SUNDAY DRIVER

Just been over at the Integrale BBS -I know theres a bit of car bashing goes on here,but nothing like this!-

Puff The Magic Wagon!

iTrader: (2)

Invite them to a joint Track Day

Just been over for a quick spec & I've got to say that they've seen more 22B's than I ever have & that's in 1 thread

LOL

Identity crisis

teknopete

Almost p155ed me pants reading their crap

Wot is an impressa (duh)? at least get the name right b 4 slaggin it

When did a P1 become a WRX ? (duh)

I recon they must b borg, cause goin by the posts they need to get 2gether 4 nuff brain cells 2 think (oops nearly got down 2 their level) Yeah sad bunch of missfits with clapped out motas, lookin 4 social acceptance (an not gettin it)
Like puff sez drag them up2 a track day an we`ll rip the p155 outta them on & off the track

Chris L

Not going to get into this debate (much ) except to say that when owners of probably one of the most fragile cars ever made start preaching about build quality and reliability, then it is truely a strange world Fab cars though, Integrales, always wanted to own one, but got put off by too many horror stories.

Chris

Darren Thompson

I have a very good friend who is an Italian car fanatic who has had more to do with Gralies than any private owner I have met, at one point he had 5 of various flavors and a full works spec Group A EVO 2 he did the European rally circuit with.

When I had the Scooby I took him out in it and he preferred the Scooby and is now in the market for one, he now currently owns 2 Grallies and a WRC spec group N Mitsubishi Lancer EVO 6. They borrowed a well tuned Scooby from a friend nothing to mad and he recons it was faster than the very highly tuned Grale EVO 2 Monte Carlo he had and that thing was moded. Let them have there dreams as every Grale I crossed on last years RAC did not do very well at all.

I still think they are damn good looking cars though and would love to own a good one as a Sunday car.

Darren.

P.S: a small picture of my mates Rally Grale can be found at the top of the page at:

Al Cook

See what you mean!!

Overiding impression is of a 'max power' club of un-educated 'my stories better than yours' juveniles with a huge inferiority complex.

Quite depressing that people can't just enjoy performance cars as a whole without sinking to levels where they gloat at someone elses misfortune in crashing.

Probably more worrying is the fact that seem quite happy to 'race' at the drop of a hat. And reading their stories, they are all fabulous drivers who could easily win the the WRC, if they had the time of course.

I'm sure there are sensible drivers over there. But unfortunately they seem to be in the minority.

Al Cook

In fact I've just posted an edited version of my earlier post over there to see what response I get back.

It was heartining to see that a Scooby Regular who posted similar sycofantic rematks about a gorgeous looking 206 GTI in the 'Members Gallery' got deleted from the thread.

An interesting debate!!

[This message has been edited by Al Cook (edited 05 September 2001).]

slimshady

just read the posts, are these guys for real ...? time for all these integrale drivers to get a reality check... and quickly. seems like they think that all 2 door scooby's are 22b's lol.

HuggyBear

Hi Al Cook,

I take it you have seen my thread on the Integrale forum titled 'Scooby Baiting anyone?'.
This wasn't meant to be a dig at your fine machinery, more like a chance to meet and compare notes on a track day. As the Subaru is such a popular car, it's surprising that many aren't driven on track. Most owners just seem to want to pose and cruise.

I think it would be really good if someone could set up a series of track days all over the country, with the main focus being on homologated group A cars. ( I know there is a group B car club, but the last time I went, none of the 30+ Scoobies went out on track )

Cheers.

AndrewC

Jeez, what they say about Scoobs must be bad, I just went on to grale.net and when I tried to look at the 'evocorner forum' our proxy server informs me that the site is blocked because it contains inappropriate materials, now who ways that computer don't have feelings, this one is obviously trying to protect mine

Andrew...

jon hill

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by HuggyBear:
<B>Hi Al Cook,
As the Subaru is such a popular car, it's surprising that many aren't driven on track. Most owners just seem to want to pose and cruise.
[/quote]


Dont have a scoob myself (so i'm not being defensive ), but i do a lot of track days. At pretty much every day i've been on theres been a bunch of scoobs on track, be it easytrack, circuits own days (castle coombe & donni usually), goodwood. Not quite as ubiquitous as the 7's on track, but getting there

However - i (seriously) have never seen an integrale on a track day

Not saying that they're not a bunch of posers though

jon

sebastian

The integrale and impreza markets are superficially similar but actually quite different. The impreza is a mass-market vehicle which has brought fairly brisk performance within the financial reach of many who were previously condemned to Vauxhalls Cavaliers and Ford Sierras.

The integrale tends to attract a niche buyer who has an established enthusiasm for high performance cars and is a keen follower of automotive and ralling history.They will appreciate the car for it`s aesthetic and emotive qualities as well as its function.

I would suspect the occupational profiles of the owners would be different, reflecting these sensiblities.

jon hill

However, after reading the integrale BB it would appear that the max powerers have graduated to integrales rather than scoobies

Disco

Sebastian, you seem to have a very low opinion of Scooby owners, their tastes, and judging by the cavalier/financial reach jibe their wealth aswell!!! This BBS contain Lawyers, bankers, doctors, mechanics, telesales operators and many many more varied occupations proving its all round popularity. Its not just self-endulged fantasists stuck up their own *****!!!!

I choose to own a Jap WRX because I find it a superb car, not because it is within my financial reach and I dont fancy a Vauxhall.
I could pretty much afford anycar I wanted (Maclaren F1 excluded!!!). However I didn't, says it all really!

I apologise if my tone offends anyone but the attitude of people like that above annoys me greatly!!!

RobWhite

Does anyone think that the comment:
---------------------------------------------
The integrale tends to attract a niche buyer who has an established enthusiasm for high performance cars and is a keen follower of automotive and ralling history.They will appreciate the car for it`s aesthetic and emotive qualities as well as its function.

I would suspect the occupational profiles of the owners would be different, reflecting these sensiblities.

---------------------------------------------
Sounds suspiciously like a rogue comment from an grale driver, who has just joined to post his message?

Did you read the comments that "those 22b's are'nt that quick," **** whats he driving a rocket.

Rob

wall

In Italy "unfortunately" the beautiful Integrales are quite common. Consequently, while pristine sub-20000 miles examples still cost anything up to £20k, and are driven by genuine amateurs, you can get your hands on some still beautiful machinery around 40000 miles+ for around £8k. This unfortunately puts them in local Elaborare territory (Elaborare being the local title comparable to MaxP).
Sadly we are therefore subjected to the sight of stunning Integrale Evos brutally slammed on handling-ruining springs, sporting odd lights and tacky add-ons, and with obnoxious too-loud music being played on massive stereo systems by a car-full of 20y.o. italian boys with baseball hats doing burnouts and trying to race everybody. Mind you, most of them are uninsured (other than basic compulsury 3rd party), as comprehensive cover here costs a fortune (it would cost them around £4k per year).

wall

Adam M

This kind of crap really annoys me.

I love integrales. They have always looked awesome and definitely have italian blood in them. I dont blame the cars in this case, but the narrow minded owners.

But then I obviously fit into a demographic of mondeo vectra buyers who have been generoussly given the chance for some speed for little more money. I clearly know nothing about cars and am not an enthusiast.

But then not being an enthusisast, I know nothing about lancias legendary reputation for build quality. They obviously won the JD power survey fives years running. But then the italians have always been noted for their engineering and reliability, fiat for example, or maserati, all famously reliable.

I wish those damn awful japanese manufacturers would sort their cars out. Honda, nissan, mitsubishi, toyota, all have no idea how to make a car properly.

I have never seen a worse case of pots calling kettles black.

Having driven a 22B for a year, even in going to meets involving others, I have never crossed one on the road. I can't believe how many these people have seen. And to call them slow?

Ask anders how slow his car is, or craig hardman. or me for that matter. Its nice to see some people on that forum can remain objective, but to smile about cars crashing regardless of how stupid tey are being and then joke about drink driving perhaps I am being unfair as most of this rant seems to be directed as just one w@nker's post.

14,500rpm

***edited due to public apology!***

14,500rpm



[This message has been edited by 14,500rpm (edited 05 September 2001).]

Evotion

Umm, lets have an Evoness test..

Scooby Delta Evo

Looks 4/10 9/10
Overall Speed 8/10 7/10
Desirability 8/10 9/10
Kudos/street cred 7/10 8/10
Heritage 5/10 8/10
Sports pedigree 7/10 10/10
Running costs 8/10 6/10
Involvement 7/10 9/10
Origin (Jpn/I) 5/10 10/10
Rarity (UK) 6/10 9/10

Total 65/100 85/100

Conclusion.

Integrale Evo - Cult car, a true 'Great'. Icon of Icons..

Scooby - fast car, almost a 'Great', in fact.
Nicknamed after an ugly, noisy dog.. very apt.

Danny Fisher

Evotion, you forgot to add the 'Need to rebuild' part.

From the friends that have owned them, they need far too much TLC, for a road going performance car.

Dan

Adam M

Evotion,

no one is comparing the cars.

I think you will find that as enthusiasts most of us really do appreciate the Intergrale.

I certainly do.

The critism is the crap coming from your bbs.

Hoping peoples cars are written off. Keenly awaiting photos of and being pleased about wrecked imprezas.

Referring to our progression from fords and vauxhalls.

With some exceptions all you have done is blackened the name of a great car with stupidity, ignorance and immaturity.

PS. My 22B is far better looking than any intergrale so

[This message has been edited by Adam M (edited 05 September 2001).]

Disco

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Origin (Jpn/I) 5/10 10/10

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Fiat 146's are from italy it doesn't make them great!!!!

Sith

All this comparing **** is total bollocks.
I couldn't give a damn which is faster on the road / track. On the road one is most likely going to have the advantage 'cause he knows when he's going to boot it. The other person has to react.
On the track alot comes down to driver skill and nerve.
'Grale's have a reputation for falling to bits all the time. To the owners /enthusiasts they don't care. Scoob MY98's have a rep for chocolate pistons. Do these owners / entusiast care? NO. Each love their cars. Some can appreciate each others, while some will never even consider anything else.

Personaly I like the 'Grale's. But I love the Scoob. It's aggresive stance, the lines and the curved boot and light clusters.

Why the hell can't some people agree to disagree.

And to the person? that made the statement about the rolled P1, I hope that was a joke, otherwise, grow up and be pathetic in the dark hole from which you climbed. I wouldn't wish that sort of thing on anyone.

Another thing, I've had a string of Vauxhalls before. If I had bought a 'Grale and let this be known on your board, would this have made me some kind of diseased outcast, not fit for a 'grale because of my previous automotive history.

Rant over.

P. (Had a Supersize coke, probably explains my rant. )

BarryWaterhouse

OK chaps - calm down!! I run a garage specialising in Integrales so I admit I am biased. I contribute regularly to the Evoforum on Delphi.com and I admit that there have been some fairly senseless posts there. I haven't trawled through the thousands of messages on the Scoobynet forum but I suspect there have been one or two tastless comments here as well. It seems to me that whenever people are behind a keyboard their character changes and there is a very strong tendency for Dr.Jekyll to become Mr.Hide.

One of you mentioned that you had never seen Integrales at track days - well all I can say is that obviously we have not been doing the same events because the ones I have attended have always included at least 10 Deltas.

There was a Subaru at the Lancia Motor Club track day at Goodwood last year and he was going pretty well - 1.36 was his best time which was faster than most of the 'grales. He did have 310 BHP though (not Power Engineering BHP by the way) and some pretty fancy Willwood 6 pot brakes on the front. He also came to our track day at Castle Combe in September but unfortunately ran a big end.

I totally agree that we should try and arrange a Subaru/Lancia track event when I am sure that a good many friends will be made and each side can see that the other is not the crowd of bigots that they appear now.

Anyone want to organise it?

nyssa7

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Disco:
<B>
Fiat 146's are from italy it doesn't make them great!!!!

[/quote]

What's a Fiat 146? Oh you mean an Alfa Romeo - and to think you Scooby guys complain that we don't know our P1s from our WRXs

Another of them damn Lancia people!

Disco

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by nyssa7:
<B> What's a Fiat 146? Oh you mean an Alfa Romeo - and to think you Scooby guys complain that we don't know our P1s from our WRXs

Another of them damn Lancia people!
[/quote]

Fiat 126, sorry m8, it was a typo, do you do typos on your BBS or are you all too clever for that?????

CELL

Is there a spy in here?
Where are all these biased delta drivers coming from?

sebastian

There`s only one way to settle this:
An inter-forum scrap!

All meet at Mile End Tube Station this Saturday at 3pm. No knives or other weapons.

Evotion

Ha. LOL. Good spot Mr. Y10.


There cannot be any argument that, on the whole, Italians make more 'eve' like cars than the japanese....

At least the Italians put it right.
The new 147 is IMHO extremely horny.
Whereas the new Impreza is step backwards..

Have to admit (darn) the 22B does indeed look the nuts. If all imprezzas looked that way, involved you like a Delta Evo and were Italian marque badged then no other car would come close.

I was being 'mildly' facetious earlier..
The Lancer and scooby are undeniably desirable.. just not by myself.

The crashed comment was ,I am sure, harmless sniping. Laughing at others misfortune is an English humour favourite ..like the Germans faces on saturday nite.
No one ever wants anyone to get hurt.

So whens this meeting then...

adamrj

OK, OK, OK. This is a public apology. I'm sorry. It was a crass comment and no, I didn't mean it. I'd have hoped that anyone who read it would have taken it in the vein it was intended, but then I didn't realise half of Scoobynet would read it.

As I've said on Evoforum, I don't know anything about Imprezas, but from what I've seen and read of them I'm not particularly impressed. This is just personal taste, what this whole thing is all about in the end.

And yes I'd be delighted to be enlightened. I may be biased, but I'm nevertheless always open minded. So many people can't all be mistaken, and if they all drove Grales, it would make the Lancia a far less special car.

One thing this has done is possibly brought Lancia owners and Subaru owners a little closer together. I'm sure you'll find that never before have so many Lancia owners joined this forum and vice versa on the Lancia forum!

So once again sorry.

Adam