parts can be huge!
Might need to take this into account when considering everyday usage! ( He lost all last summer in garage )
Also, how much are you going to save buying one less than a year old? Considering you will almost certainly use the warranty I'd go for new.
Cheers,
Charles

RichB

The only thing I am really jealous of my friends Elise is the fuel economy (30+mpg). He is jealous of the STis power, similar road holding, brakes that work when its wet, headroom, noise, boot, air con, decent stereo, 4 seats, 4 doors, towing capabilities and of course cup holders.
Depends what you want, he doesn't have the roof off very much anyway and it sounds like a hairdryer but it does feel like a 'sports' car. I wouldn't swap my STI for it....

RichB

One other thing, you can hire Elises for the day or weekend from the dealers and I think if you buy a new one you get this money back (they used to do it at Haydons in Salisbury). Worth a go to see if you can live with it.
I found it difficult getting in and out the drivers seat with the roof on but then again I'm a fat git.

Yex

I'm with Chuckster on this - a friend of mine has had an Elan and and Elise both of which he enjoyed thoroughly, but only when they were on the road.

He made a warranty claim on each, can't remember what for, and Lotus took ages to get the parts to the dealers. On the upside both cars were fun to drive and delivered the driving experience he was looking for.

However, as the old adage goes:

Lots
Of
Trouble
Usually
Serious

Happy motoring whatever your choice

Yex

Don Key

Lads,

I reckon the Elise is very capable but you need to be thrashing it 100% of the time to enjoy. The power delivery is very smooth and although it keeps on going all the way to the red, there is no tremendous sense of acceleration as with the turbo. Strangley I thought such a low, stretched out driving position would make speeds feel much higher and be pretty exciting but I did not really get that. This is based on just one Elise test drive(111S), but I think it would be wicked on a track. Think of the STI as a sledge hammer - instant fun, adrenaline rush, sheer power etc. Think of the Elise as a scalpel, the enjoyment is in applying skill, learning the craft, ultimately a neater tool but just not a buzz. The dogs danglies would be to get the Elise and then visit Turbo Technics - might think of that as a Samurai sword??- I think I better knock this analogy on the head....

Don

RoShamBo

iTrader: (1)

Bell & Colvill in Surrey had an Elise Turbo jobby with over 200bhp a while ago (I think they modify them themselves) - now THAT would be fun ..... !

Anyway - cant understand why they take so long to fix - all you need is some superglue & silver paper......

Ro

[This message has been edited by RoShamBo (edited 08-05-2000).]

Don Key

Dave

Check out this guy's homepage, he seems to take love of his Elise beyond the platonic and has also interstingly ordered a Scooby. He keeps a web diary of every day he drives the car. Although a bit obsessive, I found this a good insight into Lotus ownership when I was looking at one (only I didn't bother in the end)

sickboy

I drove one at Silverstone and thought the handling was great.

I think it's always difficult to separate the excitement of the car from the fact it isn't YOUR car your thrashing around in

There's no way I could live with the impracticality and prefer the Scoob overall.

They are chalk and cheese though.

Drove a rag-top TT the other week. It was put together beautifully (not so sure in the engine bay) and gripped fantastically. It was not as quick as the Scoob (it was 225 model too) and once again totally impractical.

A mate calls them "toy cars".

boomer

The Elise is a lovely car, but i am not sure about getting one for "everyday usage" (unless you have another car as well).

There is almost zero storage in the drivers compartment, and very little in the "boot". Getting in and out with the roof on takes a bit of getting used to, and is even worse for the passenger.

However, reliability is actually pretty good. A friend of mine has just come back from a round trip to Spain, and despite some quite high continuous speeds, there was not a single problem in three thousand miles (over four days!). Not bad for a skateboard?

mb

GranTurismo

Hello,

A friend of mine has one of the new sport 160's. he will be writing a review on Piston heads (I will try to find out when)This car is much better than the previous standard elise he had before, howevr even the standard one was a close match for most scoobies who followed him (apart from when it was damp)

david

Thanks for all the replies guys, interesting reading.

I have a test drive booked on Saturday for the 160R (the actual one that appeared in last months EVO) and this I hope, will but everything in perspective.

I am not going to buy a new one, I am looking for something around 20K (second hand 111S or 135) with the intention of only using it for about 15 months. Why? because I want to have some fun with a car between now and when I have kids, I get married a week on Saturday, the other half wants kids almost straight away so if I can get myself a good deal on a second hand Elise and reduce my monthly outgoings for a year or so and then, when babies arrive and we need another car I'll get a scooby again (who knows what models will be available then?) hopefully I'll be able to put my name down for a limited addition??

Once we have had kids I will need a family saloon, I think now is a great time to drive round in a mid-engine two seater, I don't think I'll get another opportunity

Claire drives our second car (a ford Ka) so if we need to lug anything around at the weekend we can use this, in my opinion with careful packing, you could get enough stuff in the Elise for a weekend away. I travel fairly regularly (over seas a couple of times a year) so I could get a hold all bag in the passanger seat of the Elise no probs.

So, that is the full picture and my thoughts at the moment, still interested in more feedback though, who's actually owned an Elise?

Cheers

Dave

nwemery

Hmm, I answered the "reverse" of this question on the Lotus
mailing list last year, so here is a "reversed" version
of that response.

We have a UK MY99 4 door Impreza Turbo with various Prodrive
mods (inc suspension) and a Elise modified by Minister to give
about 153bhp. I drive the Elise most of the time and my wife
drives the Impreza.

The two cars are very different to drive. The size and weight
of the Impreza has a marked effect on how it reacts to driver input.
Direction changes in the Elise seem lightening quick
when compared to an Impreza. There is almost no body roll involved,
little of the dive and squat of the Impreza and the non-assisted rack
gives so much feedback from the wheels that you can tell exactly what
is going on.

Grip and traction are very good but not up to Impreza standards - it is
rear wheel driver after all. That said, you can have so much more fun
at legal speeds in the Elise because the limits are lower. Oh course, you
do get more temptation... (I'll just floor it out of this 90 left to get
the back end out)

The brakes on the Elise are very good - even now that they have switched
over to iron brake disks (from the MMC ones on earlier cars). They are
un-servoed so take some getting used to, but stop the car on a sixpence
(it only weighs ~700kg after all) and tell you exactly whats going on at
the road surface through the peddle. Fit braided brake hoses and uprated
pads to get the best stopping around...

Performance wise, up to about 80/90, the two cars (with unmodified engines)
perform about the same, but feel totally different. The Elise provides razor
sharp throttle response and instant linear reactions, where as the turbo in
the Impreza makes it seem as if there is a long elastic band somewhere in the
throttle linkage. The lag tends to make it seem as if the Impreza is faster -
you tend to "edit out" the time it takes to spool the turbo up, and then you
get that wallop of acceleration. After a while you learn how to driver round
the lag in the Impreza to some degree... Above 90, the Impreza is faster.

For every day driving, the Elise is fine with a few caveats. You soon
learn how to put the soft top on quickly - it takes a couple of minutes.
You also learn that it leaks at the top front corner of each side window
when the car is stationary. For every day use in the UK, I think a hard-top
is essential. I also think a garage is essential for over-night parking.
Getting in and out of the car is quite difficult, especially with the top
on. I have a removable steering wheel - it make all the difference.
The seat in the standard car seem rather thinly padded, but in reality
are very comfortable. Boot space is quite good, but access to it is terrible.
I regularly put my laptop and brief case and all the junk my 11 year old son
takes to school inthe boot...

So, the Elise is a cracking little car that give much fun at legal
speeds. I think an Impreza makes an ideal 2nd car :-)

--Nick

P.S., the standard (non-VVC) Elise is a far better starting point if
you want to tune your car so that it goes faster that the Impreza above
90...

bigdave764

I too am an ex-Scooby owner who is considering getting an Elise.

I had to sell my Impreza simply because I am currently covering around 600 miles a week and I was spending crazy money on petrol - so a Passat TDi was the unfortunate (but altogether more comfortable) replacement. I am now in the position of being able to afford a weekend car and so I am trying to decide between spending 30-35k on an Elise (Sport 160 or 190 plus a supercharger fitted) or possibly one of the manic Caterham R500s. As a second car, practicality is less of an issue, but it would be nice to do weekends away in it.

Has anyone on here actually driven both a Caterham and an Elise for comparison?

I will probably try to hire each for a couple of days to see which I prefer.

Dave

blubs

Big Dave,

If its any help I have driven both a Caterham and Elise. The Caterham/Westfield scenario definately gives the bigger adrenalin rush. Even the 1.8 (rover?) engined one I drove was as quick as sh*t and gripped like a limpet.

The Elise is still amazingly quick and grippy but with out as much adrenalin. I was a bit disappointed with the buzzy feeble engine note, though it might be easier to live with if your weekends away involve a lot of miles.

Neither of them allow much in the way of suitcase room, but if I had to chose for mostly a weekend fun car then the Caterham/Westfield would be the one.

Hope this helps

blubs

Hope thi

bigdave764

Blubs,

Thanks for this. I too am leaning towards the Caterham R500 because it is ultimately much faster than even a tuned up Elise (unless I spend silly money on it). Its just my missus thinks Caterhams look terrible!

Anyway, we'll probably go for a spin in both and see what we think.

Dave

MorayMackenzie

IIRC, BBR are/have developing/ed a big lotus elise turbo conversion. Apparently the car does the same 0-170mph time as the McLaren F1! This was not just guessed at, apparently McLaren borrowed it and found this out themselves! Now that's a quick car... reliability... well you've bought a lotus, so you don't worry too much about that, do you?

Moray

Smudge

If you're seriously after one, one of my neighbours is selling his. It's in a sort of bright "caramel" yellow, on a "W" plate, and it's got the sports exhaust, so it sounds grrrrrrrreeeat.

No idea how much he's after, but he's selling it 'cos he wants something a bit less heavy on the pocket, and he was given a silly deal to take it when he traded in his old Elise. (No sports exhaust, he also said it sounded like a hair dryer!)

Location - Leeds

Smudge

tiggers

I have owned my Elise (standard not 111s) for two months now and also still have an Impreza (MY00 UK 4dr). So which one is my favourite - well that's difficult as it depends on so many things.

If it's raining or I'm tired I get in the Impreza and everything about the car makes me happy - it is just the best thing for getting from A to B (with the exception of an STi of course).

If the sun's out I get in my Elise and it feels the closest to a single seater racing car from any road car I've ever driven. It's seriously quick on the windy country roads, but you have to thrash it to get the best out of it. I simply adore it in the right conditions and wouldn't be without one now.

So here's my best effort at the pros and cons of each

Elise

Pros - looks, handling, feel, noise (sports exhaust), every one looks at me (yes even some women), 35mpg or better

Cons - no ABS, no 4wd (not a problem, but just don't forget), nowhere to put anything, fiddliest soft top in history, getting in and out with the roof on is akin to entering your house via the letterbox, you find yourself doing stupid things like taking your laptop to work without it's case so you can shoehorn it in to the boot.

Impreza

Pros - safe, fast, traction in wet, 4 can sit comfortably (well as long as I don't paly at Richard Burns on the country roads), it has a boot, staggering point to point ability in all weathers, some people still don't realise how fast they are.

Cons - car feels huge after Elise as does steering wheel, image (most people think you're a yob these days), Max Power boys are moving in fast, pose value not as high as it once was, doesn't involve you as much as the Elise, you can't take the roof off (well you can, but it's even more fiddly than the Elise to get back on - welding rig etc.)

Hope this helps a little,

Go for it - you won't regret it.

Regards,

tiggers

david

Thanks guys, keep em coming...

A little story,

My car was at Leda today having a few adjustments to the suspension setup (and for those that are interested, it is now completely sorted, and that's rich coming from me who is very **** about these things, Thanks Pete!) and I had the pleasure (NOT!) of driving Pete's Trooper. I had to do quite alot of running around getting wedding things sorted and I picked my scoob up from Leda last night.

I find it quite amazing that after only two(ish) days of not driving my car, when I get back inside, it still amazes me how good it feels. OK, driving a Trooper you are about 12' in the air and in the scooby you are not quite as high, but even down to the clutch feel and the tightnes of the gear change, things you take for granted everyday, it's incredible how quickly one gets used to the quality of the scooby and take things for granted.

I'd only been in the car about 2 minutes and I found myself asking the question "can I part with this for an Elise?" my immediate answer was no, but then I remembered why I want to change to something different and less expensive on a monthly basis, and I came out with the same old argument that it could be worth giving an Elise a try, even if it is only for 12 to 15 months.

One things for sure though, I will only get the Elise if I get an outstanding deal on my car from the dealer (part ex), If I'm not 100% happy I will be walking away in the knbowledge that I still have one of the best ars on the road

RoShamBo

iTrader: (1)

one of the best ars on the road.....????
Now you are just boasting....!!!

Ro (sorry!)

david

nwemery

You advise a standard Elise over a 111S or a Sport 135, I'm not that bothered which is faster than a scoob over 90, but what, in your opinion is the best of the three? I think I'm correct in saying that the 135 has more extras, driving lights, better suspension etc etc?

I had a long chat with a friend who has driven a standard Elise for almost 1 year, he loves it, commenting that there are no leaks from the soft top, he managed a week in France with his grilfriend and had no probs with luggage space (plan carefully, no probs) and his car has only been off the road for 1 week (dodgy radiator). I'm more and more swayed (after you responses and various other peoples opinions) to actually get one, the test drive tomorrow should help me decide.


Cheers

Dave

david

nwemery

You advise a standard Elise over a 111S or a Sport 135, I'm not that bothered which is faster than a scoob over 90, but what, in your opinion is the best of the three? I think I'm correct in saying that the 135 has more extras, driving lights, better suspension etc etc?

I had a long chat with a friend who has driven a standard Elise for almost 1 year, he loves it, commenting that there are no leaks from the soft top, he managed a week in France with his grilfriend and had no probs with luggage space (plan carefully, no probs) and his car has only been off the road for 1 week (dodgy radiator). I'm more and more swayed (after you responses and various other peoples opinions) to actually get one, the test drive tomorrow should help me decide.


Cheers

Dave

nwemery

I've only driven a Sport 135 once, and it is certainly better that a standard car. The big plus for me is the close ratio gear box which is better suited to the engine than the standard box.

I've never driven a 111S, so can't really coment on the car itself. But the standard car is certainly a much better base from which to start tuning an Elise...

Of course, these days you need to consider the Sport 160 (but only if buying new).

david

Cheers Campbell

Just waiting for someone to buy my car before decidimg which Elise to get.

I had a test drive in a 2 year old standard Elise with sports exhaust and no cat, I was quite impressed with the way it drives. Completely different experience from the scoob, and just as much fun (if not more).

My ideal choise of Elise would be the 111S, but I don't think my budget will stretch to a new one, so 2nd hand looks the way forward, the dealer I am speaking to gives a full Lotus warranty on all second hand cars.

Someone PLEASE buy my car

Dave

Campbell

I run a standard Elise, and my gf has a 5 door MY99 UK Turbo. Lucky us.

Anyway, David, most of what needs said on the Elise has been covered here. Just a couple of nuggets from me:

- All variants (Standard, 111S and Sport 160) can generally be spec'd up with some options, although the 111S has a few added to its standard features list. Whatever, ensure you have Driving Lights and a Radio Kit (if only for RDS traffic messages, don't expect much from the hi-fi *whatever* you try to do to improve it!).

- Also look seriously at a hardtop. £1300 or so new, a bit more if retro-ordered, but well worth it to turn the car into a long distance coupe cruiser. Really cuts the wind noise. And will return up to 45mpg on a steady 70mph motorway cruise.

- We've been round Europe for two and half weeks with the Elise, and only had to wash a couple of T-shirts en route! Trick is to pack in camping stuff bags or compression sacks, that way you can use all of the (surprisingly large) boot area. Cabin space can be cleverly packed too if you try hard enough.

- To remove the hairdryer engine note, add some form of sports exhaust. The Lotus Janspeed item is a bit raspy for my taste (and is £500 or so too!); but there are some great Stainless Steel items for £300, eg, Magnex, Motobuild. I have kept the std exhaust but added a Cat Replacement Pipe, and this actually adds enough rort for me right now.

- It helps to have a garage to keep it out of the worst downpours, but a showercap is a good buy - Lotus do an expensive one (as ever) but cheaper versions are available from £70 or so IIRC.

- the warranty *will* be used, unless you get a very well sorted year-old car (mine, for example, but it ain't for sale...yet!). So buy new if you can. Plenty good deals around now and not a big waiting list, I believe.

All in all - just do it! You may not get the opportunity again, and I promise you, you will regret it otherwise :-)

If you want to see some further lively Elise debate, check out

Nightmare

David,

DO NOT buy the 111s.... the 160 sport has now superceded it, and for a mere £1000 more is a significantly better buy. The 111s just doesnt have the performance hike over the standard to justify the extra 4 grand, whereas the 160 IMHO does. Most elise owners tend towards the standard +135 conversion being the best elise (though this was before the 160) - the 111s isnt.

Just thought I'd throw that one in

Night