Yosser

Nothing to do with Cars people but could do with some advise from any legal eagles out there.
I had my locker broken into last night at the Gym.
Mobile Phone, Palm V, Wallet etc etc.
Reported it to staff there - I also have a police crime number etc. All cards stopped/Phone cancelled etc etc.
It is a council gym and they have signs everywhere that they take no responsibility for anything - usual stuff - Staff employees.
Someone has said that these sorts of posters are actually meaningless and they have to accept some liability.
The house insurance will cover the articles but there is a £50 excess (+ what it will cost me nest year when they put the premiums up) - Is there anyway I get this money out of the council????? and what liability do they have?
Thanks
Michael


[This message has been edited by Yosser (edited 08 August 2001).]

JoeyDeacon

Don't worry I am certain the Police will catch the person who did this and will not be out giving people hassle for driving with their front foglights on. (That that I am bitter or anything)

Brendan Hughes

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:<HR>Originally posted by Yosser:
<B>It is a council gym and they have signs everywhere that they take no responsibility for anything - usual stuff - Staff employees.
Someone has said that these sorts of posters are actually meaningless and they have to accept some liability.[/quote]

IIRC they are meaningless for death or serious injury (Unfair Contract Terms Act 197?7) but that doesn't help you. You should also be aware of the terms before you sign the contract, (ie no good if they are only inside), but being a regular at the gym I guess you've seen them before so you can't claim that one. Not too keen on your chances, but keep trying.

JoeyDeacon: maybe the police have young kids and shop at your local supermarket? The Lord works in mysterious ways, I'm told!

BJH

Tiggs

as i recall (from my days working in a gym) those signs are pointless in the sense that they cant claim they wont accept responsibility if they are liable for it-

eg. if they leave a mop out and you fall over it then that was their fault and they cant deny it.

in your case you would have to show they were at fault which i guesse would be tricky as they did all they could resonably be expected to do- provide lockers.

tiggs

Yosser

I suppose that if I could prove that there had been a few incidents (there was one at the exact time that I was done) I could say that the signs should be stating that thieves operate in this area thus they are not giving enough information that thefts have occoured. So potentially the signs are do not give enough information.
Thoughts?
Michael

Adam M

I am not a lawyer so dont take this as free legal advice, I have merely studied contract law, v briefly.

For a contract between two parties you need an offer an acceptance and consideration. To fight such a thing legally you would need to show whether or not what is written fulfills these conditions.

As in were you aware of such limitations when you decided to place your belongings in the locker etc. Was this sign material to your decision to do it?

On top of this does the contract (or not) have any implied terms that would be typical of such an arrangement or any unfair terms. That is what such things have been argued under before.

In this case it is more, do they owe you a duty of care to maintain the securtity of your belongings? or is the onus on you to make sure the locker is truly locked.

Frankly, to be consulting legal issues on this, it is gonna cost buckets by comparison, and cases in the past have gone either way, making there no clear case law on what to do.

For the sake of it, I would claim on house insurance and swallow the excess. House insurance may go up, but not always, it isnt like car insurance in that respect.

Adam M

have just looked up some cases and chatted to some friends and it appears that the obviousness and size of the sign shiould be directly related to the importance of the warning.

The test case I saw was where a man drove into an old style car park (the ones with lifts for the cars), and drove into the space where the lift would be and fell down the lift shaft in his car!!! There was a sign saying use is at the owners risk, but since it was too small compared with the size of the incident, he received compensation.

unfortunately I would have thought this doesnt give you much to stand on!

Blow Dog

I wouldn't believe a word Adam says.

boomer

Was the locker actually <I>broken</I> into, or did the thief have a duplicate key (thus no locker damage)?

Alternatively, was the locker <I>easy</I> to break into - poor construction/maintenance?

If the gym fails to maintain lockers properly for the purpose for which they are intended - you may have a viable case.

Does your insurance give you legal cover?

Worth chasing, if only so there isn't a "next time".

mb (who has no legal training, so don't believe anything that i say )

Yosser

Intresting
There was no locker damage so it might have been a duplicate key situation.
I challenged them on this earlier and they were not 100% sure that the company maintains them did actually replace the locker locks when a key was lost or just put a duplicate key in place.
I know that I'm going to get nothing out of them - but I feel quite strongly that a few cages should be rattled so they get their act together - I've suggested that they put signs up on each locker advising of thefts - It's a bit of a catch 22 - They do not allow bags into the gym so if you want to change you are forced to use the lockers - yet these lockers are obviously not secure!!

blubell

You could always try a little publicity an article in the local rag, especially if this is not an isolated incident would have a direct impact on revenue so they may be prepared to talk turkey

SCOOP

Bad Luck m8
Just one point to consider.
Take a Photograph.
I tried to make a similar claim some years ago.
My point was that the Warning Signs were too small and badly positioned.
However when the council received a letter from my solicitor they quickly had several new, larger signs made and put up, Sneaky B@rstards!!!!!

Cheers
SCOOP