SiPie

Ok here goes with the idiotic question.

MY99 has been at local dealers for the last week and picked it up last night after having new gearbox and clutch fitted following complete destruction of 3rd and 4th gears. Met with nice bill for £1,490 (out of warranty at 79k) but no real complaints about that.

Gearbox etc great but stopped at 1st junction and realised idling between 200rpm and 1000rpm (engine searching all the time). Called dealer who confirmed that the Air flow sensor had gone. They had swapped it with another scoob's and it ran perfectly but as they didn't have one in stock they put the old one back on and decided not to mention it to me! All seems a bit too coincidental that it was 100% perfect when it went in to the dealers.

Finally.... Here's the question...!

Would a simple knock from a mechanic when doing all the gearbox work be enough to damage this as I would like to know whether I should have to pay for this or not?

Thanks in advance.
Simon

Attu

I guess a simple knock could damage the air flow sensor but as its at the top of the engine i cant see how they could damage it by changing the gearbox but you never know.
If im right in thinking the air flow sensor comes in two parts, the sensor and the housing its mounted it, from what i understand its usual practice by Subaru to replace the whole piece but its alot cheeper to but just the sender unit its self.
Im sure some one will be able to give you the part number.

Andy

SiPie

Thanks Andy

You are correct that it comes in two bits but as yet the dealer only supplies the whole housing attached as well at £100. They did say they would try and find just the new sensor. Couldn't see how they would damage it by doing the box but just seems VERY coincidental.

Cheers

Attu

Just done a quick search and i think 22794AA010 is tha part you need.

Andy

SiPie

Many thanks for that Andy

Appreciated

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

2 2 7 9 4 A A 0 1 0 METER CP-AIR FLOW

this is the part i got for mine £70 incl vat and postage.

BTW i would tell them to replace as the car was working fine before they had it. Why switch with another car, was this during the time they had it or not? If so they could have used your good one on the other car and left you with the knackered one.

The part will prob cost them £50 and given you have jujst spent 1400 with them, i would give them the part number and make them pay for it.

SiPie

P20 SPD

Agree 100% that they should pay but I just wanted to have a bit more info before I started pointing the finger. My thoughts exactly that my sensor is now on someone else's car!!! Mmmm

Cheers for the info

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

Just ask the simple question

Why did you take it off my car whilst replacing the gear box.

Post reply on here and see what comments you get back.

[Edited by P20SPD - 8/16/2002 9:23:53 AM]

SiPie

Already asked that one and it was because it wouldn't idle right when they put the new box in and they wanted to identify (but not fix!) the problem!!!!!!!

Jolly Green Monster 2

Sounds very fishy...

why would they go out of their way to identify a fault with your car, then not tell you or try and extract more money out of you to fix it?

I know you realise that already anyway..

I hate this kind of thing... the car is in for a new gearbox..
if they find something else wrong they should ring and discuss it with you not just switch the part from someone elses car to try and solve the problem, sorry identify it... what was it some kind of ego trip with the dealer.. did they have a bet on what was the cause? muppets..

Like you say I think your sensor is now on someone elses car and they just paid full price for a new one.. or it is on the mechanics car.

JGM

LG John

Don't take there crap!! Your car was running fine (expect for the whole gearbox thing) before it went into them and you want it running just as fine now you've got it back. You've just shelled out £1.5k to them, tell them to get it fixed and fixed NOW!!!!

SiPie

They are doing it tomorrow morning as they've had to order the part....surprise surprise!

Let's just say "They haven't received a penny from me yet". I'll gladly pay the £1490 but only upon receipt of a scoob that actually works!

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

Agree with Saxo Boy, preferably do it in the showroom in quite a loud voice if there are potential customers buying cars.

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

Did they order just the maf or the whole housing??

EvilBevel

Apart from the money for the sensor, the big issue to me would be that they let me have my car back without mentioning the MAF is knackered.

That being an almost sure recipe for blowing up your engine, a totally irresponsible thing to do really. Especially when they admit afterwards they *knew* that it was failing

SiPie

Not sure if it was just the sensor or the whole housing that was ordered (don't care as long as they fix it) but I agree with the fact that they actually gave no warning and the first I knew of it was arriving at the first junction and the thing stalls before my eyes.

Am I right.....? The MAF sensor is the one that sits on the housing from the air filter ? Just they refused to call it the MAF sensor and kept calling it air flow sensor which I thought was the same thing.

This gets better though:-

Dealer (so far un-named) then says it's probably due to the ITG panel filter that I have been using. Now correct me if I'm wrong but is that not exactly what Prodrive used in the past as part of their ppp.
Then it's also because I've been using Optimax in their opinion!!!

And all this after running on Optimax for 3 months and the filter's been in for 5k miles!!!! Then all of a sudden, one visit to the dealer and car = sick.

Just like going to hospital...... you get one thing fixed and nearly die of a 'flesh eating superbug' that you caught whilst you were in there!!!

Must get on and do some work but I'll let you all know what happens....

sexy-blue-scoob

Are you going to mention the garge by name ??

Was it the Subaru dealer on the outskirts of Edinburgh ??

Just like to know these things - just in case a similar incident happens to one of our scoobys.

Thanks

SiPie

Sexy-blue-scoob

YHM

LG John

What hospitals do YOU visit

SiPie

Genito Urinary Medicine ones daily..... just in case you know........!!!!

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

ITG used to be in pre MY99 PPP but dont think they put a filter in the pack for post MY99.

LOL @ could be Optimax. Where on earth does fuel pass the air flow meter

Air flow meter/Mass Air Flow same thing.

I think they are just trying to wriggle out of it. I would tell them you will write to subaru and tell them that they gave you the car back knowing there was a fault. if they are decent dealers, it should scare the **** out of them.

You could ring subaru 1st and just ask them if they expect an official dealer to operate in this manner, without naming names etc.

Attu

ProDrive used to put in RamAir filters pre 99, im not sure that changed them after 99.
ITG filters are about as safe as you can get so i doubt it that thats caused the problem and how can Optimax cause the MAF to fail ??

Andy

SiPie

Sounds a good plan, will give them a quick call and thanks for the info re the ITG filter.

A bit concerned that the dealer never even mentioned.."Oh and by the way we have sent you on your way with a dodgy MAF sensor that could destroy your entire engine"

!!!!!!!!!!!!!

EvilBevel

Just for info: PPP was Ramair pre MY99, no filter on MY99/00 because of different MAF. Prodrive recommends standard paper job.

I can understand Subaru's case for invalidating warrenty on non-standard filters, which doesn't mean I'm saying the ITG caused it.
Good thing to know is that even with standard filters, MAF's are known to go faulty on MY99/00.

But more important indeed is letting you take off with a faulty MAF.

PS: maybe they accidently spilled Optimax on it ?

SiPie

EvilBevel

Thanks for that. I'm awaiting a call back from Subaru UK's technical dept. at West Bromwich on the issue of being sent away with a known faulty MAF.

Thanks for all your info

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

any joy yet??

LG John

In a word NO! I was out with Sipie in his car today and when he pulls up to stop and depresses the clutch she tries seriously hard to stall. He's had the MAF replaced and the mechanics 'borrowed' loads of parts from other scoobies that were in the workshop to try and figure out what is wrong but to no avail!

Sipie is going to continue running the car till Monday and will no doubt report back......watch this space!

P20SPD

iTrader: (1)

to the right of the maf on the intake, there is a tube on the underneath that connects to the fuel vapour cannister. just have a look to see if this connected. it has been known for them to forget, i have done it and so has the garage.

good luck.

Steven

ps just check that all pipes etc appear to be connected that includes the small ones from the turbo.

Oh just had a thought, i wonder if they disconnected the lambda sensor when changing the box, just check to see if thats plugged in. Should be white connector under TMIC leading to downpipe.

Steven

LG John

Sipie texted me saying that his ECU finally seems to have caught up with what's been going on and it's all back to normal. Finally!

P20SPD@Home

Good. Did they not reset the ecu?