280 BHP MY01
13 September 2001, 07:58 PM
#1
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How do I do it.
Got a standard MY01 at the moment. It's loosning up nicely and goes very well.
This has got me thinking. The more miles on the clock the more urgent the car seems to come. It's got me starting to want to mod it becuase to release it's full potential. I know that there is more to car than just pure BHP but it's a good starting point.
When driving through the gears the car starts pulling quite hard at just under 3k revs. Then it pulls a lot harder from 4.5K all the way to about 6.5k.
4.5K seems a nads to high for the start of the powerband.
I want to increase the amount of torque and bring it further down eariler down the rev range.
PPP will take the car to 245BHP Right. How can I take it to 280BHP and make it launch earlier down the rev range.
Oh and keep my warranty... Don't want much do I
[This message has been edited by vmax (edited 13 September 2001).]
Got a standard MY01 at the moment. It's loosning up nicely and goes very well.
This has got me thinking. The more miles on the clock the more urgent the car seems to come. It's got me starting to want to mod it becuase to release it's full potential. I know that there is more to car than just pure BHP but it's a good starting point.
When driving through the gears the car starts pulling quite hard at just under 3k revs. Then it pulls a lot harder from 4.5K all the way to about 6.5k.
4.5K seems a nads to high for the start of the powerband.
I want to increase the amount of torque and bring it further down eariler down the rev range.
PPP will take the car to 245BHP Right. How can I take it to 280BHP and make it launch earlier down the rev range.
Oh and keep my warranty... Don't want much do I
[This message has been edited by vmax (edited 13 September 2001).]
13 September 2001, 08:07 PM
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280bhp is going to be a tad optimistic without spending serious money and it would be impossible to keep your warranty.
I would start with a full decat exhaust. My personal preference would be for the scoobysport one. Next on the list would probably be the induction but I know little about this only having an ITG filter.
After that you are looking at more serious money for new ecu and front mount intercoolers and then engine rebuilds with stronger internals.
The only way to guarantee keeping your warrantee is PPP.
By the way does PPP stand for Pay Prodrive Prices?
I would start with a full decat exhaust. My personal preference would be for the scoobysport one. Next on the list would probably be the induction but I know little about this only having an ITG filter.
After that you are looking at more serious money for new ecu and front mount intercoolers and then engine rebuilds with stronger internals.
The only way to guarantee keeping your warrantee is PPP.
By the way does PPP stand for Pay Prodrive Prices?
13 September 2001, 08:39 PM
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I'm just exploring what options are available to me.
One of the lessons in goal setting is always aim high. 280bhp seems high enough... This means I should attain about 260.
Doesn't a scoobysport kill your warranty then.?
One of the lessons in goal setting is always aim high. 280bhp seems high enough... This means I should attain about 260.
Doesn't a scoobysport kill your warranty then.?
13 September 2001, 08:46 PM
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Re scoobysport exhaust and warranty. It seems to depend on who your dealer is and how much of the exhaust you have. If you just have the backbox it would be very hard for IM to refuse an engine claim, however if you have the downpipe it "may" be a different story.
You could of course fit the whole scoobysport exhaust and then refit the original if you ever need to go in for warranty work. Not that I am condoning such an underhand trick
You could of course fit the whole scoobysport exhaust and then refit the original if you ever need to go in for warranty work. Not that I am condoning such an underhand trick
13 September 2001, 09:47 PM
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Some dealers are helpful when it comes to warranty issues if you have a downpipe/exhaust fitted, but an induction kit would probably be pushing it. Dealer might be more sympathetic if you get them to fit it? If you add this to PPP, you could have decent power, but when I last heard Scoobysport were still to test the safety of MY01 PPP with DP. On the old model, PPP & DP is a beautiful combination, good for 270bhp if you believe some dynos. It certainly feels as quick as an unmodded P1.
13 September 2001, 10:01 PM
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Have a look here, they have lots of upgrades for new and old shape impreza's including a 360bhp upgrade for the new STI.
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14 September 2001, 12:26 AM
#9
Pete,
I am confused - you talk about retard when I was under the impression more advance results in increase power - providing fuel quality , charge temp and adequate fuel quantity is supplied.
I am confused - you talk about retard when I was under the impression more advance results in increase power - providing fuel quality , charge temp and adequate fuel quantity is supplied.
14 September 2001, 12:42 AM
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John... what sort of info?
Rob... quite right, but the 01 sets itself very optimistic timing targets and then retards from these to its safe maximum, based on feedback from a sensitive knock sensor, a wideband lambda sensor and an EGT sensor.
An efficient exhaust will aid exhaust gas removal, lowering EGT and either allowing more timing advance or reducing the amount of fuel needed for charge cooling/quenching. Either will result in better burn efficency, which equals more power/torque.
Rob... quite right, but the 01 sets itself very optimistic timing targets and then retards from these to its safe maximum, based on feedback from a sensitive knock sensor, a wideband lambda sensor and an EGT sensor.
An efficient exhaust will aid exhaust gas removal, lowering EGT and either allowing more timing advance or reducing the amount of fuel needed for charge cooling/quenching. Either will result in better burn efficency, which equals more power/torque.
14 September 2001, 09:33 AM
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John
I thought I had posted the test results
The standard ECU typically runs at 7-8 degs of retard (from its optimistic target), when the exhaust is standard too.
The PPP increases boost to 1.2 bar and adds some fuel. Its a tad crude, but very effective and safe.
Fit a Scoobysport full system OR a PPP and the knock retard goes to 8-9 degs (both give similar outputs).
Fit both, together, and it goes to 11 degs.
Too close to the 12deg limit for our liking.
So what we did was look at the front, manifold cat. It severely restricts the removal of exhaust gas from the cylinders. Incomplete exhaust gas removal is common to all engines, some exhaust gas always stays and gets mixed with the fresh intake gas. But the more there is, the less efficient the next burn and the hotter the gasses are before they are compressed by the piston cycle. The hotter the gas, the more likely it is to pre-detonate. To compensate, the ECU backs off timing and pumps more fuel in. Although the car was noticeably quicker, with the full system and PPP, the numbers told us it was obviously not as good as it could be.
So what we did was design a replacement for the front cat.
Instantly, this reduced the PPP and full Scoobysport set up to 8-9 degs retard.
This set up adds 19bhp to the standard PPP set up and 18lb of torque, according to the tests done by two owners at PE. That said, PPP torque was well down on that claimed in then promo info (240lb, not 261lb)
And boy, do they fly
I thought I had posted the test results
The standard ECU typically runs at 7-8 degs of retard (from its optimistic target), when the exhaust is standard too.
The PPP increases boost to 1.2 bar and adds some fuel. Its a tad crude, but very effective and safe.
Fit a Scoobysport full system OR a PPP and the knock retard goes to 8-9 degs (both give similar outputs).
Fit both, together, and it goes to 11 degs.
Too close to the 12deg limit for our liking.
So what we did was look at the front, manifold cat. It severely restricts the removal of exhaust gas from the cylinders. Incomplete exhaust gas removal is common to all engines, some exhaust gas always stays and gets mixed with the fresh intake gas. But the more there is, the less efficient the next burn and the hotter the gasses are before they are compressed by the piston cycle. The hotter the gas, the more likely it is to pre-detonate. To compensate, the ECU backs off timing and pumps more fuel in. Although the car was noticeably quicker, with the full system and PPP, the numbers told us it was obviously not as good as it could be.
So what we did was design a replacement for the front cat.
Instantly, this reduced the PPP and full Scoobysport set up to 8-9 degs retard.
This set up adds 19bhp to the standard PPP set up and 18lb of torque, according to the tests done by two owners at PE. That said, PPP torque was well down on that claimed in then promo info (240lb, not 261lb)
And boy, do they fly
14 September 2001, 01:35 PM
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Pete - I was meaning what sort of ignition retard the MY99/00 PPP runs with/without a downpipe - ie how near to maximum retard does it get so how safe? Like the figures you've given above for MY01.
14 September 2001, 05:11 PM
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VMAX,
MY96 UK
Magnex manifold to backbox, no cats.
Superchip running 15.5psi
dynoed @ 278 @ flywheel
cost: exhaust=£700 approx & chip £350 fitted inc vat.
£1000 for 278bhp that could blow up @ any time, nows that's what I call EXITEMENT
shunty
14 September 2001, 10:50 PM
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Sam - handbags @ 12 noon
been vbusy today, hence long time to reply.
I meant from the manifold back over, even I new that mate & I'm not that technical...with cars that is
I once remember asking for a price for a custom made manifold when I was about 19, cost more than twice the price of the car I had
She sounds fantastic with that new downpipe- & pussyless - this means no cats to those of you who aren't that technical
edited cause I've just spilt cider over me keyboard
shunty
[This message has been edited by shunty (edited 14 September 2001).]
been vbusy today, hence long time to reply.
I meant from the manifold back over, even I new that mate & I'm not that technical...with cars that is
I once remember asking for a price for a custom made manifold when I was about 19, cost more than twice the price of the car I had
She sounds fantastic with that new downpipe- & pussyless - this means no cats to those of you who aren't that technical
edited cause I've just spilt cider over me keyboard
shunty
[This message has been edited by shunty (edited 14 September 2001).]
15 September 2001, 07:21 PM
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Sam - what bhp/torque is your motor knocking out
what mods have you done etc
I am getting only 240lbs of torque with ONLY 278 bhp I was expecting more to be honest, torque that is.
Secret AM - do you reckon 278bhp/240lbs is a good figue from 15.5psi??
shunty
[This message has been edited by shunty (edited 15 September 2001).]
what mods have you done etc
I am getting only 240lbs of torque with ONLY 278 bhp
I was expecting more to be honest, torque that is.Secret AM - do you reckon 278bhp/240lbs is a good figue from 15.5psi??
shunty
[This message has been edited by shunty (edited 15 September 2001).]
15 September 2001, 07:30 PM
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What have the lads at Power Engineering ben telling U mate?
278 real horses in a UK spec engine @ 15.5 psi's of boost, with no other mods than a zorst sounds a bit optimistic.
I reckon my scoob is somewhere between 260-270...maybe 280, this is with a VF24, Link with 18 psi's and a fully decatted zorst.
I haven't dynoed it yet, but it's capable of mid 4 0-60 runs (did a 4.85 0-100kph with a crappy change into 2:nd - hit the limiter).
/J
278 real horses in a UK spec engine @ 15.5 psi's of boost, with no other mods than a zorst sounds a bit optimistic.
I reckon my scoob is somewhere between 260-270...maybe 280, this is with a VF24, Link with 18 psi's and a fully decatted zorst.
I haven't dynoed it yet, but it's capable of mid 4 0-60 runs (did a 4.85 0-100kph with a crappy change into 2:nd - hit the limiter).
/J
15 September 2001, 07:34 PM
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Secret - I got a dyno print reading of 278 @ the flywheel & 240lbs from Well Lane.
This is a flywheel reading, did you think I meant @ the wheels??
shunty
This is a flywheel reading, did you think I meant @ the wheels??
shunty
15 September 2001, 08:18 PM
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Secret -
Also, if you have gone to all this trouble, VF24, Link etc, why havn't you dynoed your car?? I couldn't wait to find out the difference, unfortunatly I didn't dynoe the car before it went in so can't compare with previous.
Does this mean that my motor will do a sub 5 second, if I can launch her right?
I did have a new flywheel & uprated clutch fitted as well. I would imagine the new flywheel will make a bit of difference as well?
shunty
[This message has been edited by shunty (edited 15 September 2001).]
Also, if you have gone to all this trouble, VF24, Link etc, why havn't you dynoed your car?? I couldn't wait to find out the difference, unfortunatly I didn't dynoe the car before it went in so can't compare with previous.
Does this mean that my motor will do a sub 5 second, if I can launch her right?
I did have a new flywheel & uprated clutch fitted as well. I would imagine the new flywheel will make a bit of difference as well?
shunty
[This message has been edited by shunty (edited 15 September 2001).]
16 September 2001, 01:51 PM
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Secret Agent Man -
you still havn't answered my reply to your previous statement regarding my bhp??
yet you have replied to other threads in the meantime
Why do u think it is unreasonable to get 280 bhp from a UK spec with my mods?
IMHO - standard uk 210-215bhp, + 40-50 bhp for a superchip = 250 taking the minimum examples then add a fully decatted zorst inc dp, this must be worth an extra 25bhp = 275bhp MIN.
shunty
[This message has been edited by shunty (edited 16 September 2001).]
you still havn't answered my reply to your previous statement regarding my bhp??
yet you have replied to other threads in the meantime
Why do u think it is unreasonable to get 280 bhp from a UK spec with my mods?
IMHO - standard uk 210-215bhp, + 40-50 bhp for a superchip = 250 taking the minimum examples then add a fully decatted zorst inc dp, this must be worth an extra 25bhp = 275bhp MIN.
shunty
[This message has been edited by shunty (edited 16 September 2001).]
